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ups recipient refuse delivery, cost for sender | Selling | eBay Canada EN

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ups recipient refuse delivery, cost for sender

Summary: Participants discussed the situation where a package is refused by the recipient and the associated costs for the sender. The conversation explored various experiences and scenarios, with several participants sharing their views and seeking advice. No definitive solution or agreement was reached, but there was an exchange of valuable insights on handling delivery refusals and potential costs involved.

Hi, i had been blessed to never had a refuse delivery buyer due to C.O.D tax long enough until now.
With all the chaos on the tariffs/strike.
Buyer refused a ups delivery, tracking is shown it will be returned to sender . I have yet to heard from ups. I am wondering if i have to pay for the returning trip? And if so what rate would it fall under? Regular or the ebay generated rate since it was shipped via ebay label technically under ebay's ups account.
And the tax/declaration fee shouldn't have to be paid by me right since goods isnt going to end up delivered in usa.

goldhawkickz13

2362 View listings

Posted 1 year ago·Last reply 11 months ago

33 comments

marnotom!

·11 months ago

What UPS shipping method did you use, @vintage_america?

vintage_america

·11 months ago

UPS standard. Whatever the Cheapest eBay offers.

marnotom!

·11 months ago

What was the item and its country of origin?

vintage_america

·11 months ago

A bacpack made in China

goldhawkickz13

OP11 months ago

After two weeks of annoying uninformative customer service on phone rep, email rep.
X media rep was the most responsive.
I am finally communicating with a rep who claimed to be at the supervisor rank.
So here is the most updated information i have learned from this supervisor.
My item was 85usd.
_______
Original shipping via ebay label was approx $18cad.
Recipient said ups billed him $45usd for tariff.
_____
The return shipping is based on the ebay discount rate table.
It will be $27.07cad composed with $17 as shipping and $10 as "import charge "
And that would be it. All cost are there for returning merchandise.

But
And later today he contact me again adding new charges on the table
Saying theres another $2.62 "govt charge "
Another $25 brokage charge, plus $1 cod charge.
_____
So the amount kept adding/changing. It has zero criteria rule on what their procedure is.

______

goldhawkickz13

OP11 months ago

With all the previous information from a few rep that abandon shipment result in no further charges, as in sender do not need to pay for the unpaid tariff/duty recipient refused. Now this supervisor saying will be billed to sender. And additional admin charge will also apply. At this point its more like a scam.

goldhawkickz13

OP11 months ago

"Thank you for your patience.

These are the charges for abandoning the package:
Other government charges: 2.62
Total brokerage charges: 25.00
COD Exchange Rate: 1.00

And these for returning it to you:
Return to shipper charges: 27.07
Other government charges: 2.62
Total brokerage charges: 25.00
COD Exchange Rate: 1.00

The main difference is the return to shipper fee. The other charges need to be covered for either scenario. "

So regardless of return or abandon, they are charging a "govt charge "
$25 brokage and $1 cod charge
While return, is ebay rate plus this another govt import charge of $10

Ridiculous to need 20 30 days multiple channels from x, email phone to get to
supervisor rank personal more than 10 days to get this simple breakdown of list of fees from him.

And most of these are unjustified ups charges. $25 brokage and $1 cod fee?
Even when they already embeded $10 re-entry import charge on the return freight fee?

Ebay say if they charge they "will try their best to fight it" but pretty sure thats not going to hold up.

s_j_deals_on

·11 months ago

UPS has called me this week and wants me to pay for an item ebay customer refused coming from Canada to USA due to fees etc. Now they want me to pay $46 USD to get back my $65 sales item.

I told them to destroy the item. Then next day UPS delivered to me and tried to charge me anyway.

This whole Trump tariff thing is a mess.

vintage_america

·11 months ago

I thought UPS charges the buyer upon delivery. I don’t think they pre-pay them when it’s from eBay labels. Not positive. I had one chargeback since this mess started using UPS and I wasn’t required to pay the tariffs. I did have to pay the return shipping though.

If anyone can confirm whether UPS actually pre-pays tariffs on buyers behalf or not…would be helpful. My understanding is that they do not, and they just charge the buyer upon delivery. If it gets refused, then it gets returned to you without tariffs owing because nobody paid them.

I could be wrong but if anyone knows for certain, please chime in.

sapphyres-designer-jewellery

·11 months ago

@vintage_america wrote:
I thought UPS charges the buyer upon delivery. I don’t think they pre-pay them when it’s from eBay labels. Not positive. I had one chargeback since this mess started using UPS and I wasn’t required to pay the tariffs. I did have to pay the return shipping though.

If anyone can confirm whether UPS actually pre-pays tariffs on buyers behalf or not…would be helpful. My understanding is that they do not, and they just charge the buyer upon delivery. If it gets refused, then it gets returned to you without tariffs owing because nobody paid them.

I could be wrong but if anyone knows for certain, please chime in.

It's been posted here many times that UPS fronts the tariffs for the buyer (and charges the sender if the buyer doesn't pay). Several people who are sellers have been posting that they had to pay tariffs the buyer didn't pay.

Because the tariffs are IEEPA, they're not refundable if the package is not deliverable.

If you bought your label on eBay and didn't get charged... just wait... you probably will. UPS will charge the tariffs to eBay since it's their account, when they're administrative paperwork gets caught up, they deduct your account on eBay.

C.

vintage_america

·11 months ago

I just called UPS international
and they confirmed they do not pre-pay tariffs. It’s either the shipper or receiver who pay them. Unless that agent was mistaken it seems to be the case. But who really knows? It’s all messed up.

sapphyres-designer-jewellery

·11 months ago

@vintage_america wrote:
I just called UPS international
and they confirmed they do not pre-pay tariffs. It’s either the shipper or receiver who pay them. Unless that agent was mistaken it seems to be the case. But who really knows? It’s all messed up.

Either way, if the buyer doesn't pay, the seller will have to (whether UPS prepays them or not, they will collect from someone).

C.

vintage_america

·11 months ago

It’s been nearly 2 months and I have not been charged the refused tariffs or the brokerage fee. I was charged the return fee through eBay.

brettjet38

·1 year ago

@goldhawkickz13 wrote:
Hi, i had been blessed to never had a refuse delivery buyer due to C.O.D tax long enough until now.
With all the chaos on the tariffs/strike.
Buyer refused a ups delivery, tracking is shown it will be returned to sender . I have yet to heard from ups. I am wondering if i have to pay for the returning trip? And if so what rate would it fall under? Regular or the ebay generated rate since it was shipped via ebay label technically under ebay's ups account.
And the tax/declaration fee shouldn't have to be paid by me right since goods isnt going to end up delivered in usa.

...this is just one of the many reasons why I have NEVER used UPS or FedEx to ship outside Canada. It will be ONLY eIS for me and ALL International Buyers, The End.

If you cannot afford to pay the taxes, duties, and shipping, then honestly, you should not shop online outside your country of residence.

As a Seller, I have my own ongoing costs, and I will not "cover" a Buyer's legal obligations, especially for the USA and Trumpconomics

goldhawkickz13

OP1 year ago

oct 08,

ebay is now totally hands off the ordeal. told me to deal with ups directly, whatever rate they charges, they will just follow what ups charge them and charge it on seller balance.

but they do say it will not valid any rules if i decided to bill the buyer for all cost that is cause by his refusal of delivery as long as it's outside ebay.

on the ups side, their phone has a 80mins plus on hold time before the most uninformative conversation ever could happen.

the operator say on a return to sender on refuse deliver will need to be charged return shipping definately.

he does not know how they going to charge it, it will be $27USD in my situation.(approx $18cad when i shipped it out via ebay label), so it is still unclear that under what rate table they calculate this amount at wether it is ebay rate or regular counter rate. neither make sense as $27usd is too high compare to ebay rate used, too low to be regular counter rate.

insisted sender will NOT have to pay the tariff unpaid by the receipent regardless of return to sender or dispose package.

but all detail please contact ups customer service via email address that you will have to look for it online yourself .

so i had to dig deeper with twitter ups, they gave me the $27usd as well but no further information aside of please email ups customer service.

art-and-craft

·1 year ago

My case:

I sent a parcel out (to US) through UPS about 10 days ago, but it was returned to me yesterday. UPS printed on the return label "REAON FOR RETURN: ADD INFO/DOC REQ PENDING REL FROM AGY". That is beyond my comprehension, because I don't know what some of the abreviations mean.

From the tracking on UPS website, the parcel never got out of Canada (never over the border), before it was returned.

Can anyone (or eBay staff) translate the "ADD INFO/DOC REQ PENDING REL FROM AGY" part for me? Thank you in advance.

The real problem is that eBay sold that Shipping label to me (actually I purchased it from eBay), without giving me or the Buyer a chance to pay tariff. And because tariff was not paid upfront (before reaching US), UPS returned it to me. Today, I visited UPS, they said: "You have to pay tariff upfront." I asked how. They told me to go to UPS's website. But on UPS's website, I have to buy a shipping label and pay tariff at the same time -- meaning the shipping label I bought from eBay is useless. Why eBay sell such useless shipping label? Any eBay staff can explain?

We have all these discussions, but eBay staff never come out to explain. WHY? Aren't they here to help?

sapphyres-designer-jewellery

·1 year ago

@art-and-craft wrote:
My case:
I sent a parcel out (to US) through UPS about 10 days ago, but it was returned to me yesterday. UPS printed on the return label "REAON FOR RETURN: ADD INFO/DOC REQ PENDING REL FROM AGY". That is beyond my comprehension, because I don't know what some of the abreviations mean.
From the tracking on UPS website, the parcel never got out of Canada (never over the border), before it was returned.

Can anyone (or eBay staff) translate the "ADD INFO/DOC REQ PENDING REL FROM AGY" part for me? Thank you in advance.

I'm guessing... "Additional Information/Document required pending release from agency".

Although UPS is DDU... the buyer pays the tariff. Not sure why they're telling you that you have to pay it up front. Maybe someone can comment if that's a new requirement by UPS?

C.

art-and-craft

·1 year ago

Thanks SDJ.

I went to UPS this afternoon. They put up a sign on their counter. The sign reads:"IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please be advised that all shipments going to the USA is subject to import charges. The shipper will be responsible for the import charges for packages going outside Canada including the return shipments." I believe that means Canadian sellers have to pay import charges upfront for parcles going to USA. I took a photo of the sign, it's in my cellphone. If anyone want to see it, please let me know how to send it to you.

As for this "Additional Information/Document required pending release from agency".

Questions:

1. agency refers to whom?

2. "Additional Information/Document required" from whom? (Seller? the agency? )

"REAON FOR RETURN: ADD INFO/DOC REQ PENDING REL FROM AGY"

My guess is "(Shipper) add information/document required", "Pending release from agency".

But what "information/document" is required? I already provided description of the item -- Inuit soapstone carving, Country of origin: Canada, HTSUS: 6815.99.20.00, Quantity: 1
Value: CND $55.

Tracking ealier shows: "Your package is pending release from a Government Agency. Once they release it, your package will be on its way. Caledon, ON, Canada"

This "REAON FOR RETURN" is given by the agency? or by UPS?

UPS makes things mysterious for me.

sapphyres-designer-jewellery

·1 year ago

@art-and-craft wrote:
Thanks SDJ.
I went to UPS this afternoon. They put up a sign on their counter. The sign reads:"IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please be advised that all shipments going to the USA is subject to import charges. The shipper will be responsible for the import charges for packages going outside Canada including the return shipments." I believe that means Canadian sellers have to pay import charges upfront for parcles going to USA. I took a photo of the sign, it's in my cellphone. If anyone want to see it, please let me know how to send it to you.

As for this "Additional Information/Document required pending release from agency".
Questions:
1. agency refers to whom?
2. "Additional Information/Document required" from whom? (Seller? the agency? )

"REAON FOR RETURN: ADD INFO/DOC REQ PENDING REL FROM AGY"
My guess is "(Shipper) add information/document required", "Pending release from agency".
But what "information/document" is required? I already provided description of the item -- Inuit soapstone carving, Country of origin: Canada, HTSUS: 6815.99.20.00, Quantity: 1
Value: CND $55.

Tracking ealier shows: "Your package is pending release from a Government Agency. Once they release it, your package will be on its way. Caledon, ON, Canada"

This "REAON FOR RETURN" is given by the agency? or by UPS?
UPS makes things mysterious for me.

For the UPS sign, I believe you, this must be from buyers in the US refusing to pay duties on their packages and it having to be charged back to the seller. So perhaps they've changed things so the seller always pays up front (maybe others can verify this info).

Agency would likely to be Customs and Border Protection (US). The information is likely required from you, the seller/shipper.

For an inuit carving that would imply it's made in Canada from Canadian materials, so I'm going to guess they want to see a CUSMA certificate so your item can be shipped duty free. There should be a template available online you can download (I don't think I can attach it to this message, plus I think the copy I have has information prefilled in that's specific to my shipments).

This is my best guess, I don't use UPS and haven't had this happen, but I'm starting to become a shipping expert since I keep mailing things to the US and having to provide additional information for US Customs.

C.

art-and-craft

·1 year ago

Thanks SDJ.

In the past, when I purchased shipping labels from eBay, I was given 3 options -- Canada Post, UPS, and FedEx. Now that eBay stopped providing Canada Post's service for 2 reasons: strike and not tariff ready, UPS, and FedEx are the 2 options available. The worse thing is that when I purchase a UPS shipping label from eBay, eBay does not give me a chance to pay US import charges. And UPS does not allow me/shipper to pay US import charges without buying a shipping label directly from UPS. Buying a shipping label directly from UPS costs much more than from eBay.

flipistics

·1 year ago

@art-and-craft wrote:
Thanks SDJ.

In the past, when I purchased shipping labels from eBay, I was given 3 options -- Canada Post, UPS, and FedEx. Now that eBay stopped providing Canada Post's service for 2 reasons: strike and not tariff ready, UPS, and FedEx are the 2 options available. The worse thing is that when I purchase a UPS shipping label from eBay, eBay does not give me a chance to pay US import charges. And UPS does not allow me/shipper to pay US import charges without buying a shipping label directly from UPS. Buying a shipping label directly from UPS costs much more than from eBay.

I believe Click Ship allows you to prepay them with UPS. I haven't personally tried though as I'm going to wait for eIS to come in. I'm also not 100% sure if their quotes include the brokerage fees or not (I think they probably don't for standard but might for 3 day select)? Something you'd have to ask about.

goldhawkickz13

OP1 year ago

art-and-craft,
I dont think tariff not paid has to do with it return back to you in your situation.
The ups person you ask is most likely just a franchise location clerk that didnt even hear your explanation/inquiries.
From what you said it sounds like it was returned back to you without even crossing boarder because of whatever documents declaration are missing.

As for ebay staff not showing up here, quite frankly speaking most of them do not really know.

reallynicestamps

·1 year ago

Oh and if you do decide to refund the buyer, which is generally Accepted Practice, if not Good Practice, You are entitled to base the refund on the buyer's payment, less ALL your costs, which might include that tariff as well as the shipping fees, insurance, packaging, eBay fees, etc.

ilikehockeyjerseys

·1 year ago

They will bill you for the customs fee. It will be taken out of your eBay account at a later date.

The way that eBay views it as that buyers agree in the TOS to pay for import fees. Therefore, refusing a package due to import fees invalidates the transaction (they lose their buyer protection). That's something to keep in mind if you expect to be hit with massive fees based on the actions of the buyer.

goldhawkickz13

OP1 year ago

Yes, i was praying he would pick refuse delivery when he wanted to back out of the purchase after ups contacted him for the C.O.D tariff bill. If he was to pay for it, file a return request. I could have potentially lose more cost on paying for a non ebay rated ups label for him since canada post is dead for now.
I know on same refuse delivery return to sender situation for canada post would have been free of charge on the return trip.
I just dont know about ups, esp with that unpaid tariff from the buyer.
I dont know if ups needs to charge Shipping fee on the return to sender trip, if so base on regular account rate or ebay shipping label rate.
Then that unpaid tariff, since goods are not ending up in usa, the cost shouldn't be charge when it comed back into canada. I could see the admin fee might apply but noway the tariff part.
Just want to see if anyone knows more
Ebay cs was no use at all. Told me to deal with it myself with ups.

sapphyres-designer-jewellery

·1 year ago

@goldhawkickz13 wrote:

Then that unpaid tariff, since goods are not ending up in usa, the cost shouldn't be charge when it comed back into canada. I could see the admin fee might apply but noway the tariff part.

Yes, the seller has to pay the unpaid tariff. To import the item, the tariff is paid by UPS to CBP on import, so the tariff has already been paid by the time the buyer refuses the package. UPS is sure to recoup this cost from the eBay seller if the buyer doesn't pay.

C.

goldhawkickz13

OP1 year ago

Had a long phone chat with ebay shipping department.
1. Does ups charge the returning trip shipping?
Yes they will.
2. Under ebay ups discount rate or regular joe rate?
They do not know.
3. Are they(ups) going to force that unpaid tariff tab by buyer on sender?
Yes they will.
4. How they are going to charge it?
Put it on the ebay payment running balance.

my items being 90usd, transaction 110usd. Paid 20 for shipping out.
The tariff is 45usd, without knowing how much the return shipping is.
It is going to cost too much to have it return back.
It is such a shame i wanted to try preserve the item because it is a collectible with very slime chance of manufacture producing reissue in the future.
It is the S.h.figuarts my hero academia midoriya bakugo effect set.
I could see bandai keep reissue the character itself but the effect set not likely.
So one unit will be gone from the collectible world.

dinomitesales

·1 year ago

Be prepared to pay both the return shipping charges at counter rates, plus the amount for duty/brokerage that the buyer failed to pay. Anything less than that amount is a bonus.

You might be able to contact UPS and have the package abandoned so you don't have to pay return shipping charges, but you're still going to have to pay the duty/brokerage charges; UPS paid those up front and needs to be reimbursed somehow.

reallynicestamps

·1 year ago

@ilikehockeyjerseys

https://www.ebay.ca/help/policies/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy/ebay-money-back-guarantee-policy?...

I agree.

EBay does not require the seller to refund anything on a Refused/Underliverable shipment.

UPS/FedEx or a credit card? Different question.

triplecgirl

·1 year ago

This happened to me before the end of August. UPS was already collecting duties and charging brokerage fees. On 250..00USD worth of made in China craft punches, the duty was 93.00 USD, brokerage fees were close to 50.00USD . I just paid it. If the buyer refuses delivery, the seller gets charged by UPS. I called UPS about this. Just the way it is. I am a good sellerand I know when it is time to chalk things up to a learning experience.
The buyer also got an assessmanet fee later from UPS for 36USD, whatever the heck that was. She said that she would pay would pay that amount as she is a good buyer.
Soooo....no more shipping to the good old US of A for me. Just not worth it.

recyclagest-bruno

·1 year ago

Agreed with you

sapphyres-designer-jewellery

·1 year ago

@goldhawkickz13 wrote:
Hi, i had been blessed to never had a refuse delivery buyer due to C.O.D tax long enough until now.
With all the chaos on the tariffs/strike.
Buyer refused a ups delivery, tracking is shown it will be returned to sender . I have yet to heard from ups. I am wondering if i have to pay for the returning trip? And if so what rate would it fall under? Regular or the ebay generated rate since it was shipped via ebay label technically under ebay's ups account.
And the tax/declaration fee shouldn't have to be paid by me right since goods isnt going to end up delivered in usa.

Not sure if return shipping applies, I don't ship with UPS.

But you know those tariffs you buyer refused to pay? Be prepared to get a bill for them. Do you know how much it is? How much was the item worth?

If UPS can't get your buyer to pay the duty/tax on delivery, they will bill that back to you as the sender. If you bought the label on eBay, they will bill it back to eBay who will take the money from you later. That may take some weeks to happen.

C.