Expedited Lite Label - Size Discrepancy- Charged Full Expedited!

[teenytrinkets]

Be VERY VERY careful when you buy an expedited lite label if your package size or weight is close to the limits.

I recently bought an expedited lite label for $8.49. Then 2 days later was charged $12.48 shipping for the same order. No notification. No details.

After a VERY painful series of agent conversations where no one had any idea why, and started nitpicking my shipping methods and charges in my listings (sighhhhh) I finally got my query escalated to a supervisor and found out that the extra charge was from Canada Post. No details other than it was because of "volumetric weight".

This has happened to me before with Canada Post small biz, and I'm able to see the details in my account. Here however, I got nothing. This is what the supervisor said:

"Reach out to your carrier to deal with the discrepancy. We have to take what they say"

I said, "okay, but how do I do this? I don't have a receipt with Canada Post showing details. My transaction is with ebay. And you haven't given me any details to work with. I can't see my package details anymore. It says "5x5x5" dimensions on my label. How can I possibly dispute this?"

Response: "We cannot dispute their fees".

devon@ebay

How can I dispute this with Canada Post? Is there some way for sellers to obtain the details of the shipment?

Is there possibly an issue with Ebay's shipping calculator that's producing an Expedited Lite label, when in fact the package was too large?

I'm trying to pinpoint if this is an ebay label calculator error, or if this was a one time error in sizing the package at the Canada Post warehouse.

It's very clear to me that ebay customer service is NOT equipped to handle queries about these labels. I spent nearly 2 hours on this issue this morning. PAINFUL!

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@teenytrinkets wrote:
Be VERY VERY careful when you buy an expedited lite label if your package size or weight is close to the limits.

I recently bought an expedited lite label for $8.49. Then 2 days later was charged $12.48 shipping for the same order. No notification. No details.

After a VERY painful series of agent conversations where no one had any idea why, and started nitpicking my shipping methods and charges in my listings (sighhhhh) I finally got my query escalated to a supervisor and found out that the extra charge was from Canada Post. No details other than it was because of "volumetric weight".

This has happened to me before with Canada Post small biz, and I'm able to see the details in my account. Here however, I got nothing. This is what the supervisor said:

"Reach out to your carrier to deal with the discrepancy. We have to take what they say"

I said, "okay, but how do I do this? I don't have a receipt with Canada Post showing details. My transaction is with ebay. And you haven't given me any details to work with. I can't see my package details anymore. It says "5x5x5" dimensions on my label. How can I possibly dispute this?"

Response: "We cannot dispute their fees".

devon@ebay

How can I dispute this with Canada Post? Is there some way for sellers to obtain the details of the shipment?

Is there possibly an issue with Ebay's shipping calculator that's producing an Expedited Lite label, when in fact the package was too large?

I'm trying to pinpoint if this is an ebay label calculator error, or if this was a one time error in sizing the package at the Canada Post warehouse.

It's very clear to me that ebay customer service is NOT equipped to handle queries about these labels. I spent nearly 2 hours on this issue this morning. PAINFUL!

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@teenytrinkets 

devon@ebay 

This is definitely a major glitch if eBay labels are not correctly applying the measurements the seller is inputting. IF the parcel is over the limit based on its calculations (which I am fairly sure ARE being incorrectly calculated based on CP rules for cubing) the system should automatically remove the service as not available. Based on the measurements. If you enter 201 grams it removes the system removes Expedited Lite as an option when creating a listing. It should do it the same dimensional weight parcels. The 5 x 5 x 5  cm. In all seriousness unsure anyone would even have access to a box that size. (For US purposes that would be 2"x2"x2".) Not large enough for address labels/stamps or a CP parcel shipment label. Unless it was shrunk to a microscopic size.

eBay labels needs to be applying the inputted data and printing as entered. Not over riding data on a whim.

-Lotz

****If this is happening to parcels that should qualify for Expedited Lite it would mean that buyers are being invoiced incorrectly. After the fact there is NO way to correctly charge the customer for any difference. Any revised bills received by sellers NEED to include a explanation as to why it got any additional billing. This is an eBay problem. Not a seller problem. 

[teenytrinkets]

I've tested the calculations and it seems fine. I've been regularly using a box that is 26x16x7cm (27x17x7cm is the max volumetric limit of 3220 cubic cm), so obviously that's been very risky because Canada Post only needs to be off by a couple of cm to charge more.

My beef is that Ebay takes a hands off approach with regards to disputes about massive shipment overcharge adjustments (I say "massive" because the shipping charge is doubled or tripled - were not talking about an extra $2.76 on a $25 package). I would have no problem disputing directly with Canada Post if Ebay gave me the necessary documentation to do so. I can't dispute anything without proper receipts that contain specific shipment details. I'm also not even sure I can dispute anything with Canada Post when my payment transaction is with eBay.

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@teenytrinkets wrote:

I've tested the calculations and it seems fine. I've been regularly using a box that is 26x16x7cm (27x17x7cm is the max volumetric limit of 3220 cubic cm), so obviously that's been very risky because Canada Post only needs to be off by a couple of cm to charge more.

My beef is that Ebay takes a hands off approach with regards to disputes about massive shipment overcharge adjustments (I say "massive" because the shipping charge is doubled or tripled - were not talking about an extra $2.76 on a $25 package). I would have no problem disputing directly with Canada Post if Ebay gave me the necessary documentation to do so. I can't dispute anything without proper receipts that contain specific shipment details. I'm also not even sure I can dispute anything with Canada Post when my payment transaction is with eBay.

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@teenytrinkets 

This is a major issue. eBay owns the CP eBay Label  account so claims have to be routed directly through eBay. There is no log for any claims and those include label surcharges, late, lost or damaged shipments. Plus no reference number is available from eBay on any claims. Simple process when you are the owner of the account other than the issue where in some cases full contact information would be required like a valid phone and email address for the buyer. Those are often not correct or missing. If CP does not have that info in most cases any claim will be rejected.

-Lotz

[msau4301]

Is it possible it's the weight and not the measurments that put it over? I thought the 5 x 5 x 5 was some kind of code that identified it as Ebay's special Expedited Lite since the label itself prints out reading Expedited Parcel.

I've been lucky (knock on wood) and all mine have been okay but I pretend the amount is 150 grams (though I once did 180 grams) just in case by the time I print out and tape up the label I put it over by a teeny amount if they are very strict with that weight.

[msau4301]

Just thought I should add by pretend it's 150 I mean in my mind that's the maximum, I always put the true weight, I have a scale at small kitchen scale at home I use and if it's close to 200 I don't try it just in case.

[teenytrinkets]

@lotzofuniquegoodies

Yeah, I guess all is well with Ebay shipping labels until there is a problem with the shipment.

I can understand their delay in getting customer service staff up to speed on supporting label issues (as annoying and time consuming as it is), but I was VERY unhappy about how flippantly I was treated after my issue was escalated. The "not my problem" attitude by the supervisor was abysmal.

The customer service staff usually thank me for my 22 years of loyalty. For the almost- two hours I was dealing with this, they just treated me like a new ebay seller that didn't know what they were doing. Very disappointing!!!

[teenytrinkets]

@msau4301

It was definitely the box size because the weight was 169g (and I usually over estimate by about 10g). But it's hard to say what Canada Post did, because I have no details about the surcharge.

This is the first time I've ever shipped where surcharges result in such a significant increase in shipping charge. That's what makes it especially problematic not to be able to formally dispute it, because we're not dealing with a 10-20% increase in charges - but 150% increase in charges.

I have photos of the package, and I have the label with the weight - but that's all the information I have access to, besides the charges from ebay with no details and no paper trail. I can't even dispute these charges with my credit card, because they come directly from my ebay earnings or my bank account.

This all makes ebay labels very risky business. Especially when they take a hands off approach and tell you it's Canada Post's problem, and not theirs!

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@teenytrinkets wrote:
@lotzofuniquegoodies

Yeah, I guess all is well with Ebay shipping labels until there is a problem with the shipment.

I can understand their delay in getting customer service staff up to speed on supporting label issues (as annoying and time consuming as it is), but I was VERY unhappy about how flippantly I was treated after my issue was escalated. The "not my problem" attitude by the supervisor was abysmal.

The customer service staff usually thank me for my 22 years of loyalty. For the almost- two hours I was dealing with this, they just treated me like a new ebay seller that didn't know what they were doing. Very disappointing!!!

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@teenytrinkets 

@msau4301 

FYI

Regarding the original billing it appeared in the past that eBay was verifying CP shipments when they arrived at a sort plant. This was causing delays for charges to process. As of late shipments are being charged in around the 24 hr mark.  As for the lag time for corrected audited shipments most likely that is being handled at your local sort plant.

I do remember years ago using Purolator we would sometimes get the charges for our shipments bills (hand written bills) would be marked manually audited with the reason. Totally transparent. As I recall the charges would be highlighted to make easy to spot.

-Lotz

For my recent fiasco with a voided bill both labels were charged less than 24 hrs after being generated but before correct label had arrived at my local depot where it was scanned. Most clerks would not be auditing every prepared shipment that they see unless something happens to be substantially off.

[msau4301]

Okay, so wasn't the weight, definitely unfortunate, we shouldn't have to worry about this, since they have been really promoting the eBay labels as a whole with their reduced rates and the Lite wouldn't it be nice if they designated someone manage/be in charge of eBay labels (I know, I know, we can dare to dream.)

Let's hope it was a one off freak occurance and you can get it resolved. I've not had it happen and not sure how we can ever see/find our real dimensions/weight after the automatic change. I checked my receipts (the ones Canada Post counter gives  when they're dropped off) and definitely no info on them other than the postal code and tracking number. Do keep us posted if you find a way through this.🤞

[flipistics]

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@teenytrinkets wrote:

I've tested the calculations and it seems fine. I've been regularly using a box that is 26x16x7cm (27x17x7cm is the max volumetric limit of 3220 cubic cm), so obviously that's been very risky because Canada Post only needs to be off by a couple of cm to charge more.

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Just to be clear, you are ACTUALLY measuring each box when you create the label, right? I've had plenty of boxes where the QC was a bit lacking and they can easily be a few centimeters larger in any direction. It wouldn't be an issue if you weren't right up against the limits, but it's worth mentioning since you are.

[sparx_63]

Yep, just had this happen to me.

Bought  a label for a package 6 x 4 1/2 x 4 1/2 actually measuring to the greater cm was 16 x 13 x 13 = 2704 cc and was about 170g.  Bought an expedited lite label for $7.77  Burlington to Victoria.  I was charged an additional $10.16 on Feb 6. 

Chatted with EBAY service rep today and was referred to Canada Post.  Called Canada Post and was told the item was charged full expedited with no oversize charges /escalation charge from expedited lite. He could not tell me the weight but informed me the size was recorded correctly.  He told me they will not re-imburse because the re-imbursement needs to be initiated by the third party platform (EBAY).  

I chatted EBAY back and was told in no uncertain terms by the CSR that EBAY does not have the money as they have refunded to Canada Post.  I was told will have to re-call Canada Post.  I tried to argue the point politely, but was disconnected. 

I did call Canada Post again, went through a customer service rep, escalated to senior customer rep, and finally escalated to a supervisor who said she will write me an official Canada Post supervisor document that I can forward to EBAY explaining to them that they (EBAY) must be the ones to initiate any claims to Canada Post pertaining to postage purchased through their portal. (i.e. Seller initiates claim to EBAY, EBAY apples to Canada Post for refund, Canada Post refunds EBAY who refunds seller).

All that only took about three hours.  Tomorrow I get the email and take on the beast.  

Wish me luck 🙂

[teenytrinkets]

@sparx_63
Thank you, thank you, thank you! Your situation sounds exactly like my own (dates and similar box sizes and weights), only you got much farther than I did!

I will PM you tomorrow, as I would like to follow-up with you personally to discuss.

[teenytrinkets]

@flipistics

Yes, I measure my boxes exactly, usually add a cm or two. Same with weight. Sounds like Canada Post went slaphappy on February 6th and charged full expedited for some packages that had correct expedited lite postage labels.

[flipistics]

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@teenytrinkets wrote:
@flipistics

Yes, I measure my boxes exactly, usually add a cm or two. Same with weight. Sounds like Canada Post went slaphappy on February 6th and charged full expedited for some packages that had correct expedited lite postage labels.

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I'm curious, try putting the address into Canada Post's address complete (canadapost.ca/ac). I wonder if the buyer put the wrong postal code or address and it caused some kind of recalculation when corrected?  It's probably an API problem, but it would be good to rule something like this out too.

I did check through my labels for the past few months and there were no issues. A couple differed by a few cents and one shipped for two bucks less than I was quoted (nice!) but nothing significant.

[aviatorsparadise]

When you are that close to the limits you are pushing your luck, its very easy for a staff member at Canada post to add a CM by holding the measuring tape wrong. Best to get a bit more wiggle room for any measuring errors. Sometimes it can even be silly things like there was a bit too much packaging in the box so the lid isn't flat anymore and added a cm to the height.

Any shipping transaction issues I've had have been solved via chat where they opened a dispute for me without complaints.

[sparx_63 · Accepted solution]

Hello Teenytrinkets

After much waiting today, I have received the response from Canada Post.  It turns out that after all, Canada Post is responsible for repayment of the overcharges. I have received an email from the senior customer service representative in Winnepeg apologizing for their mistake, and asking me to upload , if possible, information data from EBAY of the transaction record. I replied that I was most happy to do so.  

At least maybe now there is a definitive answer on who to get the money from 🙂

What others will need to do to solve some of the unverified overcharging issues is to open a ticket with Canada post customer service and escalate to the senior level.  Hope this is helpful.

Sparx

[teenytrinkets]

@sparx_63

Thanks, that's super helpful! Can you tell me what information you provided them with to allow them to first look up your transaction and then later to investigate your claim? Ebay was no help with guiding me on this matter. 

The reason I ask is that if I have to make an inquiry in the future, it is likely the Canada Post representative will have no idea what I'm talking about! It sounds like you needed a senior rep at head office just to do this, and spent hours getting to this point. I have a feeling it will not be a simple task if you had to do it again - unless you had a direct line to this same individual. 

[teenytrinkets]

@aviatorsparadise

They don't hand measure at the DC/Warehouse. Packages go through machines to measure volumetric weight. I measure with extra buffer, so in my experience with surcharges, they are usually the result of a misshapen box.

But one thing is clear, I cannot use this box anymore because it's too close to the max size! Shame because I have a lot of these boxes.

[sparx_63]

Hello

Within the email from the Canada Post CSR she apologized for the mistake and asked for documentation if possible showing the EBAY transaction history for that item. 

I use Sellers Hub, so the path for that for me is Sellers HUb>Payments>All Transactions> Order number where I then insert order number & search.  Only the applicable transaction with charges and payments will show.  It will show any extra charges for labels, what the order number and tracking number were etc.

Then do a ctrl P to print to pdf (reduce to fit on one page) and save to applicable folder.  That pdf can then be attached to your email response to Canada Post.  

It may take you some time to find a Canada Post CSR that has the authority to help you.  Be persistent, and if the person talking to you cannot help, escalate by asking for their supervisor.  Once you get the supervisor, you can begin the email thing.  Once that is done, you will have your permanent go to at Canada Post for issues that cannot be solved easily 🙂

Hope that helps

Sparx