Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

went4eva
Community Member

I bought a set of Kaplan books for around 300 dollars. The seller listed the item location as California, US but the books were shipped from China. There are strong indicators that the books are not authentic. For example, on the back of the books, Kaplan is spelled wrong as "Keplan". The registered trademark symbols on the covers are missing, which is different from the listing picture. No holograms or ISBN bar codes on the back the books... Lots of printing quality issues inside the book... The list can go on and on. So I listed all the problems, took all the pictures and confronted the seller. Seller insists that the books are authentic even after seeing the pictures and offered to refund me IF I remove the negative feedback. I refused and then further escalated this case to Ebay Resolution Center thinking Ebay will help put a stop to this scam. BUT I was totally WRONG. 

 

Just now I got the notice that Ebay decided the case in favor of the seller. They funded the seller and removed the negative feedback I left. 

 

As suggested by Ebay, I also reached out to Kaplan and still waiting to hear back from them to get a official statement. Dear ebayer, would you help give your opinion how to proceed with this case? How does buyer protection work here?

 

 

 

 

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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

In cases where a buyer accuses a seller of providing counterfeit products, ebay nearly always sides with the buyer. You must have done something completely against the rules in your communication with the seller -- such as feedback extortion -- if this is not the case with your scenario. Or perhaps you ignored the instructions about how to proceed at some critical step. 

 

Follow the advice ebay has given you. Take those pictures to the original company for comment and provide that comment on appeal for ebay to consider.

 

 

Message 2 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Also, your feedback was not removed. Unless you are experiencing a chronic problem with this item. 

 

Counterfeit prints. Shipped from China and not the shipping method advertised.Buyer: 
w***t ( 19Yellow star icon for feedback score in between 10 to 49 
During past year
 Kaplan Schweser CFA Level 1 2016 Study Notes Complete Set (#252532273708)
Message 3 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Are you certain the message you received was actually from ebay and not some kind of phishing scam from a third-party pretending to be ebay?

 

You didn't click on any embedded links in the message, did you?

 

Message 4 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Did you claim  they were 'not as described' . A claim for 'not recieved'  despite the fact that you did not recieve what you expected, would fail. Also a claim out of time would fail.

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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Hi mjwl2006, 

 

Thanks for the heads-up and prompt reply. I went to check and found that the notice emails are also in my ebay msg inbox so they should be real... One email told me that the case is closed and I will not get the refund. Second email states that they have removed the negative feedback I have left on the seller. 

 

And yes, thank you for bringing up that review I left. It is not the one that was taken down. I'm super upset and frustrated this time because this is the SECOND TIME I was conned. The first time, that seller refunded me after I opened the case in Resolution center. He also offered me extra money to take down the negative feedback and suggested that he would just open another account if I don't remove the review. I said no to him and thought this is over. 

 

This time, the seller specifically sent a message after I paid and reassured that the book are 100% authentic. The seller is based in US but the books are sent by his/her partner in China. The alarming fact is that seller told me that after checking with his/her partner in China, I am actually on their list for calling them fraud. SO I am essentially duped by the same people TWICE even though the books are from different sellers. 

 

I have followed Ebay's suggestion to contact Kaplan or local law enforcement. It's been two and half weeks since I raised this problem to Kaplan and I don't know how long it's going to take them to get back to me. I followed up with emails and calls too. They said that they need more time. 

 

The fact that I have invested so much time and energy on this case is very frustrating. With such clear evidence that the books are not authentic, the seller just gets to continue his business intact? How can buyers be protected in cases like this? 

 

Thanks again for taking your time to read over this... I really appreciate your inputs here. 

 

Message 6 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

I left a truthful comment something like "Counterfeits. Kaplan is even spelled as Keplan." I don't think this is an feedback extortion, just facts...

Message 7 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

I'm curious.   I checked out Kaplan books for around $300 and as far as I can tell these are textbooks or books to prepare students for taking various exams like the LSAT etc.

 

Is that what you were trying to buy?

 

Are the books actual copies of the original books?  That is, are the books counterfeits in the sense that your books are copies of originals or are they "bootlegs" in the sense that they are completely different from the originals?

 

These must be heavy.  How much of the $300 was for shipping?

 

I'm not saying that you don't have a case if they are copies of the originals because you do.  I'm just trying to understand your case.

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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!


@went4eva wrote:

I left a truthful comment something like "Counterfeits. Kaplan is even spelled as Keplan." I don't think this is an feedback extortion, just facts...


The sentence you cite is not feedback extortion. Extortion is something different. It would be telling the seller in a message, 'Give me a refund or I'm leaving you negative feedback'. There are very few reasons that ebay would remove feedback and settle in favour of a seller in a case like this so something must have gone very wrong. Did you follow ALL the Resolution Centre case instructions to the letter? If you didn't, the case would automatically close against you.

 

ebay's Feedback Extortion policy http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/feedback-extortion.html

 

ebay's SNAD policy http://pages.ebay.ca/sellerinformation/news/fallupdate2014/ebaymoneybackguarantee.html

 

One other thought, if you think this was the same seller as in the previous case where you received a set of books that didn't match your expectations, you didn't make that claim to the seller in the message, did you? ebay would look at that as a policy violation since it is a suspicion only.

 

All that you can do now is what ebay tells you to do: contact the real publisher and police, and then return to them with your findings to launch an appeal. You'd need to call Customer Service for that. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Message 9 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Hi sylviebee, 

 

Thank you for the feedback. Yes you are right. It's a set of seven test prep books. The shipping was around 50 dollars and the seller was actually really nice at the beginning and shipped it to me super fast. He/she has consistent excellent reviews and it's the reason why I chose him/her. 

 

Five out of the seven books are poor paper quality. In terms of content, there are printing issues like half of the words or page number missing, discolorations and stuff like that. Two of the seven books are actually very good quality. These two book are wider than the rest of the five books and made of better paper too. That's how I got suspicious first. I thought they mixed the fake with real but then I found on the back of those two books, Kaplan was spelled wrong...

 

So my question here is why do we need to spend so much effort to prove something so obvious? For example, if I bought a pair of CHANEL shoes, then I received a pair of shoes with "CHENEL" on it. Why do I need to spend extra time and money to prove they are fake? I don't think this is rocket science that spelling mistakes are strong evidence of counterfeits.

 

Thank you again for your inputs. 

Message 10 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Hi Afantiques, 

 

I think I opened the case "not as described" as a start in the resolution center. I also reported the listing but the listing pictures are actually pictures of authentic books so I don't know how Ebay is going to do with that. The only way to find out it's fake is by buying them first... 

Message 11 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!


@went4eva wrote:

Hi sylviebee, 

 

 

So my question here is why do we need to spend so much effort to prove something so obvious?


Well, we don't.

 

As MJ pointed out, there are only a few reasons why eBay would remove NFB and/or not find a case like the one you describe in a buyer's favour.

 

As she said:  If you threaten to leave NFB UNLESS the seller does something, that's one reason the NFB would be removed.

 

Buyers are also not allowed to demand a refund and keep the item.  While it's not unusual for that to be the final outcome, it's not something you can demand from a seller.

 

Either you crossed some line along the way or the eBay CSR made a huge mistake (which does happen), and if that's the case a phone call should resolve the issue.

 

 

Message 12 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

I left the feedback after I found out all of the books are fake and I even refused to take the refund in exchange to take it down... I certainly didn't do anything close to feedback extortion. 

 

I have called Ebay three times and sent four emails regarding this case. Their conclusion is that I need to obtain an statement from Kaplan to confirm that the books are pirated material, otherwise they can't do anything about it. 

 

The situation now is that Kaplan is taking their time to work on this case. It has always been over 2 and half and weeks and it may take longer. Or they will just never give me a statement. This is not within my control. I have followed up with Kaplan with five emails and call them twice too. Both time over the phone, they told me that if Kaplan is spelled wrong, it's definitely fake. I also got a email reply from them saying that there should be holograms on the back of books, if not they are most likely pirated materials.

 

I have explained everything over the phone to Ebay for all three times so they know everything's that's going on. Below is the policy regarding counterfeit items. It states that when there are strong indicators that the item is counterfeits, they will refund the buyer. If spelling errors of the brand is not even strong indicators, what is?

 

"Counterfeit items

If a buyer suspects that an item is counterfeit, and there are strong indicators that the item is counterfeit, we don't require the buyer to return the item to the seller. The buyer agrees to cooperate with us to ensure the proper disposal of the item. In such instances, we refund the buyer for the full cost of the item and original shipping, and the seller reimburses us for the refund. The buyer may not sell the item on eBay or elsewhere."

Source: http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/money-back-guarantee.html#other-terms

 

 

 

 

 

Message 13 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

I really don't know. It seems like this should have been an open-and-shut case but, for whatever reason, it was not.

 

I cannot fathom a guess as to the reason ebay decided against you without knowing the exact particulars on both sides.

 

All that I can say and that others have echoed is that it is extremely unusual for ebay to decide a counterfeit claim AGAINST the buyer. The extenuating circumstances that led to this are not clear.

 

Keep calling, provide your evidence. That's all we can tell you.

 

 

Message 14 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

What seems to be missing from your description of your failed case is that you are able to prove the return delivery of the questionable books to the Chinese shipper-- or to the US seller.

 

I believe that the return need only be to the seller.

 

However, as previously mentioned, NO REFUNDS WITHOUT RETURNS.

 

EBay won't take a stand on charges of counterfeit products. They leave that up to VeRO members to police their own brands.

 

Returning seven books, even to the USA, is expensive, but is the only way you will get your money back.

https://www.canadapost.ca/cpotools/apps/far/business/findARate?execution=e1s1

 

Through eBay, the seller is required to provide return shipping, and eBay thinks a Return Shipping Label can be sent, although this is not possible if the parties are in different countries.

The buyer is left with returning the fakes to the seller (again not the shipper) on his own dime and hoping that the seller will be ethical enough to refund the return postage.

 

To play devil's advocate here, it is quite possible that the seller has never seen what he is selling . Getting the questionable books back may be a shock to him too. Especially the missing and unreadable pages.

 

Still.

You are still allowed to open a Claim through Paypal.

PP will insist that you prove the return of the books on your own dime.

Offsetting that cost, you have up to 180 from payment to open the Dispute.

 

And finally, you can phone the 1-800 on the back of the credit card you use to back your PP account and ask for a chargeback. Cards are very variable in what they will accept and their deadlines, so there's that.

Message 15 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Yes:  What MJ said.

 

It should have been enough for you to send a photo of your books showing how Kaplan was spelled one way in the listing and a different way for the item you received.

 

Did you send pictures of the books you received showing issues like that in your original complaint?  That should have been enough for a simple item not as described case as opposed to a claim that the books are counterfeit.

 

 

Message 16 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Thanks for all the replies. I have been a Ebayer since 08 and always very happy here being a seller and buyer. This is shocking and very disappointing. 

 

I will keep calling them but I don't know how that's going to improve this situation. I can understand the third party authentication is required if the item is a highly sophisticated replica. But this is not the case here. 

 

Don't think I will ever buy books here. I don't want to risk being duped for the third time...

Message 17 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

I'd keep at it.

 

It sounds like the pictures in the listing are not the same as the books you received.  I'd be sure to focus on the way the item is significantly not as described instead of being counterfeit.

 

Best to keep it simple.  INADed is much easier to prove than counterfeit.

 

Also, as femme pointed out, that would mean that the seller has to pay return shipping.

Message 18 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Hi Reallynicestamps, 

 

Thanks for detailed comment. It's true what you said that the seller has no idea what he/she is selling. The books come from the supplier in China. Seller told me in the msg that he/she lives in the US and "honestly I don't know what your books look like and what authorized copies should look like." Every time I called ebay, they read through all the msgs we exchanged too. 

 

Shipping counterfeits cross-border is against the law here. I already got verbal confirmation from Kaplan that these are fake so shipping them out of Canada to US exposes me to significant legal risk. 300 bucks is simply not worth the legal liability. 

 

The pages are readable but it's the fact that these are fake puts me in a very difficult situation. I can't bring the books to class or ask professor questions out of the book. Doing that poses a significant question on my integrity. 

Message 19 of 33
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Received counterfeit and ebay decides to side with the seller. Help!

Yes, I sent the pictures to the seller in inbox, uploaded them when I opened the case and emailed them separately with more pictures... I believe they have all the picture evidence I mentioned.

 

I opened the case as item not as described and called Ebay explaining everything. And then this became a counterfeit case and ended like this. 

 

I just called them this morning and the agent told me that I need a reply from Kaplan further escalate this, if not they will not change their decision...

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