import charges

[Anonymous]

I just bought a musical instrument accessory on eBay, US$29.99. The import charge levied by Pitney-Bowes (who have some sort of shipper/warehouse/fee collector relationship with eBay) was almost US$10. 30% of the cost of the item. Outrageous.

I would like to know how Pitney-Bowes configures this, what the formula is. If I were to buy a used saxophone from the US and have it shipped to Canada, in addition to the shipping costs, would I have to pay P-B US$200.?

I won't call this a scam, but it sure stinks.

What would help is a full, thorough explanation from someone about why the fee is collected, where the money goes, and why the fee is not "up front" in the item advertising.

[pierrelebel]

"was almost US$10"

If it came by mail and taxes were levied by Canada Customs, the Post Office would have charged you $9.95 handling fee in addition to whatever taxes apply to your province.

[i*m-still-here]

I's a sort of relay system used by some US sellers.  The seller charges a certain amount for shipping, and then ships the item to a P-B hub.  P-B adds about $10 to the cost of shippingg, and in cases where the item is over $20 (in the case of Canada) they also add any applicable duty and taxes and then remit that to our government.

It's probably like UPS where you only get nailed once, but its one of those things that is making buying on ebay a mine field.

You really have to watch where you step and I'll bet you don't get nailed by that one again!

[theafkgamer]

That really sucks. The only reason I would stick to using CP/USPS as apposed to courier services would be that low value items would slip through customs, as opposed to DHL or FedEx dinging you for being $5 over the limit.

This is really going to kill every single ebay buyer living outside of the US.

[i*m-still-here]

""This is really going to kill every single ebay buyer living outside of the US. "" 

Not Really.

Only a few sellers are using it an if you pay attention you can id the items being shipped that way because there is a blurb about import fees or some such thing.

Simply avoid those items.

If it becomes universal it could mean the end of international buying and selling on ebay on a large scale.

If I were denrus I'd ask the seller to cancel the sale and re-list as a BIN and ship the normal way.

The sooner the system dies the better.

[tobyshitzu]

It isnt open for all sellers to sign up yet.  There are american sellers complaining they havent got the invite to sign up and want to.  They are offering some 50% off fvf, for months,to sign up.   There will be more and more listing with it, it isn't going anywhere.  The low price stuff that doesn't make sense to use it wasn't going to sell to canada anymore with the new FCI rate anyway

[theafkgamer]

I read somewhere that eventually, ebay would like to implement this for all sellers.

I said my previous statement under that premise.

[dcd66]

It sucks. 

Their global shipping program add 40% of the final price.

I will stop to buy in USA and eventually on ebay

[rose-dee]

I read somewhere that eventually, ebay would like to implement this for all sellers.

Yes, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it become mandatory for all U.S. sellers.  I've seen how hard eBay has been promoting the GSP to U.S. sellers.     

It's a gold mine for P-B, eBay and the Canadian government (or whatever country is involved).  Canada Customs doesn't charge GST/HST and a fee on every single parcel over $20, even though anything over $20 is exigible, so this way they're collecting without any effort.  The same applies for every other non-U.S. government. 

I've noticed the couriers (like FedEx) are doing the same thing.  If this gets big enough, the Cdn. government will soon be able to rely on third parties to collect much of their incoming consumer taxes for them, and can save even more money by cutting back border services that are no longer required. 

It's win-win-win for eBay, P-B and governments outside the U.S., and a losing proposition all around for non-U.S. buyers, but I fear it may be the way of the future for Canadian consumers.

[mr_mcs]

If I see import fees on an auction I automatically forget it, no matter how good a deal, in fact it's the first thing I look for now.  THIS HAS TURNED OFF ALMOST EVERY RED BLOODED CANADIAN FROM BUYING ON EBAY!!!  IT WILL KILL THEM.   The fact of the matter is, yes $20 is suppose to be the cut off, but anything sent USPS Priority under $60 rarely if ever gets touched, in fact I haven't had anything under $100 touches in 2 years as long as it is sent USPS Priority.  UPS, that's another story!   So, now I am suppose to pay an extra $20, $30 or $40 dollars on an item that I wouldn't normally pay on?  I DON'T THINK SO!   I AM SO FED UP WITH RIDICULOUS EBAY POLICIES I AM ALMOST READY TO GIVE UP AND SHOP SOMEWHERE ELSE. 

[diecast_baron]

It's sad really...eBay is continuously finding new ways to TAKE TAKE TAKE as MUCH MUCH MUCH as they can! I'm also getting sick of this. Over hundreds of purchases (the vast majority being over $20) I've only been dinged a handfull of times on the taxes. Now I see more and more sellers participating in this  program and it's causing me to ignore greater numbers of items/sellers as a result. I don't understand why eBay isn't simply dealing with the shipping and leaving the import taxes to the governments and customs....why add this fee up front? Just seems like another blatant CASH GRAB on eBay's part. 

I'm sorry eBay, if you keep this up, I'm going to have to turn my back on you. I'm by far not the biggest user of the system, but I've been registered since 1998 and I'm getting sick of seeing costs rise - selling and buying. When is real competition going to step up and take a bite of their monopoly??!? Ebay has gotten too big and arrogant....that's what happens when a company runs un-opposed for so long. You can kiss my shiny metal.....

[marnotom!]

What this debate--on this thread and elsewhere--about the Global Shipping Program has really opened my eyes to is just how many eBay users don't seem to or don't want to understand is that almost anything they purchase from outside of Canada is subject to having consumption or use taxes (i.e. PST/GST/HST/QST) slapped on it, even if sent by mail.  If one has a postal import with a declared value of more than C$20 and Canadian Border Services doesn't assess taxes owing on it, that's a bonus, it's gravy.  It shouldn't be assumed as a "given" for any non-Canadian purchase.

The GSP may have its issues, but I think it's uncharitable to call it a "rip-off" for simply assessing and charging for taxes that should be payable regardless of how the item is shipped.  The issue is with federal law in this case, not the GSP.

[i*m-still-here]

Thing is........... the standard has become not to collect these additional fees.

The reason the GSP is experienced as so intrusive is because it's not the standard way of doing things.

I've noticed that some eBayers believe that the decision to collect or not varies with item cost.  It does not.

It has much more to do with shipping method, and even then, they are a little more likely to collect on higher priced items, but not much more likely.

The GSP is actually worse for more expensive items than it is for less pricey items.

Those who try to justify its existence by saying it works for expensive items are groping in the dark and not speaking from experience.

Consider this: If they were to collect on all eligible items as the GSP does, it would change the way the PO operates.  

They hate to collect at the door and it's very time consuming for them.  I suspect that all parcels would have to be picked up and that would mean increased costs for the PO, and thus increased shipping costs for us.

I suspect that the increase would be substantial.

Also, it would mean a big change in the way eBay buyers buy.  Would they stop buying on line or would they buy Canadian?

I suspect the former but I'd hope for the latter.

These are the real issues at the heart of the GSP.

[pierrelebel]

"Those who try to justify its existence by saying it works for expensive items are groping in the dark and not speaking from experience."

Why do you regularly feel the need to insult readers with such comment? What makes you think readers do not have more experience that you, more so considering you are one of the few Canadian posters hiding behind a posting ID.

What specific negative experience do you have personally about GSP? None that you have posted. On the contrary.  You have confirmed that your ONE and only experience was not negative.  It is all speculation and assumptions on your part.

"They hate to collect at the door and it's very time consuming for them."

??? What does that have to do with anything?  Postal carriers are paid hourly a maximum of hours daily per route. There is no additional cost to the system whether the carrier hates or likes to deliver parcels and pick-up money.

"the standard has become not to collect these additional fees."

Assumptions...  Why dont you take the time to check the facts?  Why dont you contact your member of Parliament and find out how much money (duty and taxes) is collected by Canada Customs every year on postal deliveries?

[i*m-still-here]

My Stalker.

That didn't take long at all.

Alrighty then.

[marnotom!]

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@i*m-still-here wrote:

Those who try to justify its existence by saying it works for expensive items are groping in the dark and not speaking from experience.

---

No, I haven't purchased anything through the GSP yet and will only do so if it makes sense to me, as I assume was the case with your lone GSP purchase.

However, I did go through most of the checkout process for a dummy listing that a U.S. seller put up as an experiment.  The fees were just as were stated in the listing and I had no surprises that way.

That seller has also done number crunching on larger items, and he's found that in some--not all--cases, the GSP can work out to being a better deal than using the postal system, even if taxes/brokerage aren't charged on the latter.

And I've done the number crunching on a number of more expensive--albeit small--items and the numbers looked favourable to me.  I compared that to the same item being sold on the River on both .ca and .com from the same seller.  I couldn't purchase the item at all through the .com site and even though I wasn't charged taxes and only a nominal delivery fee when I went through the checkout process, the .ca item (again, exactly the same) was a heck of a lot more expensive.  I think that site's fullfillment division is just lumping in their version of "import charges" with the item price.

[i*m-still-here]

Exactly.

As I posted before, you don't have to touch the fire to know it's gonna burn.

So when you did that number crunching for the expensive item, were you crunching the numbers with the anticipation that you'd be paying taxes upon arrival?

If so....................  try it again without that sum figured in.

Why should my experience (posted above) be different from others?

None that I can think of.

As for heavy items................ or more precisely heavy items sold for under $20............. Maybe.  (Mine was a wash........... not positive or negative......... just neutral................and I suspect that's the best case scenario.

Keep in mind that P-B seems to be loading up a truck and then shipping via Expedited from within Canada, and shipping via Expedited within the same city is very reasonable.

If that truck just happens to land in your town............... then for a heavy item under $20 it can be a deal.

If the truck lands in another Province.......... Not so much.

[marnotom!]

---

@i*m-still-here wrote:

So when you did that number crunching for the expensive item, were you crunching the numbers with the anticipation that you'd be paying taxes upon arrival?

If so....................  try it again without that sum figured in.

I don't see why I should.  If I don't get taxes charged on a purchase that should have taxes charged, I consider it a bonus.  I don't have what appears to be a sense of entitlement to be "untaxed" the way some posters are coming off as having.

[i*m-still-here]

It has NOTHING to do with a sense of entitlement.  ZERO!

It has everything to do with expectations and the way the powers that be choose to process our packages.

This is not my choice and there is nothing I can do about it.

It is what it is.  Out of my hands....................

After receiving thousands of packages I know what to expect. 

That expectation is based on experience.

In my case, my purchases are investments for eventual re-sale and I have to know what to expect or it doesn't work.

Whatever they opt to do by way of over-the-border charges is fine by me as long as I can calculate my landed cost with accuracy........

and since I can it's not an issue.

Some may consider it a bonus............  but I don't.

It's the norm.

The GSP is not.

BUT......... if it did eventually become the norm to bill as the GSP does then I'd assimilate that as well and make it work for me too.

For now........... it's an anomaly.

[i*m-still-here]

In other words, I understand what you're saying because from the posts it does seem like buyers are annoyed when they are asked to pay taxes.

That's not me though.  I don't invite it by using the GSP, but neither am I miffed when I'm asked to pay because I understand that occasionally that's gonna happen.

The way I see it:

When you buy  from a real life store the expectation is that you will pay sales tax.  

Occasionally a store has a sale and waives the tax, but that's not the norm.

When buying on line the expectation created by the way they process the items is that there will be no taxes owing.

Occasionally they do collect, but that is not the norm.

Since they don't collect anyway maybe it's high time to raise the limit to $250 or even higher.

Canadians aren't buying from me (us?) anyway.