Defect rate - from bad to worse

[rosscd57]

For those who have not seen this new eBay fiasco - here it is.

New way to measure performance rewards sellers providing great service

• Starting with the August 20 monthly seller evaluation, a new measure, the transaction defect rate ("defect rate"), will replace the current four individual detailed seller rating requirements in evaluating seller performance. This new rating may impact your status.
• The defect rate is simply the percentage of a seller's successful transactions that have one or more of the following transaction-related defects, the top predictors that a buyer will leave eBay or buy less:
  • Detailed seller rating of 1, 2 or 3 for item as described
  • Detailed seller rating of 1 for shipping time
  • Negative or neutral feedback
  • Return initiated for a reason that indicates the item was not as described
  • eBay Money Back Guarantee (previously known as eBay Buyer Protection) or PayPal Purchase Protection case opened for an item not received or an item not as described
  • Seller-cancelled transactions
• Starting with the August 20 evaluation, to meet eBay's minimum standard, sellers can have up to a maximum 5% of transactions with one or more transaction defects over the most recent evaluation period. A maximum 2% will allow a seller to qualify as an eBay Top Rated Seller. The  same requirements apply both to your Global and US seller performance  standards.
• The defect rate won't affect your status until you have transactions with defects with at least 8 different buyers (at least 5 different buyers to impact Top Rated status) within your evaluation period.
• Just as today, sellers can have a maximum of 0.3% of eBay Money Back Guarantee or PayPal Purchase Protection closed cases without seller resolution over the most recent evaluation period. That means the buyer opened the case, you weren't able to resolve it, the buyer reached out to eBay or PayPal to review it, and eBay found you responsible.
• Just as today, sellers with 400 or more transactions over the past 3 months will be evaluated based on the past 3 months and sellers with fewer than 400 transactions will be evaluated based on the past 12 months.

In general, the lower your defect rate, the better your position in Best Match search results

• By focusing squarely on what matters most to buyers, the new transaction defect rate allows eBay to recognize and reward sellers who consistently deliver the great service buyers expect—and to identify and respond to the experiences that erode confidence and drive buyers away.
• If you maintain a low defect rate, eBay will reward you with an enhanced position in Best Match search results, so your track record for great service can pay off in more visibility and potential sales.

[pjcdn2005]

The more I look at these new seller rules, the more ridiculously complicated they seem.

I agree.  All it seems to have accomplished is to make sellers concentrate on how to fix the problem with the minimum amount of damage to their account rather than on how to fix the problem to make the customer happy.

[rainbow71113]

when the US had to start to keep 90% tracking lots of sellers put in fake tracking numbers- I've seen lots of feedbacks saying the tracking numbers weren't legit.  I have also had a shipment delivered  to Los Angeles only to show up the next day in Nova Scotia...ebay is forcing sellers to be creative to avoid penalties etc.  I wish we could get back to what we all set out to do and that is have a little fun selling items and for some of us, an income- instead of spending so much time trying to figure out how the new rules impact us and how we can keep in business.  

[rose-dee]

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@pjcdn2005 wrote:

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The more I look at these new seller rules, the more ridiculously complicated they seem.

I agree.  All it seems to have accomplished is to make sellers concentrate on how to fix the problem with the minimum amount of damage to their account rather than on how to fix the problem to make the customer happy.

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I couldn't agree more.  By taking away from sellers much of their freedom in making choices on how to deal with their customers to provide a completely satisfactory buying experience, eBay is creating an almost impossible situation where sellers are going to be rigidly focused on their "scores" and fearful of a misstep, rather than simply making outstanding service the goal.

This trend, IMHO, started with the deliberate separation by eBay of buyer and seller contact about 18 months ago, through various changes -- some subtle, some not so subtle -- to the way eBay managed (I was almost going to say "allowed") communications between buyer and seller.  I thought at the time that these small changes which, taken as whole, added up to a very big shift, must have been done in order to accommodate the biggest commercial sellers, at the cost of smaller sellers being able to interact easily and directly with their buyers. 

I had nothing to support that theory, which is all it was.  However, at this past Wed. open board discussion, Rodney let something slip that got my full attention - he confirmed that eBay's buyer-seller contact policies were changed in order to satisfy the big sellers (the question asked related to why the contact seller link had been shunted to the very bottom of the listing page). 

I expect these most recent rule changes, as convoluted and over-complex as they seem, are a further attempt to satisfy the demands of major sellers, who do not want to have to deal individually with their buyers, and who benefit from rules with very little flexibility, that can be applied in an automated system.  I imagine these rules are also easier on the big volume sellers who can afford to absorb a lot of "defects" and still carry on.  Small volume and "boutique" sellers will have a much harder time staying on top of the heap.  Hmm -- so where does that put big sellers in terms of placement?

There is one other aspect that interested me, and that is the removal of "Communications" and "Shipping Cost" DSRs from the penalty system.  I imagine that large-scale eBay sellers are happy to have communications off the table, since they don't want to have to pay people to communicate with buyers anyway.  "Shipping Cost" is a more curious change - how could removal of this DSR from counting against sellers benefit the largest sellers?  Maybe this was one area where they were getting the most complaints/low DSRs, I don't know. 

At any rate, every time eBay now restructures its policies, I tend to look at the big picture and ask who it is they really want to support and encourage on this site?  I honestly don't think it's the smaller, independent sellers anymore.  I'm sure this isn't news to anybody, but we sellers tend to react as if these new rules are primarily meant to level the playing field, raise the bar, etc. etc.  I don't think so.  I think they're intended to weed out a lot of unhelpful competition on the site, pare down the offerings, and give a boost to the large commercial sellers of new, name-brand items. 

If this sounds seditious, I suppose it is, but it's also from a depressing feeling of seeing the writing on the wall. 

[rainbow71113]

yes, and did you notice that the big sellers don't seem to comply with the photo restrictions?  I've seen many put up their store logo or "photo to be added"  etc.  And here I am trying to rephotograph/resize my 1700+ listings that have to be done and can't change the shipping costs until I do...but you can just bet if I tried that I would be reported...LOL

[rainbow71113]

this is what I was talking about, saw this negative today-PAID,SELLER UPLOADED FAKE TRACKING #,NEVER SENT PHOTO,NO COMMUNICATION,NO GOOD- desperate measures to keep status....I wonder if ebay realizes how much trouble they cause with all their rules-wouldn't it have been better customer service for the buyer to get it sent lettermail instead of a fake tracking number...?

[rainbow71113]

I just tried to call ebay today and this is the first time I've ever heard of a 44 minute delay to talk to someone, usually it's about 5-10 minutes....wow!!

[Anonymous]

Apparently eBay developed something to make us not wanting to call customer serivce.  I called them yesteday twice, both 30 mintues wait each time, and again 20 minues, total of 1 hour and 20 minutes waiting and waiting and waiting.

I susepct that eBay has the purpose to make us NOT to want to call them at any time.  What a tragedy.

If we have DSRs for eBay, believe me eBay would crash way long time ago with -10 less stars on each categories!!

We should have DSRs for eBay and eBay can see how unhappy we are with their customer serivces, etc., instead of developing more problems for us as sellers!!  Come on, eBay, be nice to sellers.

eBay is losing the sight that we as sellers are the one that bring HUGE revenue for eBay.   eBay should be thankful for that.  It is NOT buyers, it is sellers that bring revenue by listing our items! 

eBay needs to stop working so hard to develop more problems for us and work more harder to make eBay more fun for all of us.  Sheesh!!

[rainbow71113]

my friend says whenever she calls she gets a feedback review at the end of the call, in all my years I've never had one but she's had quite a few and she does let them know about all the problems so there is some feedback getting to them, whether they listen or not, that's another thing...

[recped]

Do any of you use the "call back" feature.

I have used it a few times, the estimated wait time has varied from 4 - 20 minutes but every time I've used it I've received a call back in LESS than two minutes.

[pocomocomputing]

My experience with call back was almost immediate, less than 5 minutes for sure.  I only called 2 times since the feature was introduced a year or so back. Best of all, the rep was courteous, knew what I wanted and fixed it quickly. Total time on the phone 5 minutes each time. My issues were simple, billing for fees I should not have.

Before call back, it was a PITA to wait, slow reps, communication issues and so on.

Should not make a difference on the quality of the rep but it seemed to.

[westernstargifts]

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@westernstargifts wrote:

In the past month I have had 4 buyers who did not receive their packages.  Three opened a case immediately resulting in 3 defects.  The 4th did not open a case but I issued a full refund since it had been a month since I had shipped.  That is also counted as a defect.  Then a buyer left a neutral feedback without contacting me first.  In all of the years we have had top rated sellers I have lost that status only once, for 1 month, right at the beginning.  I am now at the 1.44% level for defects which are beyond my control.

My point is, that you can go rapidly from no defects to losing TRS and possibly the ability to sell on eBay when hit with a streak of bad luck....beyond your control.

Another interesting aspect of this is the conversation I had with my postal clerk today.  I asked him if there was a problem with shipments sent out last month, in particular Mar. 14 as 3 of those packages were shipped on that day. He whispered to me that there are a lot of disgruntled employees at CP these days and hinted that they might be holding it up somewhere on a 'work to rule' type of action.  He gave me a number to call CP to complain.  All packages were Light Packet so they won't be able to do much but if they are receiving enough complaints something may be done about it....one can only hope.  It cost me over $120.00.

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The 4th buyer did not open a case but I received a defect from eBay because I issued a full refund.  The buyer contacted me and told me that she received her package today, May. 1.  It was shipped on Mar. 20.  She repaid me for those 3 items and purchased an additional one for which I gave her free shipping for the inconvenience of receiving her package late (through no fault of my own).  She is very happy with my service and has promised me, without any solicitation on my part, to leave me 5 stars.

For this good customer service eBay rewards me with a defect.  They can and DO add up quickly.

[rainbow71113]

imagine what stores that have a no questions asked policy for returns/refunds is going to have to deal with.  Ebay is trying to encourage us to have a return policy but it's going to bite us in the butt because lots of times you just tell the buyer to keep the item and that you'll just refund the money especially in the case of an item being cheap- I'm certainly not going to request the return of an item that only cost $5.00 and got damaged in the mail but by refunding the payment we are going to get a defect.   I'm showing a defect for a neutral that ebay removed and an item not as described which the buyer closed when she realized her error.  In other words, seller are going to be at fault for everything again and just when we thought feedback was starting to get a little more on our side-doesn't matter -still a defect.  

thanks for the tips about getting a call back, I've never done it and didn't even stay on the phone long enough to hear that option, will try it next time, I'm trying to see why I'm getting those 2 defects.  

[brandeentertainment]

How will this affect big sellers though .. I can tell you right now there are a few big sellers in my category that tis defect things is going to kill them ..

Will they be removed from ebay or will there be grace for those sellers as there is not ... Long time ago a buddy of mine got kicked off ebay with 99.8% rating the issue Shipping Cost hit 2.2 or someting like that For there US shipping rates even though they were exact to the penny...

They Contacted CEO some how I kept the email he showed me ... The ceo Stated due to him overcharging so much for shipping they will not longer be allowed to sell on ebay and even though they never overcharged a penny and it was easy to proof they axed him for life....

No I see some seller with 98% feedback and and a ton of negs and nuetrals and with the nex defect rating system it is going to drive there dfect ratins THROUGH the Roof..

Will they have to pay for it or simple call ebay headqaurters and say I pay your bills take your rules and shove down some little guys throat

[brandeentertainment]

Sorry for the overwhleming amount of typo's haven't slept in 2 days my bad grammar is turning into WORSER grammar .. LOL ... Somebody got the chills down there spine when they read that awesome word LOL..

[bb_cool_stuff]

Somebody got the chills down there spine when they read that awesome word.

I take it you are referring to our favorite female from Ottawa.

[rainbow71113]

I was thinking the same thing that the big sellers are going to have trouble, usually not everyone who has a bad experience leaves a negative or neutral so there will be stats that we wouldn't see, like refunds.   

[ricarmic]

western, I wonder what happens if one does an almost complete partial refund - ie it was a $50 item and one provides a partial refund of $49.99, of course one would have to be careful how one presented that to the buyer, or worse things could happen....

[rainbow71113]

I was thinking the same thing but how would you approach the buyer with that..."I have a one cent policy...."  LOL

[rainbow71113]

what if we refunded as a paypal money transfer as opposed to a refund?  we could still quote the item number and description in the transfer so we would have proof that it was reimbursed.  One problem I do see with that is if the buyer is a business and gets charged a fee so we would have to send it in a way that we pay the fees.

[rose-dee]

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@brandeentertainment wrote:

How will this affect big sellers though .. I can tell you right now there are a few big sellers in my category that tis defect things is going to kill them ..

Will they be removed from ebay or will there be grace for those sellers as there is now.

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Your comment got me thinking, as my premise has been that these "new rules" are meant to weed out smaller sellers and/or make it more difficult for them to provide great customer service on their own terms. 

I thought I'd do a little research.  I picked a big seller I could think of, more or less at random, and took a look at their FB page.  The seller I chose was "ToysRus".  Obviously a massive seller like this can absorb a lot of bad hits, but the question is, will eBay ever punish them for falling below the stated requirements, and would we know if that were the case?

Based only on their current negative + neutral FB, they would have a 3.45% defect rate over the past 12 months, and 3.38% over the past 6 months -- fairly consistent.  Keep in mind such a seller will be evaluated on a 3-month look back cycle, so they can start again at the beginning of each cycle if they really need to clean up their act.  This is itself is an advantage a really large seller will have over a smaller/boutique seller who is going to be dragging their history like a sea anchor for 12 months. 

However, this 3.38% or 3.45% rate doesn't take into account any cancelled transactions due to items not being available where the buyer didn't bother to leave FB.  I can imagine their true defect rate could be approaching 4%. 

I also skimmed through the negative and neutral FB comments that ToysRus has so far this month -- the majority appear to be INAD (broken, poorly packaged, wrong item) or INR (never received) complaints.  These complaints together add up to about 30 FB entries.  If we assume that a significant number of those 30 complaints represent unresolved cases or cases found in the buyer's favour,  let's say 30%, that makes 10 unresolved cases, which equates to a 0.39% rate.  Even if the number of such cases is less than 10, it's logical to assume that not every buyer who filed and escalated and case (and was found by eBay to be in the right) would have left FB at all. 

So, although there are a lot of fuzzy edges to this analysis, there are also likely many defects that won't be openly visible on the FB page.  By these numbers, ToysRus stands at:

     About 4% out of an allowable 5% of defects over the past 6 months;

     About 0.39% out of an allowable 0.30% closed cases without seller resolution

It would seem that ToysRus are getting pretty close to the line.  I am going to be watching them from time to time over the next few months, to see if (or how) their figures change.  If their publicly visible numbers clearly go above the allowable limits under the new rules, then it's a fair assumption that they're getting special treatment from eBay. 

As for us "little folk", I'm going to consider the suggestion about refunding through Paypal in any instance that might otherwise be seen by eBay (but significantly, not by the buyer), to be a defect, such as a postal delay beyond my control.

I think it's important to keep in mind that if your buyer is happy with your service and communicative, you might be able to neutralize the defect a refund would otherwise create by cancelling the transaction, using one of the acceptable cancellation options (perhaps "Buyer is returning the item for a refund", even if you and the buyer agree that's not necessary).  You would of course need to be fairly sure you'd have your buyer's full co-operation in accepting the cancellation on that basis.