Marking "payment sent" in My eBay and eBay seller claiming to be "scammed".

[godzilla_goose]

I have read that an eBay seller claims to be scammed by the buyer merely checking off "payment sent" in their (the BUYER'S) My eBay page. As a buyer, I do not understand the seller's claim of being scammed by the buyer merely marking "payment sent" on the buyer's end of the transaction.

As an eBay seller, do you see the payment icon "filled in" or "marked" on your end of the transaction if the buyer, in actual fact, did NOT make payment via PayPal?

I ask these questions to gather a genuine understanding of eBay seller concerns about being scammed and NOT "claiming" to be scammed merely by the buyer being able to mark "payment sent" on their end of the transaction in their My eBay page.

As a seller, when the auction ends or the Buy It Now listing ends with a buyer and BEFORE the buyer actually pays you via PayPal, do you, the eBay seller, receive ANY e-mail notification whatsoever from eBay that includes the buyer's name and (shipping) address?

As an eBay buyer, I know for a fact, that BEFORE I make my payment via PayPal to the eBay seller, I absolutely do NOT receive any notification from eBay OR from PayPal that includes the seller's real name (or their chosen "business" name). It is ONLY AFTER I remit my PayPal payment, that PayPal provides me with the seller's real name or their chosen "business" name be that the case. I am NOT provided with the eBay seller's (street or mailing) address AT ANY TIME. At the moment my PayPal payment is completed through eBay checkout, the "payment sent" icon is automatically filled-in in My eBay page. I do NOT have to mark that icon.

On the occasions that I have remitted my money order payment via snail mail OR if I contacted the eBay seller and provided them with my credit card number to process through their merchant account (and thus NOT through eBay/PayPal), I have had to manually check the "payment sent" icon in my My eBay page to prevent eBay from sending me those ANNOYING PAYMENT REMINDERS to pay the eBay seller especially AFTER I have already remitted my payment to the eBay seller.

If PayPal does NOT provide you, the eBay seller, with the eBay buyer's mailing address BEFORE the eBay buyer actually remits their payment via PayPal, how it is possible for the eBay seller to be scammed by the eBay buyer IF the eBay buyer merely clicks the "payment sent" icon in the buyer's My eBay page?

It is my belief and understanding that the item remains in the eBay seller's possession before the eBay buyer has made payment to the eBay seller so exactly how is the eBay seller being "scammed" if the eBay buyer is clicking the "payment sent" icon in the buyer's My eBay page?

It is also my understanding that if I, the eBay buyer, DO NOT make my payment to the eBay seller via PayPal, to the best of my knowledge, the eBay seller is NOT provided with the eBay buyer's name AND mailing address so how could the eBay seller print out a shipping label IF they do NOT have the eBay buyer's shipping address?

IF I, the eBay buyer, merely click the "payment sent" icon WITHOUT actually remitting a payment via PayPal, it is my understanding that there is NO PayPal Transaction ID number generated with respect to the eBay transaction and if there is NO PayPal transaction ID number generated and if the eBay seller is NOT provided with the eBay buyer's mailing address, how is it, EXACTLY, that the eBay seller is being "scammed"?

[ypdc_dennis]

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@godzilla_goose wrote:
... so exactly how is the eBay seller being "scammed" if the eBay buyer is clicking the "payment sent" icon in the buyer's My eBay page?

... that if I, the eBay buyer, DO NOT make my payment to the eBay seller via PayPal, to the best of my knowledge, the eBay seller is NOT provided with the eBay buyer's name AND mailing address so how could the eBay seller print out a shipping label IF they do NOT have the eBay buyer's shipping address?

---

While PayPal does not provide the seller with a shipping address if payment is not made through paypal -- eBay certainly does.

EBay sends an email to the Seller when a sale is made with the sale details AND the Buyer's address.

So a seller who does not pay enough attention to payment details can certainly feel "scammed" if payment is checked off, the item shipped, and then discovers payment has not yet arrived.

-..-

[godzilla_goose]

ypdc_dennis,

Thank you for your reply to enlighten me as to how an eBay seller can be "scammed".

When I wrote my lengthy original post, I was NOT aware that eBay, according to you, does provide the seller with a shipping address and that eBay sends an e-mail to the seller when a sale is made with the sale details AND the buyer's address.

What EXACTLY do you mean by the seller not paying enough attention to "payment details" if payment is checked off?

As I wrote in my lengthy OP, IF and when the buyer makes payment via PayPal, THEN and ONLY then is a PayPal transaction ID number generated. Does the seller NOT get ANY notification that such an indicator, for a lack of a better term, is made to the eBay seller BEFORE the eBay seller prints a shipping label AND ships the item out?

How is it that the seller later discovers that the [PayPal] payment has not yet arrived IF the buyer checks off payment from THEIR end? Is the seller's payment icon in the seller's My eBay page also checked off IF the buyer is the party that checks off the payment icon at their end?

Please enlighten me and thank you for taking the time to answer my query.

[godzilla_goose]

ypdc_dennis,

I am surmising that the eBay seller is able to sign into their PayPal account and actually verify that they have in fact received the buyer's payment BEFORE printing a shipping label and shipping the item out to the buyer.

So, if my above belief is correct, then the seller could avoid being "scammed" merely by being diligent and checking their own PayPal account to verify that they have in fact received the buyer's PayPal payment BEFORE proceeding with shipping REGARDLESS of the payment icon being checked off in the seller's My eBay page.

Does PayPal give the eBay seller any notification that it is "OK to ship" to the buyer REGARDLESS of the payment sent icon being checked off in the seller's My eBay page?

Again, I thank you for your time.

[cumos55]

Before something is bought on eBay  a buyer must identify a Primary Shipping Address.... on eBay 

This address might be different than the address indicated on an email forwarded by eBay indicating something has been bought.

The Primary Shipping Address  is indicated in the Sales Record  for a purchased item... on a seller's  My eBay page

When a buyer pays  with Paypal... this Primary Shipping Address... becomes the Paypal address.

For each purchase  the Paypal address is linked to eBay's address,  and cannot be revised on Paypal.

Now there is an "IF"

Sometimes  a buyer might  ask a seller to mail the purchase to an address other than the address on Paypal....

and... This is what I have done.

The payment is refunded  and a Paypal invoice is sent to the buyer   with this new "other" address indicated.

Buyer pays this new invoice.....the Paypal invoice.

----------------------------------------------------------------

All communication between Seller and Buyer should be through eBay Messages.....  as this is an official record of the communications associated with this transaction.... Should there  be any problem  whatsoever....

----------------------------------------------------------------

Every seller should know... and more importantly should understand this process.

This process protects the seller... specifically with respect to the Shipping Address

--------------------------------------------------------------

Payment sent  ... as specified by a buyer.... relates to the fact the buyer has mailed a money order to a seller.....

could... might... perhaps... also relate to payments as a Paypal echeck... (not sure about this)

---------------------------------------------------

Seller must understand  the process... Paypal in relation to eBay .....and how it is recorded on eBay...

[cumos55]

A seller should always use the address on the Sales Record... identified with a transaction......under my eBay... as the Correct... Shipping address

The address on Paypal  will always be this same address.

If a seller understands this fact then  there should never be a question with respect to the "correct" shipping address.

A seller is always in control of a transaction

----------------------------------------------

A seller should also understand how a transaction is recorded on eBay... both before and after a payment has been received through Paypal.

Everything....  absolutely everything ......is presented on the Sales Record for each transaction on eBay.

Check the Sales Record if there is any question with respect to address.... payment received.... Item shipped  ......and more.....

Sales Record... Sales Record.... Sales Record....

[godzilla_goose]

cumos55,

Thank you for taking your time to reply (twice).

My primary concern as an eBay buyer is NOT about the buyer's Primary shipping address or the PayPal address. I understand that the eBay seller is ONLY protected IF the eBay seller ships TO the PayPal address OF RECORD and NOT to some other mailing/shipping address.

With respect to the "Sales Record" that you mention, does this tell the eBay seller that the eBay buyer has in fact actually paid the eBay seller or not REGARDLESS of the payment sent icon being marked or checked off by the eBay buyer within the buyer's My eBay page?

[cumos55]

Payment sent ... as indicated by a buyer...

Does Not......

.......have the same meaning as Payment received by a seller

The Sales Record is a complete record of a transaction.......

Look a the many  ways how a payment can be made... The ...Paid With .......options for a payment

and... be careful  there are some payment options not recommended by eBay.

The most reliable payment options  include... Paypal.....cash on local pickup..... and Merchant Credit card

[cumos55]

On a Sales Record.

If Paypal is used... the record will show  Payment received.... Paid with ......Paypal

(Not sure about what happens with a Merchant credit Card)

For any other method of payment....  seller must indicate that a payment has been received... and what that method of payment was....That is the .....Paid with ... option

If one sends a Paypal invoice to a buyer..... then the seller must update the Sales Record when the Paypal invoice has been paid...  with ...  Paid with Paypal .... as the option....

Payment Sent...... is the buyer's record.

Payment Received ..... is the seller's record

If a buyer mails a Money Order... they indicate... Payment sent

When the money order is cashed.... Seller states... Payment received..... and purchased item is shipped... and recorded by the seller

Everything is shown on the Sales Record....

[godzilla_goose]

cumos55,

I know that payment sent as indicated by the buyer does NOT have the same meaning as payment received by the seller. If I mail my money order payment to the eBay seller and I mark the payment sent icon in my My eBay page, this, to me, does NOT mean that the eBay seller has, in fact, received my mailed money order payment.

To me, IF and WHEN the seller actually receives my mailed money order payment (with typed letter with eBay transaction particulars) that the seller, at his/her convenience, can check against his/her OWN "Sales Record", can then mark the payment sent icon in the seller's My eBay page and acknowledge that payment has, in fact, been received BEFORE printing a shipping label and shipping the item out. Since a mailed money order payment does NOT generate a PayPal transaction ID number, it makes NO sense to me for the eBay seller to be shipping out anything before receiving the mailed payment.

As I explained in my opening post, IF I pay the eBay seller via their OWN merchant account (and thus, NOT through eBay/PayPal), this does NOT generate a PayPal transaction ID number either. The eBay seller who accepts my credit card number and processes my credit card payment via their OWN merchant account will receive a payment authorization number at THEIR end. At MY end of the transaction, all I can do is mark the payment sent icon in my My eBay page to indicate that I made my payment via the eBay seller's OWN merchant account. Checking off the payment icon is the ONLY means of preventing eBay sending me those ANNOYING PAYMENT REMINDERS to pay the eBay seller especially AFTER I have already settled my transaction with the eBay seller through that seller's OWN merchant account.

So, it appears to me that the only way an eBay seller can be "scammed" merely by the buyer marking the payment sent icon at the buyer's end of the transaction is if the eBay seller is CARELESS and/or INATTENTIVE to their OWN "Sales Record".  Am I right?

[cumos55]

Each seller is control of their own destiny.

On eBay.com, there has been many a seller that does not follow the procedure defined in relation to the Sales Record...  and has paid the price....effectively losing money in the process

It is usually a new seller to eBay, with a high priced transaction

A seller has to understand what to do....   and what records are important in relation to a transaction.

Everything starts with putting everything ... in a correct manner   in a listing..

and knowing what not to say, and what not to do.... to control the progress of a transaction... and minimize the occurrence of problems, defects and more...

A transaction starts with knowing what should be...  and should not be ...  in a listing.

[godzilla_goose]

cumos55,

After having read the following eBay web page on eBay.com, I think I have found some answers to my questions that weren't directly answered in this thread.

http://pages.ebay.com/help/pay/paypal-tracking-payments.html

Within the above eBay page, it clearly states the following verbatim:

Updating the status of a payment you've sent

If you paid for the item by clicking the Pay Now button or if the seller marks the payment as received in My eBay, the status of the item will automatically update in My eBay. However, if you've paid by another payment method, you'll need to manually mark your payment as sent.

So, as I wrote earlier, whenever I make my payment to the eBay seller NOT via PayPal but with a money order OR via the seller's OWN merchant account, I manually check off the "payment sent" icon.

-----

Also within the above eBay page, it states the following verbatim:

Note: If you manually mark the item as payment sent, the seller isn't automatically notified. Select Contact seller from the Actions drop-down menu to send the seller an explaining email that you've sent your payment.

-----

So, by me manually marking the "payment sent" icon in my My eBay page, the eBay seller does NOT get automatic notification ACCORDING to eBay as I understand its web page with the above text. So, my understanding NOW is that IF I were to manually mark the "payment sent" icon in My eBay page, the eBay seller's payment icon is NOT updated by MY action of merely clicking on the "payment sent" icon. The eBay seller HIMSELF/HERSELF has to mark the payment icon on THEIR end.

Therefore, ALL of the "stuff" I have read about the eBay seller being "scammed" by the buyer merely checking off the "payment sent" icon in the buyer's My eBay page is eBay seller MALARKEY.

I take this time to thank you and ypdc_dennis for responding to my queries.

[ypdc_dennis]

---

@godzilla_goose wrote:

.. me manually marking the "payment sent" icon in my My eBay page, the eBay seller does NOT get automatic notification ACCORDING to eBay as I understand its web page with the above text. So, my understanding NOW is that IF I were to manually mark the "payment sent" icon in My eBay page, the eBay seller's payment icon is NOT updated by MY action of merely clicking on the "payment sent" icon.

---

The payment icon is updated, the no automatic notification refers to an email notification, not to the icon.

That said, the icon has several different flavours (unpaid, pending, paid are 3 I know of) -- so I don't know what a seller would see when a buyer manually marks it as payment send.  It's been a very long time since a buyer sent me a cheque or money order.

-..-

[godzilla_goose]

ypdc_dennis,

What I needed to know is what the eBay seller's payment icon looks like IF I, the eBay buyer, merely clicks the "payment sent" icon from MY end of the transaction in my My eBay page and by my doing so, does this same icon get check or marked off at the eBay seller's end.

cumos55 responded but I didn't see a definitive answer to my question with respect to the payment icon because that responder wrote in message #9 about the Sales Record but did NOT mention anything specific to the payment icon at the seller's end.

So if as you wrote that the payment icon is updated at the seller's end by the buyer merely clicking on the payment sent icon from the buyer's my eBay page, the only way for the eBay seller to be "scammed" is due to seller CARELESSNESS and/or INATTENTIVENESS to the seller's "Sales Record". Yes or No?

IF the seller is NOT diligent to verify that the payment is actually received BEFORE printing a shipping label and shipping the item out, then that is the seller's FAILURE. Yes or No?

To me, IF I sent you a money order (with my accompanying typed letter), you wouldn't be sending me the item UNTIL you have actually received my payment and deposited/cashed my money order BEFORE shipping the item out. I don't really care if the payment icon is updated at the seller's end by my mere act of clicking the payment sent icon on my end of the transaction immediately after I mail my money order payment to you. So, I can't see how the eBay seller can be "scammed" here by what I have done with respect to the payment icon at my end of the transaction. Even according to eBay web page I referenced, I am the one to mark the payment sent icon on MY end of the transaction. I also am the party to be contacting you to notify you that I have mailed out my money order payment. I just hope that Canada Post delivers it to you.

As I wrote, If I paid the seller via the seller's OWN merchant account, I mark the payment sent icon on my end of the transaction. Since I am in contact with the seller at time of providing my credit card number for him to enter it into his machine to process, the seller will know right then that payment is "good" when he gets the payment authorization number from his merchant account services provider which takes less than minute. So, I can't see how the eBay seller can be "scammed" by my merely clicking on the payment sent icon when a payment is made via the eBay seller's OWN merchant account.

Therefore, the only reasons that an eBay seller can say that they were "scammed" by the buyer merely clicking on the payment sent icon from the buyer's end is due to the seller's OWN CARELESSNESS and/or INATTENTIVENESS to the Sales Record and I would add the seller's FAILURE to verify payment by NOT signing into their own PayPal account to verify payment has, in actual fact, been received BEFORE printing a shipping label and sending out the item to the buyer.

So, the seller really isn't being "scammed" by the buyer; the seller, due to his/her own carelessness/inattentiveness/lack of diligence, is blaming his/her buyer instead.

[cumos55]

Here is a link with an answer to this last question...

http://pages.ebay.ca/help/pay/paypal-tracking-payments.html

Note the following.... in this link

If you manually mark the item as payment sent, the seller isn't automatically notified. Select Contact seller from the Actions drop-down menu to send the seller an explaining email that you've sent your payment.

My view....  A seller should not ship a purchased item  until payment has been received,  and only shipped after the seller has marked the item as payment received.... and Paid with......

The buyer's record under My eBay will show... Payment received.

My routine for all transactions , after payment received,  is to send an email to the buyer indicating when the purchased item will be mailed.  I have a standard format for this email  for both Canadian and US buyers

The correct shipping address is present on the Sales Record for the transaction as noted under My eBay  for sellers.

[godzilla_goose]

---

@cumos55 wrote:

Here is a link with an answer to this last question...

http://pages.ebay.ca/help/pay/paypal-tracking-payments.html

Note the following.... in this link

If you manually mark the item as payment sent, the seller isn't automatically notified. Select Contact seller from the Actions drop-down menu to send the seller an explaining email that you've sent your payment.

My view....  A seller should not ship a purchased item  until payment has been received,  and only shipped after the seller has marked the item as payment received.... and Paid with......

The buyer's record under My eBay will show... Payment received.

My routine for all transactions , after payment received,  is to send an email to the buyer indicating when the purchased item will be mailed.  I have a standard format for this email  for both Canadian and US buyers

The correct shipping address is present on the Sales Record for the transaction as noted under My eBay  for sellers.

---

cumos55,

What is causing ME frustration is that YOUR response conflicts with what ypdc_dennis is saying with respect to the payment icon.

When I, the eBay buyer, check the payment icon in my My eBay page, does my act of merely clicking the "payment sent" icon on MY END of the transaction cause the seller's payment to be check off or marked at THEIR END? YES or NO?

ypdc_dennis is saying YES. YOU, by your responses, appear to be saying NO because you are stating that the seller only [ships] after the seller has marked the item as payment received... and Paid with....

So, IF it is up to the seller to mark off the payment as being received within their SALES RECORD, it matters not one iota if the buyer checks off the payment icon on THEIR end, right? Or WRONG?

[cumos55]

We follow eBay's rules... and for this we have.....

"If you, the buyer,  manually mark the item as payment sent, the seller isn't automatically notified.

Select Contact seller from the Actions drop-down menu to send the seller an explaining email that you've sent your payment."

The rest is logic... and a protocol based on eBay rules

Once the seller receives payment.....  Seller marks Payment Received....and this is when seller handling time starts....seller ships

There is nothing more to be said by me... the seller... or any other seller

Take a visit to ....Help & Contact...at top of this page....  Do a search and .....  and Read... Read... read.

That is what I do.....

It is an eBay reality that all sellers  follow.... or more specifically should follow.

[i.am.vivian]

---

godzilla_goose wrote:

When I, the eBay buyer, check the payment icon in my My eBay page, does my act of merely clicking the "payment sent" icon on MY END of the transaction cause the seller's payment to be check off or marked at THEIR END? YES or NO?

---

YES the seller can see it.  

That's all.  Just see it.  When no bell sounds on their cell or PC to let them know they've been paid, and the notification bell does not show payment, and they have received not email from PayPal saying "You've got cash", and their SOLD items indicate no payment, and they click on the "More Actions" to see the PayPal transaction and see no money has come, ...........

A seller is not going to mail the item.  What a seller WILL do is then UNcheck the payment icon and send an invoice.  If no payment ever shows up, the seller will file an UNPAID ITEM case against the trickster, and then add the Wily One to their list of BLOCKED BIDDERS.  If the seller is suspicious of a scam and not merely annoyed by what could be a mistake, the seller might even report their suspicions to eBay.  

---

godzilla_goose wrote:

So, IF it is up to the seller to mark off the payment as being received within their SALES RECORD, it matters not one iota if the buyer checks off the payment icon on THEIR end, right? Or WRONG?

---

If the item has been paid it will show.  It matters not one iota whether the buyer checks or unchecks the little icon thingy.

People have the ability manually mark or unmark it, which is dumb but it is there for situations like when a buyer picks up an order and pays cash.  Cash-on-pickup is fine, but on eBay it will not show until someone marks it.  When a buyer pays the system automatically shows the filled in 'paid' icon.  It does not remain blank, waiting for the seller to get around to doing it.  

That whole icon paid/unpaid is of little consequence.  Its appearance alone can't be used to trick a seller into mailing the item, not when all those other indicators clearly show no money.  

You are intensely interested in the minutiae of this practice.  You allege that you read something somewhere but have not once offered to show a link to the other members here to see what it is you had in mind.  It might help people to understand.  

[cumos55]

Each seller adjusts to the rules of eBay.....

It takes a while to learn almost everything... as there is always something new just around the corner.

We on eBay Canada.....  are each a different type of person.

We learn from each other... and become better sellers because of what each of us knows.

--------------------------------------------

Many sellers... more so on eBay.com than here....have a preconceived notion of what it takes to sell on line... and more specifically eBay....  and many `times some new sellers choose to ignore the eBay reality....

They continue their own way  and may eventually hit a brick wall....

I had learned a lot by reading the US boards....but rarely said much.

Many times  someone has a problem....  and they have the answer ... they knew the answer  to the problem....but choose to ignore the reality of the answer.

Success on eBay  means we must adjust to what eBay defines as a top seller.....  and we do so.

Success means knowing what to do.

but.....  from personal experience... it is more important to know what not to do....  to be most successful as a seller on eBay 

OP's situation is not absolutely critical to selling on eBay.... Paypal is the standard method of payment on eBay..... but it is better to  know what is happening....  and what is correct.....what eBay says is correct..... just in case something is not quite right.with a transaction.

[godzilla_goose]

cumos55,

As an eBay buyer, as I see things, I am NOT one to tell an eBay seller how to run their business. To me, an eBay seller has the absolute right to operate his/her business on eBay as he/she sees fit and at the same time within the eBay User Agreement and within the Laws of the land. That's it. Nothing more needs to be said.