Nine of fourteen ceramic pitchers arrive damaged, seller says not his problem

[jdj53]

The seller is claiming it is not his problem, that I needed to buy insurance, which he didn't offer in the listing. How do I put in a claim with eBay? The seller is in Europe and English is not his first language.

[momcqueen]

Was it one lot of 14 items? Or 14 items bought as single items a piece? Take a ton of pictures and open an Item Not as Described case in the Resolution Centre. You'll probably also want to call eBay Customer Service and explain the item(s) arrived damaged so that you're not expected to ship back shards to gain your refund. Do it today, through ebay if you can. It's not the responsibility of the buyer to insure a shipment, no matter what your seller says. It's the seller's problem to ensure the order arrives and does so safely. It will be his prerogative to claim damage from the postal system if applicable. 

[jdj53]

Nine of the fourteen jugs were smashed. He packed them all together piled on top of each other. They were individual auctions. I had no inkling he was going to try to ship them together. I have opened nine Item not as Described claims.

[momcqueen]

Good grief. Be sure to take pictures of how they were packed in the box. 

[pjcdn2005]

Did you buy the pitchers on .ca or .com and did you open the claim on ebay or paypal?

If you opened the claim on .ca or .com ebay you are covered by their Money Back Guarantee which says that a seller has to pay return shipping for an item not as described. If the seller replies with 'return for refund'  it's unlikely that they will be willing to pay for the return. Apparently ebay cannot send you a label when the seller is in another country and the seller can't send one to you through ebay from Germany. If the seller just doesn't reply or refuses the return, then ebay should rule in your favour and you won't have to ship the items back.

If you win the claim and are told to return for refund but the seller won't pay for return shipping, you should wait until ebay says that they 'can step in" and then phone them. You can also ask them to step in without phoning but in many cases it is better to talk to a real person. Explain that you are willing to return but that the seller refuses to pay for return shipping. Also point out to them the area in the money back  guarantee that states the seller is responsible for that shipping cost.  eBay will hopefully refund you without a return since the seller isn't following the MBG.

A disclaimer...I've heard that the above solution works, but I've also heard that it doesn't  always work so be persistent. eBay makes the rules and if the seller isn't willing to pay to have the item pay for the return, then ebay needs to support you.

I realize that when an item is broken it seems pointless to return it but if a seller wants the return, then that is what is supposed to happen.

[snoopwiz]

Insurance is for the seller. Not the buyer.

In spite of your seller's ramblings about you not having purchased insurance, a seller is not allowed to "charge extra" for insurance.

They either include it in the item price or try hiding it in the item sell price.  Or pay out of pocket.

A seller must ensure that the item(s) arrive intact and as described. Period.

Your seller is apparently not aware of this and, once you open the SNAD case as advised above, he/she will learn.

[pierrelebel]

Taking a look at the seller's DSRs, it is quite obvious he regularly has problems.

4.6, 4.6, 4.7, 4.5

Not very impressive!

[jdj53]

Thanks for all the information that you folks have given me. I have opened the Not as Described claim with ebay Canada. It says I can elevate tomorrow. Having never had a claim in the 16 years as a ebay buyer, I'm a rookie at how to proceed. You were all mentioning phoning customer service? Does anyone have the number for ebay Canada customer service, and should I wait until I have asked ebay Canada for help in settling the claim tomorrow?

BTW, the seller continues to insist that there is no warranty with his pitchers, and that he has a no return policy. Will that affect my nine claims?

I don't know why, after seeing the broken ceramic pitchers, why he would want them back. They cannot be repaired or resold the way they are. I have pictures of each smashed jug in my nine Not as Described claims.

I keep seeing a mention of SNAD, does anyone know what those letters mean?

Sorry to be such a pain. The worst part is that I have purchased more jugs from him, that he shipped, before the first box arrived. I'm now feeling like the Sword of Damocles is over my head, waiting for the next box of pitchers to arrive

Thank you all for your comments and help!

[pierrelebel · Accepted solution]

"Will that affect my nine claims?"

No.

The seller is responsible.  Period.  If he wanted or needed insurance, he should have arranged for it and pay for it.

Do not correspond any further with the seller.  There is nothing to gain.

Escalate the claims tomorrow or the following day and wait - patiently - for the refunds to your PayPal account.

Do not leave neutral or negative feedback yet.  The time for that will be once your money has been fully refunded in your PayPal account (no thanks to your seller who is still in denial of his responsibilities)

eBay Canada does NOT have a customer service department.  eBay's customer service is located in the Philippines and in Utah.  There is no need to call customer service at this time.  Let the system do what the system does.

[pjcdn2005]

SNAD - Significantly not as described  

Since the pitchers weren't sold to you as smashed and broken, they are snad.

I agree with Pierre that there is no need to phone customer service at this point.

[jdj53]

Thank you all so much! This is a great community of ebayers!

[momcqueen]

Please do not feel like you are creating a pain. As a buyer, you did what was expected of you: carefully made your selection for purchase and then submit payment. It is the seller who is wanting here both for the woefully inadequate packaging as well as the exceptionally poor customer service. I sell toys, new in their package for the most part, and I still package my items for post as if they are as fragile as a bucket of raw eggs. Please don't let this experience colour your perception of what to expect from ebay. I realize you have many years of experience as a buyer and a vast majority of sellers appreciate that. Especially when large, multiple orders are placed! 

[jdj53]

I have now asked eBay to step in on the nine claims of SNAD. If the seller requests a return, but won't pay for return shipping, is there a number at eBay I can call for customer service? It makes no sense to have to return a bunch of jug pieces from Canada to Austria. Oh, do I use Canada Post or a private shipper like UPS or FedEx if he requests a return? Thanks for all your help!

[pierrelebel]

" If the seller requests a return,..."

You worry too much.  Let's cross that bridge if and when you get there.  In the meantime let the system do what it does.

[jdj53]

You're right! Probably won't hear anything till Monday. Let's enjoy a beautiful weekend,

[jdj53]

Well, here I am back again.

I received emails from two different ebay customer service people. One seems to be handling one claim and another one the, the other eight claims of the nine broken and damaged jugs.

They both seem to be saying that they are putting the claim on hold for five days and he is contacting the seller to quote " make sure that the seller will cover the return shipping costs. The other customer service rep seems to be saying about the same thing, except he is giving the seller five days to send me a return shipping label. Does this mean the seller is obligated to pay for return shipping?  This is all very confusing,as after 16 years on ebay, this is my first claim.

Plus, I have two more shipments of jugs from this guy coming, so God only knows how many of those will be broken. Plus, he is using Google translator because he doesn't speak English

What a horror show! This has certainly made me realize I only buy in Canada, the USA, or the UK from now on.

Just got an email from the seller, offering to settle with the price of the nine jugs, but not nearly the amount I paid for shipping. Should I accept or let ebay do its thing??? Help!!

[pierrelebel]

"Should I accept or let ebay do its thing???"

eBay has given the seller five days (that is standard) to refund you.

Let the system do what it is meant to do: protect you.

As far as the seller is concerned, obviously he now understands his responsibility yet, he is trying to minimize his costs. I would suggest a very short message - through eBay messaging system - "I have filed nine claims with eBay for the total cost of the nine transactions including shipping charges and I expect a full refund, including shipping charges. Thank you"

[momcqueen]

Pierre has it right. If the seller truly wants you to return the shards as a condition of his refund on the SNAD, it is my believe he is then responsible for any and all return postage as it is the fault of the seller in this case that the broken items are SNAD and not a case of 'I changed my mind'. If you had simply decided you didn't want them after receiving them, it would be your responsibility as the buyer to foot the bill for return postage.

All the same, make sure you note in your response to ebay that the amount he is offering you won't cover return postage WITH TRACKING because that is the most important part. If the seller wants his shards back, you will be required to send it back with tracking and within a limited amount of time. That means Canada Post Tracked Packet or Xpresspost. Regular Small Packets Airmail or International Parcel is out.  

[momcqueen]

Oh, wait. You're talking about your original postage. Never mind me! 

[jdj53]

Actually, I am talking about the return of the broken jugs. I'm going to wait the five days and see if the seller has to add to his cost, or settle the claim with just my costs for the price of the nine jugs plus the percentage of postage. I don't want one penny more than I'm out of pocket, but neither do I want to take a loss on something not my fault. The seller didn't package properly, plain and simple. If you saw the box and packaging, you'd wonder how five jugs survived intact.