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Latest Chit Chat webinar video

Summary: chicweb shared a link to Chit Chat's webinar video, highlighting its relevance for understanding CUSMA compliance issues. A detailed discussion ensued around the compliance of goods made in the USA and re-imported from Canada to the USA under the CUSMA agreement. The conversation included clarifications by various participants about the difference between duties and tariffs, the implications of shipping methods, and specific requirements for CUSMA compliance documentation. neotrendsstampco provided additional resources from Chit Chat, focusing on tariff calculations and implications of goods entering from Canada to the USA. The participants collectively explored nuances around tariff codes, sectoral tariffs, and potential exceptions under USMCA regulations, examining how different shipping arrangements could impact compliance.

I post it because they explain well and it could be useful for everyone.

Chit Chat just posted their last friday's webinar video online.

I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post the link here, but I'll take the risk since it's important in the current situation to understand a bit more.

https://chitchats.com/blog/webinaires-chit-chats

It's an hour long video. Grab a coffee. 😉

chicweb

1218 View listings

Posted 11 months ago·Last reply 11 months ago

18 comments

chicweb

OP11 months ago

I just saw something.

On the CBP page.
https://www.cbp.gov/trade/priority-issues/trade-agreements/free-trade-agreements/USMCA/FAQs

Are there exceptions to USMCA’s certification of origin requirement?
A certification of origin is not required for: (1) a non-commercial importation of a good, or (2) a commercial importation for which the value of the originating goods does not exceed US $2,500, provided the importation does not form part of a series of importations that may be considered to have been undertaken or arranged for purposes of evading United States laws, regulations, or procedures governing claims for preferential treatment. Note that even if the value of non-originating goods is less than US $2,500, a written statement certifying that the goods originate may still be required. Further, if CBP determines that an importation is part of a series of importations carried out or planned for purposes of evading compliance with preference requirements, the importer may be required to submit a certification of origin.

I wonder if sending by UPS (as an example) and not through Chit Chat, if that would be feasable.

cottagewoman

·11 months ago

Sectoral tariffs also will apply. They override the IEEPA tariff, and do not stack. Even if CUSMA compliant. ChitChats didn't bring that up, but it's how it'll work. Steel sectorals now include pretty much anything made out of steel or aluminum used in the kitchen, or anything in metal containers/packaging such as perfumes.
Try out the tariff estimator for your products, being sure to get the correct HTS code, in the conversation started on that subject, here's the link: https://tariffs.flexport.com

dinomitesales

·11 months ago

From what I understand (and this is all very complicated and clear as mud):

CUSMA only applies to imports from another country, so it covers items originating in CA/US/MX only when they cross the border into a different CUSMA country.

If something was made in the US and is being sent back to the US it is not considered an import from another country, and therefore CUSMA doesn't apply.

Duties are what is negotiated under CUSMA and based on HS code/origin.
Tarrifs are imposed on top of/separate to duties, under emergency powers (IEEPA), and are generally separate from CUSMA unless otherwise stated.

But all that being said, US goods returning to the US are basically treated as domestic origin shipments and should have a duty assessment of $0. CUSMA isn't relevant in this case.

mrdutch1001

·11 months ago

This is the latest info available for what ChitChats is requiring for CUSMA compliant items:

CUSMA Certification Information

CUSMA certification is still in progress – we are aiming to have it ready tomorrow so you can start to submit your SKUs for approval. We will send a notification as soon as it’s available in your Chit Chats account. To prepare have the following details available:

neotrendsstampco

·11 months ago

No Chichats shipments are not classified as postal shipments. They are a crossborder "commercial" shipper. Once their DDP system is running on the 28th of August we will find out how the tarrifs are calculated.

lacemaker3

·11 months ago

@neotrendsstampco wrote:
No Chichats shipments are not classified as postal shipments. They are a crossborder "commercial" shipper. Once their DDP system is running on the 28th of August we will find out how the tarrifs are calculated.

@neotrendsstampco,

OK, thanks for the info.

I am not disputing you, but why not? Am I incorrect in thinking that they take the packages to USPS facilities, to be delivered by USPS? Or is that only some of their packages?

If they are classified as "non postal shipments" (to use the terminology from the executive order), then they do have to collect all applicable duties, tariffs, fees and other charges. That would be ... disadvantageous ... I guess. There isn't any choice about how the charges are calculated if they are "non postal shipments".

I am too late to modify my earlier reply, so I will add a clarification here:

Items made in the US, which are being returned to the US, are only considered "country of origin = US" if they have NOT been repaired, modified, repackaged, altered, etc. while they were outside the US.

If any of that has occurred, then the "country of origin" would be where the repair, modification, repackaging, altering or etc. was done.

A bit of a gottcha.

neotrendsstampco

·11 months ago

If Items are not CUSMA (not denoted by "S" in the second column of the tariff schedule), then the HTS code tariff rate will apply, even they were originally made in the U.S.

Blanket tariff rate of 35% for U.S. originated items will not apply. Tariff rate will be anywhere from 0% and up, as indicated in the HTS schedule.

If it's Canadian goods and they do not fall under CUSMA, then the blanket rate of 35% will apply.

lacemaker3

·11 months ago

@neotrendsstampco wrote:
If Items are not CUSMA (not denoted by "S" in the second column of the tariff schedule), then the HTS code tariff rate will apply, even they were originally made in the U.S.
Blanket tariff rate of 35% for U.S. originated items will not apply. Tariff rate will be anywhere from 0% and up, as indicated in the HTS schedule.

If it's Canadian goods and they do not fall under CUSMA, then the blanket rate of 35% will apply.

Not if the items are being shipped by an "international postal shipment". That text is quoted from the EO 14324. If it is an "international postal shipment" then only the IEEPA tariff rate (or the specific duty per package fee) applies. Again, that is from tthe EO 14324.

If it is a "non postal shipment" then all the applicable duties, tariffs and other fees apply. Which could add up to more than 35% for an item with country of origin = Canada. It appears that is how Chit Chat shipments are being assessed.

neotrendsstampco

·11 months ago

Here is link to Chitchats FAQ from the Webinar:

https://chitchats.com/blog/ama-august-22-faqs

Here is one of the Question that was asked on the webinar:

US COUNTRY OF ORIGIN

For packages that would go DDP but are in fact items that are country of origin USA – how does this get handled. Just 0% tariff? I thought made in USA had 0 duties? I don’t understand how a tariff can apply to your own country? Why would we be charged the base duty rate for Made in the USA items?

CUSMA (Canada–United States–Mexico Agreement) is a free trade agreement that provides preferential duty treatment only for goods originating in one CUSMA country and imported into another.
If a product is U.S.-origin and is coming back into the U.S., it’s not an import from another country’s origin and therefore duties would be applicable based on the 10 digit HTS code and its respective base duty rate. Blanket tariffs will not apply. Reference more here
- *Chit Chats shipments are commercial transactions. Commercial transactions are not a valid form of reason for return, making the 3311 (CBP Form 3311 Declaration for Free Entry of Returned American Products) not applicable to Chit Chats. For any country of origin US items, we charge them on the base duty rate based off HTS schedule and no blanket tariffs apply.

lacemaker3

·11 months ago

@neotrendsstampco wrote:
Here is link to Chitchats FAQ from the Webinar:
https://chitchats.com/blog/ama-august-22-faqs

Here is one of the Question that was asked on the webinar:

US COUNTRY OF ORIGIN
For packages that would go DDP but are in fact items that are country of origin USA – how does this get handled. Just 0% tariff? I thought made in USA had 0 duties? I don’t understand how a tariff can apply to your own country? Why would we be charged the base duty rate for Made in the USA items?
CUSMA (Canada–United States–Mexico Agreement) is a free trade agreement that provides preferential duty treatment only for goods originating in one CUSMA country and imported into another.
If a product is U.S.-origin and is coming back into the U.S., it’s not an import from another country’s origin and therefore duties would be applicable based on the 10 digit HTS code and its respective base duty rate. Blanket tariffs will not apply. Reference more here
*Chit Chats shipments are commercial transactions. Commercial transactions are not a valid form of reason for return, making the 3311 (CBP Form 3311 Declaration for Free Entry of Returned American Products) not applicable to Chit Chats. For any country of origin US items, we charge them on the base duty rate based off HTS schedule and no blanket tariffs apply.

My understanding is that Chit Chat transports packages across tthe border and hands them off to USPS, right? So they would be considered "international postal shipments". The duties are calculated as described in Sec. 3 of the EO 14324.

Is Chit Chats using the "duty equivalent to the IEEPA tariff rate" to calculate how much duty is owed, or are they doing the "specific duty per package" fee based on the IEEPA tariff rate? They have to use the same method for all packages, and are only allowed to change methods once a month.

In the first case, an item made in the US, and not repaired or modified since it left the US, would (presumably) be duty-free, and there is no IEEPA ttariff rate on the US. So the cost should be zero.

In the second case, the "specific duty per package" fee would be $80, for an IEEPA tariff rate less than 16%.

The "specific duty" method will only be available for 6 months, until Feb 28, 2026.

chicweb

OP11 months ago

Here is a page on the US gov custom's site that explains about the Made in USA going back to the USA.

https://www.help.cbp.gov/s/article/Article-1148?language=en_US

lotzofuniquegoodies

·11 months ago

@chicweb wrote:
Here is a page on the US gov custom's site that explains about the Made in USA going back to the USA.

https://www.help.cbp.gov/s/article/Article-1148?language=en_US

@chicweb

Your documentation tidbit is what seems to be slipping through the cracks and not even being considered as a critical part of the process. Working for a manufacturer we had certificates of origin on file for what we made and shipped. Either it was included with documentaiton or noted on the wb to refer to what was on file. Task required. Task completed. Not like eBay labels includes an option for that. You have to get a pdf from an outside source to include. Entirely up to you to be CUSMA compliant.

The other thing that is key is that the/any state tax was already collected by eBay directly. So that it doesn't get applied twice. The only way for customs to know that is if a shipper/sender includes the packing slip confirming it was paid. Does the ebay shipping label state it was an eBay transaction. Not really.

chicweb

OP11 months ago

To be taken with a grain of salt, I asked an AI.

It seem I misunderstood.

--

Yes, it’s compliant under the Canada–United States–Mexico Agreement (CUSMA/USMCA).

Explanation
Product origin: The key rule under CUSMA is whether the product qualifies as “originating” in the U.S., Canada, or Mexico.

Made in USA: If your product was originally manufactured in the United States, it keeps its CUSMA origin status, regardless of being resold from Canada.

Cross-border resale: Storing it in Canada and then reselling/shipping it back to the U.S. does not affect its origin. As long as you can prove it is “Made in USA,” it still qualifies for preferential tariff treatment under CUSMA.

Documentation: To claim duty-free treatment, the importer (your U.S. buyer) or you (depending on the shipping arrangement) may need to provide a certification of origin (CUSMA certificate of origin or equivalent, often included on the commercial invoice).

What this means
No customs duties should apply when re-entering the U.S. (though local sales taxes may still apply).

If U.S. Customs requests proof of origin, you must be able to show that the product is indeed U.S.-made (e.g., “Made in USA” marking, supplier documentation, original invoice).

👉So yes: buying a U.S.-made product, holding it in Canada, and then reselling/shipping it to the U.S. is compliant with CUSMA.

chicweb

OP11 months ago

Annddd I just learned something important.

For CUSMA compliance.... If an item is made in the USA, and you have it in Canada....

If you sell it back to the USA, it is NOT CUSMA compliant ?

That's..... not very intelligent. To put it respectfully. Importing back a USA item into the USA will still have duties. Wow.

Do I understand it correctly?

marnotom!

·11 months ago

Are we really talking about duties or are we talking about tariffs? (I haven’t watched the video.)

chicweb

OP11 months ago

I'm not even sure.

I always thought that 98% of products made in Canada, Mexico and the USA would be tariff free. 35% tariffs on that 2% left (products not in CUSMA). But still needed to be sent DDP (With certitfication of origin from a broker, etc).

In the video, they seem to say that products made in the USA but sent from Canada (back to the USA) wouldn't be CUSMA compliant. I might have misunderstood.

lacemaker3

·11 months ago

@marnotom! wrote:
Are we really talking about duties or are we talking about tariffs? (I haven’t watched the video.)

Even in the executive order, both terms are used to describe what will be charged for packages. So I won't be stressing too much about the correct term to use.

Is EIS considered to be "international postal shipments"? Then, they will be charged either a duty equivalent to the IEEEA tariff rate for the counttry of origin, or a duty-specific per-package fee, detetrmined by the tariff rate.

marnotom!

·11 months ago

@lacemaker3 wrote:

Even in the executive order, both terms are used to describe what will be charged for packages. So I won't be stressing too much about the correct term to use.

There’s an important distinction between the two, though, when it comes to CUSMA.

“Duties” or lack thereof (depending on the item) are what are part of CUSMA. They’ve been negotiated and agreed upon.

“Tariffs” are what The Grand Poobah to the south of us has been slapping on foreign goods and merchandise in the name of national emergencies. No consulation or negotiation has been done with the Canada, Mexico, or other affected countries.

Something can have a tariff placed on it and still be technically “duty-free” when it comes to CUSMA.