buyer return fraud

[ladybug2785]

Greetings. Just had a buyer open a return case. The buyer bought a nice condition used music cd. It appears that the buyer has put the cd in a microwave oven and now wants a full refund of the item price plus shipping and has opened a return case. How to proceed with this?

Item number: 111654762401 Prozzak cd

I have attached the pictures from the return case.

[canadian.tree]

Maybe that small hairline crack on your picture upset the buyer he though he was getting a perfect cd. So he decided to torch it .

There is no reason for you to destroy a CD before shipping it out that will only cause problems for you.

The buyer on the other hand.. How new is the account and how are his recent feedback.

I suggest you report this buyer.

[maximus7001 · Accepted solution]

Basically ebay handling the matter like they did pretty much accused the OP of just that, microwaving it then sending it out.

This is a poor policy on the part of ebay.

I would suspect that the buyer and the sellers burnt by this are avoiding feedback altogether. The sellers avoiding it so they dont get a neg out of it and the bad buyer avoiding it so as not to draw attention to his scam so he can keep doing it.

[ladybug2785]

There was no crack. The cd was perfect as pictured in the auction. The white squiggly thing in picture #3 is a fluffy cat hair (white persian cat).

Also ebay has edited my posts in this thread. They must not be very used to dealing with reality very much.

[canadian.tree]

oh sorry I thought that was a crack , why does the cd look different on his not only put in the microwave but also the different color around the edges is gone I'm not sure if that could be a case just feel bad trying to give suggestions : /

[ladybug2785]

After looking it up I tried it myself to see what it looks like. A store bought cd or dvd burn in a microwave differently than a cdr or dvdr do. Also the bad buyer put the whole case and cd in and that is what burnt the insert. The burn pattern is a mirror image of the burns on the cd.

Just go to google and type in "microwave cd".

[ladybug2785]

So now the plot thickens. He is sending messages to my email address demanding $25US or he will leave a negative.

Can he get away with this?

[cars_trains_2]

Looks to me like feedback extortion which is against eBay policy. Don't cave in. If he is sending you message at your personal email address, save those in case you need to call eBay to have the negative removed.

[pjcdn2005]

You've already refunded him and now he wants more money....wow.

He is demanding it by email so that ebay isn't able to see it.  If it was a message through ebay I would ignore it but because you want a record of the demand that ebay can see, I would send him a message through ebay and copy and paste his email message (with headers) to the ebay message saying something like...

I received your email on ..... but wanted to reply through ebay as it is easier if all communication is in one place. You were refunded in full for your item on May xx and am unable to send you another $25 eBay doesn't allow sellers to 'buy' feedback.

Thank you,

I'm not very good at that type of letter but I would send something along that line. I do think that it is important that you get a copy of his message on an ebay message. I can't guarantee that it will help if he does leave a negative but it could help more than having it just on on an email.

[canuckchick]

I have a buyer who wants to return a $200 coat for a refund. She says its NOT shearling, when it clearly is, the label says so, its from Danier Leather, a reputable canadian company.  Apparently it doesn't fit right either - there's a tip-off.  I already paid free shipping to USA from Canada (about $30) and now she reports it as DEFECTIVE so I'm supposed to pay $30 to get it back.  

Out of curiosity I went into the womans id history - she's changed her username 4 times. I need to investigate the older usernames - just to see what kind of feedback she's left for others. Can somebody tell me how I do that?   Where is our ebay support - does anyone at ebay ever read these postings or we sellers just left to sink (or swim, if thats possible?) 

[canuckchick]

SOLUTION:  
I have discovered that once a USER ID is changed, you cannot uncover what destruction the customer has created in the past.  Another useful tool for thieves to use.  The Feedback System is officially useless. 

[raphael@ebay.com]

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@ladybug2785 wrote:

So now the plot thickens. He is sending messages to my email address demanding $25US or he will leave a negative.

Can he get away with this?

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Hi ladybug2785,

Sorry you have to deal with this individual. I recommend replying to your buyer via eBay messages and include a copy-paste of the email they sent you requesting $25 under threat of negative feedback. Something like this:

“I got this email from you:

[email copy]

Are you still going to leave me negative feedback if I don’t send you an additional $25?"

Please be sure to include the full email header so eBay can tell the email really came from the buyer. For information on what constitutes a full email header and how to get it, see this page: http://www.isipp.com/resources/email-headers/

Once this has been duly documented, if the buyer moves forward with their threat, we can remove the negative FB.

Best,

R.

[pjcdn2005]

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@canuckchick wrote:

I have a buyer who wants to return a $200 coat for a refund. She says its NOT shearling, when it clearly is, the label says so, its from Danier Leather, a reputable canadian company.  Apparently it doesn't fit right either - there's a tip-off.  I already paid free shipping to USA from Canada (about $30) and now she reports it as DEFECTIVE so I'm supposed to pay $30 to get it back.  

Out of curiosity I went into the womans id history - she's changed her username 4 times. I need to investigate the older usernames - just to see what kind of feedback she's left for others. Can somebody tell me how I do that?   Where is our ebay support - does anyone at ebay ever read these postings or we sellers just left to sink (or swim, if thats possible?) 

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It is frustrating when a customer 'fibs' so that they don't have to pay return shipping....especially with free shipping!   I notice that you accept returns on other items but it says no returns on this coat so maybe that's why they lied??  That still doesn't make it right but I do wonder if no return items are more likely to be claimed as snad rather than just as a return.  I suppose though that some people will lie regardless.

[pjcdn2005]

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@canuckchick wrote:

SOLUTION:  
I have discovered that once a USER ID is changed, you cannot uncover what destruction the customer has created in the past.  Another useful tool for thieves to use.  The Feedback System is officially useless. 

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If you can see the buyer's other id's by clicking on the history of her current id then the feedback you see is from her other id's as well. If a user just changes their id rather than starting a brand new id, the feedback number and feedback carry over.

[sylviebee]

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@ladybug2785 wrote:

So now the plot thickens. He is sending messages to my email address demanding $25US or he will leave a negative.

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How did evolve from a $7 refund to this? 

[maximus7001]

"Once this has been duly documented, if the buyer moves forward with their threat, we can remove the negative FB."

Thats it? What about being kicked off of ebay for good? And the money back that had to be refunded.

[femmefan1946]

Also toolhaus. org

[raphael@ebay.com]

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@maximus7001 wrote:

"Once this has been duly documented, if the buyer moves forward with their threat, we can remove the negative FB."

Thats it? What about being kicked off of ebay for good? And the money back that had to be refunded.

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When buyers exhibit a pattern for abuse, we do take action against them, which may go as far as indefinite suspension. What we don't do, however, is reveal the action taken, or the results of such investigations, to the public. We protect all members' privacy, even the bad ones 😉

As for the money lost on this sale, it's unfortunate, but since the refund was made voluntarily, we can't reverse that. Thankfully, buyers like this one are far from the norm; most transactions on eBay go relatively smoothly. We have 127 million active members worldwide who would agree with that. The occasional loss is part of the cost of doing business, just as it is the case with a brick & mortar retail business.

[pocomocomputing]

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raphael@ebay.com wrote:

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@maximus7001 wrote:

"Once this has been duly documented, if the buyer moves forward with their threat, we can remove the negative FB."

Thats it? What about being kicked off of ebay for good? And the money back that had to be refunded.

---

When buyers exhibit a pattern for abuse, we do take action against them, which may go as far as indefinite suspension. What we don't do, however, is reveal the action taken, or the results of such investigations, to the public. We protect all members' privacy, even the bad ones 😉

As for the money lost on this sale, it's unfortunate, but since the refund was made voluntarily, we can't reverse that. Thankfully, buyers like this one are far from the norm; most transactions on eBay go relatively smoothly. We have 127 million active members worldwide who would agree with that. The occasional loss is part of the cost of doing business, just as it is the case with a brick & mortar retail business.

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I am curious about the 127 million members worldwide number. How many in Canada and how many in the USA? What is the definition of active? Buying or selling or both in that number.

I suppose it is all a secret to give any details on the number.

How many active listings on eBay.com? ebay.ca Worldwide?

Just curious. We used to be able to get the listing numbers from third party sites but it was no longer possible to get that number a couple of years ago.

[canuckchick]

She already left me POSITIVE feedback, then apparently changed her mind - actually her husband changed her mind. 

Here's the feedback  "Really nice coat! A bit snug, but that is my fault! Definitely not yours! Thanks" - but now she want me to pay the shipping back because its SNAD. Why does ebay ALLOW these cases to be lodged without looking at the feedback? Dont get it.  

[raphael@ebay.com]

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@pocomocomputing wrote:

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raphael@ebay.com wrote:

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@maximus7001 wrote:

"Once this has been duly documented, if the buyer moves forward with their threat, we can remove the negative FB."

Thats it? What about being kicked off of ebay for good? And the money back that had to be refunded.

---

When buyers exhibit a pattern for abuse, we do take action against them, which may go as far as indefinite suspension. What we don't do, however, is reveal the action taken, or the results of such investigations, to the public. We protect all members' privacy, even the bad ones 😉

As for the money lost on this sale, it's unfortunate, but since the refund was made voluntarily, we can't reverse that. Thankfully, buyers like this one are far from the norm; most transactions on eBay go relatively smoothly. We have 127 million active members worldwide who would agree with that. The occasional loss is part of the cost of doing business, just as it is the case with a brick & mortar retail business.

---

I am curious about the 127 million members worldwide number. How many in Canada and how many in the USA? What is the definition of active? Buying or selling or both in that number.

I suppose it is all a secret to give any details on the number.

How many active listings on eBay.com? ebay.ca Worldwide?

Just curious. We used to be able to get the listing numbers from third party sites but it was no longer possible to get that number a couple of years ago.

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Unfortunately I am not at liberty to reveal more details on this number, but I can say it is worldwide and that "active" means having had activity on eBay over the past year.