Third Party Insurance how much is the actual limit?

[maximus7001]

Ok here it is.

We will be selling a few expensive items worth around $1500 US each ($1875 CDN at todays rate) Domestic shipping is not a problem since insurance can be bought for up to $5000 CDN.

USA and international is a problem since the max coverage is $1000 CDN with Canada post. Using a courier like fedex (we have an account) will cause brokerage/tax /duty problems for an out of Canada buyer.

The third party companies say max insurance limit is $1000. As in Canada post pays the included hundred and they pay the other $900 totaling $1000.

Where can I buy third party to cover the extra $875 CDN when the first $1000 CDN insurance is bought from canada post? 

[femmefan1946]

I'm not sure what the limit is for our insurance from Hugh Wood International, but they do annual contracts not one-off shipping which is what I think you are looking for.

HWI insures the Court of Honour at World Philatelic Conventions, where several million dollars worth of stamps are normally on display. That would include travel to and from, damage, and loss insurance. They also insure the American Philatelic Society circuit books.*

If you have a B&M business, or are a serious collector (of anything) you could try phoning their Toronto office. Ask Gina about coverage of your stock and /or collection including shows and exhibits , travel and shipping.

*Circuit books -- You put your unwanted stamps in the supplied booklet. This is mailed to the next guy in the circuit. He removes what he wants, sends the money to the APS, then ships it to the next guy. After a year or so, the book comes back to the APS. Honour system and HWI is comfortable covering insurance on these. There are hundreds of them whizzing about at any given time.

[sylviebee]

You should be able to insure the first $1,000 (C) with CPO and the second $1,000 (or $875 in your case) (US) with TPI / InsurePost.

However, I would email them to make sure.

You can call but IMO an email would be better because then you have a hard copy of the conversation.

I've found that it can be very difficult to nail them down so having it in writing is better, and even then make sure that what they are saying isn't vague and full of loop holes.

My experience with InsurePost has always been good but I'm very careful to dot my I's and cross my T's.

The higher the number the more careful you want to be.

 https://www.insurepost.com/login.asp?message=&to=insure_main.asp?

[pocomocomputing]

I asked InsurePost about this recently. While not directly answered, it seems you cannot add coverage to exceed $1,000 declared value

[sylviebee]

Like trying to nail Jello to the wall.

This is exactly what I meant when I posted that they can be really evasive and unclear in their responses.

One really has to work at getting a clear response. 

 You posted that you cannot add coverage to exceed $1,000 declared value, but what if the declared value is $2,000?

In other words:  If you declare at $2,0000 it sounds like they will cover the second thousand.

Doesn't it?

Or Does it?  

I'd also like to add that I've had a number of conversations with them where they told me that they did not care how you declared the items and that declaration(s) have nothing to do with coverage.

Moreover, they told me (on the phone not via email) that they were quite pleased when customers umderdeclared because that meant that the threat of theft was reduced but they would cover the amount of the sale.

However, when buying the insurance it clearly says that they cover the declared value.

That's what I mean about being slippery.

[sylviebee]

P.S.  I think the confusion may be a result of the fact that in this case the declared value on the shipping label will not be the same as the declared value on on the InsurePost paperwork.

Some time ago I wanted to insure breakables with InsurePost but these were already covered up to $100 by the CPO but not for breakage.  

I was told to value the items at their value plus $100 and that way I was able to buy the insurance.

I think that's the same idea here.

In other words, it does sound like they will insure the second thousand but you have to play with the numbers a bit when buying the insurance.

Still, it's something that's good to have in writing.

[pocomocomputing]

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@sylviebee wrote:

Like trying to nail Jello to the wall.

This is exactly what I meant when I posted that they can be really evasive and unclear in their responses.

One really has to work at getting a clear response. 

 You posted that you cannot add coverage to exceed $1,000 declared value, but what if the declared value is $2,000?

In other words:  If you declare at $2,0000 it sounds like they will cover the second thousand.

Doesn't it?

Or Does it?  

I'd also like to add that I've had a number of conversations with them where they told me that they did not care how you declared the items and that declaration(s) have nothing to do with coverage.

Moreover, they told me (on the phone not via email) that they were quite pleased when customers umderdeclared because that meant that the threat of theft was reduced but they would cover the amount of the sale.

However, when buying the insurance it clearly says that they cover the declared value.

That's what I mean about being slippery.

---

I would have preferred a direct answer to my question of $2000. Yes I can insure $2000 split $1000 between CP and InsurePost  or No I cannot.

But from I understood from the last reply is that their system cannot enter a declared value over $1,000. So no way to split between CP and InsurePost?

Maybe I should try again by emailing another reply asking for clarification to see if I can get a direct answer. I found the replies vague and could have whatever meaning InsurePost wanted it to be.

[sylviebee]

Yes, please pursue it with them and try to pin them down.

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@pocomocomputing wrote:

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Maybe I should try again by emailing another reply asking for clarification to see if I can get a direct answer. I found the replies vague and could have whatever meaning InsurePost wanted it to be.

........would have preferred a direct answer to my question of $2000. Yes I can insure $2000 split $1000 between CP and InsurePost or No I cannot.

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What's problematic is that they are being purposely evasive and that's troubling.  

What's so difficult about answering the question clearly?  There is nothing confusing about the question:  Very simple and straight forward.

Yes, if you have time please email and ask for clarification.  

Hopefully what they tell you will apply to me as well.

What they emailed to you is that they will insure the second $1,000 of a $2,000 item..............

BUT..... the system only takes declarations up to $1,000 and they limit coverage to the declared value.

In other words, they've told you that yes they cover the second $1,000 and no they don't.

Huh?

[maximus7001]

This is exactly why we asked here on the forums. We got NO straight answers from them when we called. And completely different answers on the second call.

[sylviebee]

I've been involved in several claims with InsurePost, both as shipper and receiver, and they always came through.

It did require persistence at times but they always paid up.

I have also has this experience with them where I couldn't get straight answers and so that's not new to me.

In this case, when shipping a $2,000 item the shipper will use the best fully tracked signed for shipping method available.

Then, if something goes wrong and CPO has decided that the claim is legit and has paid the first $1,000, then and only then would InsurePost be required to pay anything.

Of all the types of shipments they insure, the chance there would be a claim filed  is as low as it gets, and the chance the claim wouldn't be legit is lower than most.

Why, then, all the avoidance when it comes to giving a straight answer?  

[femmefan1946]

Because the poor sap on the phone is being asked a question of policy that is well above his pay grade?

[sylviebee]

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@femmefan1946 wrote:

Because the poor sap on the phone is being asked a question of policy that is well above his pay grade?

---

While that gave me a chuckle..............

I have the impression that the people answering the questions really know what they're doing.  These are not minimum wage uninvolved employees.

In fact, it almost seems like they have a stake in the company.

The responses are not ignorant or uninformed.

In fact they're very adept at dancing around the issue and giving just the right evasive response.

If you're not really on top of it, you'll hear exactly what you want to hear even though you were never actually told exactly what you think you were told.

[pierrelebel]

"Because the poor sap on the phone is being asked a question of policy that is well above his pay grade?"

I had a phone call yesterday from someone working "on behalf" of my bank concerning my MasterCard.  He was selling some subscription for "$14.95 a month plus 13% HST" (first three months free of course). 

When I asked him "what do I get for over $200 a year?"

A - "No, no, no.  It is only $14.95 a month plus 13% HST"

Q - "So how much is $14.95 a month plus 13% HST for the next twelve months?"

A - "I do not know but you only pay $14.95 a month plus 13% HST."

The poor telemarketer was trained to follow his script and his script only.  I felt bad for him but... The usual "Sorry, not interested!".

[sylviebee]

I'd be curious to hear poco's view on this, since he's been there done that.

 Are these clever employees dodging the questions or poor saps on the phone at minimum wage?

Maybe I have it all wrong, but it seems to me I communicate with the same person all the time and not a random employee.

[sylviebee]

I contacted InsurePost about this.  Once again it seems like I communicate with the same informed person every time and not a random minimum wage employee.

As expected, they told me that they do insure the second thousand but since their system can only handle amounts up to $1,000 that I should value the item at $1,000.

They instructed me to note that it's a $2,000 item and that I was insuring the second thousand in the shipment description.

That was exactly as expected because, as I  posted earlier, this is exactly the same technique they instructed me use for breakable items so it follows that same pattern.

That said:  I would still email them and get it in writing every time I actually do this if the item is close to the $2,000 mark....... just in case.

[rosscd57]

My thoughts:

I send in excess of $1,000 a lot - sometimes triple that amount.

I pay Canada Post for the $1,000 coverage and I send the parcel with tracking and signature.

Then I hold my breath.

Never had a problem.

Third party insurance is expensive and they will take your money - but they are like any other insurance company - read the fine print - It is very hard to get them to pay. And if you do get them to pay - it will take forever.

You can get full coverage from shippers like Fed Ex and UPS - but there is a big BUT - they will not insure it unless they pack it themselves and they will charge you up the ying yang for packing and the insurance.

Just go with Canada Post - you'll be fine.

[sylviebee]

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@rosscd57 wrote:

Third party insurance is expensive and they will take your money - but they are like any other insurance company - read the fine print - It is very hard to get them to pay. And if you do get them to pay - it will take forever.

Just go with Canada Post - you'll be fine.

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I'm not saying that I don't agree with you when you advise not to buy extra insurance (or even buy any extra insurance at all for that matter).

For the time being I have been spending the extra money and I'm pretty sure that I've come out ahead.

InsurePost has come through for me every time. I didn't find it hard to get reimbursed at all and the response time was always  immediate.

The amounts have all been under $300, but so far I have no complaints with the company and would recommend them.