Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

burryaburl
Community Member

I am just thinking about selling on eBay. but one thing that worry's me are people claiming items not received. I was talking to someone online when she was practically bragging about claiming things haven't arrived then getting her money back, only for the item to arrive days later, leaving the seller screwed. i have heard quite a few stories on this and it is kind of turning me off selling before i even start. what does the small new seller do?

Message 1 of 12
latest reply
1 ACCEPTED SOLUTION

Accepted Solutions

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

I'm going to disagree with both of the other posters. (Respectfully, because I don't think they are actually wrong.)

 

It depends on what you are selling.

It depends on your costs for your offerings.

It depends on your customer demographic.

 

Some products attract fewer problems than others. I sell books, dress patterns, and collectible postage stamps. My buyers tend to be people who read and follow instructions.

While I do have the occasional Unpaid Item Dispute, about half of those are not deadbeats but slow payers who respond to polite prodding with an apology, payment, and positive feedback. (The rest are never heard from. Strike!)

 

But if you are planning to sell video games, motorcycle paraphenalia*, dolls**, horse tack, electronics, or jewelry, plan for many claims and fake returns.

Also china and glass, but that is a packing question usually.

From reading this threads for over a decade, these seem to be problem areas.

 

And customer demographics, there seem to be more problems with the same class of persons that fill the prisons. That is, young males. So if you are selling a product that appeals to them, expect to have more problems than if you are selling antique lace to elderly seamstresses.

 

So look closely at your costs.

Even if a buyer is totally dishonest you are not going to be out more than you paid for the item. Including all postage, Paypal and eBay fees.

If your item costs you $1 and your fees are $2 and your postage and packaging are $3, and you sell for $20 including free shipping, the most you lose in a Dispute is $6. Not $20. Six dollars. Think about it for a moment.

 

And losses to Disputes -- which may or may not be justified, most people are honest-- are rarer than reading these Boards indicates, because people don't come here with good news. There is a skew to problems.

 

So, I have two suggestions.

If your shipments are bulky, you will be using a parcel service. Most of these are automatically tracked*** by Canada Post. Some are also insured. Give your buyer the tracking number in your feedback.

And leave feedback when you ship. It will reassure the nervous seller.

 

The postal system is very good at what it does, but it can be slow. If you have an upset buyer, tell her politely that in spite of what the PO claims, it easily takes 20 days for delivery from CANADA to anywhere in North America. (Emphasize the CANADA. Many of your US customers will be oblivious to having ordered internationally.)

BTW, that tracking/Confirmation of Delivery number will win most Item Not Received claims.

If you are using LetterPost, just give the date and that it is shipping Canada Post Air Mail. And put an air mail sticker on the envelope. I believe it helps speed delivery, even if it goes by truck the whole way to Key West FL.

 

And the second is Cookie Jar Insurance.

This is self-insurance. When you set up your listing add a few pennies to each price or shipping fee, to cover the very occasional claim of loss.

If a buyer contacts you, dip into those virtual pennies in your virtual cookie jar, and pay out promptly. Ask that the buyer refund the refund WHEN the item arrives. Usually this works, again because most people are honest, if nervous and impatient.

If your items are expensive ($100 or more) you may want to look into third party insurance. We use Hugh Wood Insurance which is a British company, with offices in Toronto, specializing in collectibles. If you are doing this professionally-- say over $100,000 annually across all your venues, their annual contracts may be a good choice. Cheaper than most household or commercial insurers because they understand collectibles.

Or you could use a one-off insurer like shipinsure, about which many eBay sellers seem enthusiastic. Again, cheaper than postal insurance and more transparent. You can insure shipments individually.

 

Another thought, I believe if your shipping and handling is higher than your selling price, you will have more claims than if it is lower or if you use Free Shipping/shipping included in asking price.

 

 

I was talking to someone online when she was practically bragging about claiming things haven't arrived then getting her money back,

 

You need new friends.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*But not parts. It seems to be the wannabes, not the actual bikers.

**Yes, dolls. Particularly antique and reborns. Don't look up reborn dolls if you are squeamish.

*** It's really Confirmation of Delivery. It will be noted when the PO gets it and when it is delivered. Anything in between is an accidental bonus.

View solution in original post

Message 4 of 12
latest reply
11 REPLIES 11

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

If you sell to Canadians, for $1.50 you can get signature confirmation on packages.  They will have to sign for it.  To everywhere else, you should get tracking.  It will show, the item has been delivered.  However, "successfully delivered" only means, the mailman may have left it on the doorstep, if nobody was home.  The only 100% secure thing, is to get signature confirmation.  That is costly, so you will have to decide, if you're prepared to pay for that. 

Message 2 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

I concur with the previous reply. It is better, in my opinion, to sell fewer items and lose none to theft than to sell many and lose most to dishonest recipients. When you start out, use tracked services. Paypal shipping offers a discounted rate so use it. (Don't add handling fees, that's a turnoff.)

 

While the cost of tracked shipments might discourage some bidders/buyers, those are the ones you can live without. At least, that's my motto. There is a certain calibre of dishonest person who will look specifically for a new seller and exploit that so also do buy a few more times on ebay to get your feedback numbers higher. With each purchase, you will also gain insight into the overall ebay experience. After awhile, you might decide to take a few risks with specific regions and/or categories that have a low-loss rate. This will come with experience.

 

And don't start your auctions at 99 cents! Set the lowest price that you are willing to live with and go from there. Don't forget to consider your fees on selling it, either.

 

Don't accept paypal for cash pickups.

 

Do ship quickly! 

 

Do leave feedback on shipment for your buyers. Don't get into a war of words with anyone. Feedback is there forever and nasty sentiments reflect poorly on the person who left them more than to whom it was directed. If someone is behaving in a way that you think is hinkey, report it. Study the rules here for selling and buying. Information is power!

 

Good luck. Remember too the ebay Community is always here for advice. 

 

 

 

 

Message 3 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

I'm going to disagree with both of the other posters. (Respectfully, because I don't think they are actually wrong.)

 

It depends on what you are selling.

It depends on your costs for your offerings.

It depends on your customer demographic.

 

Some products attract fewer problems than others. I sell books, dress patterns, and collectible postage stamps. My buyers tend to be people who read and follow instructions.

While I do have the occasional Unpaid Item Dispute, about half of those are not deadbeats but slow payers who respond to polite prodding with an apology, payment, and positive feedback. (The rest are never heard from. Strike!)

 

But if you are planning to sell video games, motorcycle paraphenalia*, dolls**, horse tack, electronics, or jewelry, plan for many claims and fake returns.

Also china and glass, but that is a packing question usually.

From reading this threads for over a decade, these seem to be problem areas.

 

And customer demographics, there seem to be more problems with the same class of persons that fill the prisons. That is, young males. So if you are selling a product that appeals to them, expect to have more problems than if you are selling antique lace to elderly seamstresses.

 

So look closely at your costs.

Even if a buyer is totally dishonest you are not going to be out more than you paid for the item. Including all postage, Paypal and eBay fees.

If your item costs you $1 and your fees are $2 and your postage and packaging are $3, and you sell for $20 including free shipping, the most you lose in a Dispute is $6. Not $20. Six dollars. Think about it for a moment.

 

And losses to Disputes -- which may or may not be justified, most people are honest-- are rarer than reading these Boards indicates, because people don't come here with good news. There is a skew to problems.

 

So, I have two suggestions.

If your shipments are bulky, you will be using a parcel service. Most of these are automatically tracked*** by Canada Post. Some are also insured. Give your buyer the tracking number in your feedback.

And leave feedback when you ship. It will reassure the nervous seller.

 

The postal system is very good at what it does, but it can be slow. If you have an upset buyer, tell her politely that in spite of what the PO claims, it easily takes 20 days for delivery from CANADA to anywhere in North America. (Emphasize the CANADA. Many of your US customers will be oblivious to having ordered internationally.)

BTW, that tracking/Confirmation of Delivery number will win most Item Not Received claims.

If you are using LetterPost, just give the date and that it is shipping Canada Post Air Mail. And put an air mail sticker on the envelope. I believe it helps speed delivery, even if it goes by truck the whole way to Key West FL.

 

And the second is Cookie Jar Insurance.

This is self-insurance. When you set up your listing add a few pennies to each price or shipping fee, to cover the very occasional claim of loss.

If a buyer contacts you, dip into those virtual pennies in your virtual cookie jar, and pay out promptly. Ask that the buyer refund the refund WHEN the item arrives. Usually this works, again because most people are honest, if nervous and impatient.

If your items are expensive ($100 or more) you may want to look into third party insurance. We use Hugh Wood Insurance which is a British company, with offices in Toronto, specializing in collectibles. If you are doing this professionally-- say over $100,000 annually across all your venues, their annual contracts may be a good choice. Cheaper than most household or commercial insurers because they understand collectibles.

Or you could use a one-off insurer like shipinsure, about which many eBay sellers seem enthusiastic. Again, cheaper than postal insurance and more transparent. You can insure shipments individually.

 

Another thought, I believe if your shipping and handling is higher than your selling price, you will have more claims than if it is lower or if you use Free Shipping/shipping included in asking price.

 

 

I was talking to someone online when she was practically bragging about claiming things haven't arrived then getting her money back,

 

You need new friends.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*But not parts. It seems to be the wannabes, not the actual bikers.

**Yes, dolls. Particularly antique and reborns. Don't look up reborn dolls if you are squeamish.

*** It's really Confirmation of Delivery. It will be noted when the PO gets it and when it is delivered. Anything in between is an accidental bonus.

Message 4 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

femmefan also offers very good points for consideration. It does depend on what you sell and to whom it is marketed. I will add another thought to the pile, however, and that is that I have found in my experience that people who are willing to spend good money on something tend to have money to spend and are a different kind of person than the diehard-bargain seeker who may never be satisfied with anything. I am speaking of extremes, of course. Most people fall somewhere in the middle.

 

And if you have reason to believe the person of whom you speak with their 'false item not received claim' is for real and you know the buyer ID, call and file a report! 

Message 5 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

Thank you for you reply!

Message 6 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.


@pinetreecottage wrote:

If you sell to Canadians, for $1.50 you can get signature confirmation on packages.  They will have to sign for it.  To everywhere else, you should get tracking.  It will show, the item has been delivered.  However, "successfully delivered" only means, the mailman may have left it on the doorstep, if nobody was home.  The only 100% secure thing, is to get signature confirmation.  That is costly, so you will have to decide, if you're prepared to pay for that. 


What do you mean by 100% secure?

As far as seller protection goes, you only need to prove delivery confirmation if an item is less than $750. Signature confirmation doesn't serve any purpose to the seller for less expensive items.

Delivery confirmation is nice, but in some cases it is too expensive and in the majority of cases it is not needed.  Femme explains it well.

 

Message 7 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

What do YOU mean?  How can anyone deny having received an item, if they have signed for it?

Message 8 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

As far as I know, ebay and paypal are satisfied if tracking shows something was delivered. It's only at the $750-mark that Signature Confirmation is required for seller protection.

 

Precisely what might have been delivered is another kind of matter entirely. If a recipient contests the contents of the parcel sent to them, that's a Resolution Centre dispute of a different kind than Item Not Received. It would be an Item Not as Described type of case and Signature Confirmation is ineffective against it. 

 

Plus, I don't think Canada Post, for example, cares who signs for anything at the door. You would write Jo Blow and they wouldn't notice. The only time a person gets asked for ID to confirm their identity is when it's a pick-up at the retail counter. At that point, Signature Required is part of the card service. If as a seller you want that parcel to bypass the door and go straight to the counter for pick-up so that you are certain it lands in the right hands of the person who iAd for it, that's a different service and the exact name of it escapes me. Card for Delivery? Card for Counter? Something like that. 

 

But the seller's responsibly ends when tracking shows something was delivered to the address. That is also usually where the carrier absolves itself of responsibility too.

Message 9 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.

(That should read 'person who paid for it' not what it does. Typo.) 

Message 10 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.


@femmefan1946 wrote:

 

But if you are planning to sell video games, motorcycle paraphenalia*, dolls**, horse tack, electronics, or jewelry, plan for many claims and fake returns.

 


Horse tack???!!!   Woman LOL

 

Holy cow/horse, so the horsey set is really the nasty set? 

 

[As an aside, I seem to recall at some point in time eBay's analysis discovered that people who purchased dolls -- probably not including the inflatable kind or other weird permutations on the theme -- were "nice" buyers.  Perhaps times (and dolls) have changed!]. 

 

Otherwise, your comments are spot-on.  

 

I'd be interested in knowing what the OP is planning to sell.  The size, shape, weight and value of items factor importantly into what sort of difficulties and cost will be involved in selling.  In my view, an item worth less than about $50 isn't worth sending by tracked shipping in most cases, when the total annual cost of such shipping is considered against the actual annual losses due to fraud, etc.  It's throwing a lot of good money away. 

 

A few additional pieces of advice I'd pass along to the OP:

 

1)  Get your feet wet in selling by restricting your "ship to" regions to Canada and the U.S. for the first few months.  Not only will you have lower shipping costs, but you will be dealing with two of the world's most reliable postal systems and won't have to wrestle with language issues should a problem arise (unless you happen to be a polyglot).  

 

2)  Undersell and over-deliver/over-perform.  Don't promise anything in your listings unless you know you can deliver it 100% of the time, and always try to pleasantly surprise your buyers.  You want FB like "Wow - even better than the pictures", not "Disappointed - not as good as photos".  

 

3)  Review and understand eBay policies before you start selling.  The policies aren't easy or simple, but better to have a good grasp of the rules beforehand than to have to deal with a problem that could easily have been avoided.  This also ties in with the advice to do some more buying before selling.  And do come here to ask specific questions you might have before you start.  There's a lot of accumulated experience on these boards. 

 

4)  To reiterate what 'femmefan' has said, remember that what you see on these boards tends to represent the worst eBay experiences.  I think most of us who have been selling here for a few years would agree that these incidents are really quite rare.  For example, although I admit I sell in a fairly "safe" category, I've never had a single parcel not get delivered in all the years I've been selling on eBay.  

 

 

 

Message 11 of 12
latest reply

Starting out, wondering about items not recived.


@pinetreecottage wrote:

What do YOU mean?  How can anyone deny having received an item, if they have signed for it?


As mj explained, if there is delivery confirmation showing that the item has been received ebay and paypal will rule in favor of the seller in any item not received claim if the item + shipping is cost is less than $750 U.S. (C$850)  For items that cost less than that, paying for for signature confirmation doesn't give you any more 'protection' than delivery confirmation would.

Message 12 of 12
latest reply