My first Charge-back

[007steveb16]

I just woke up to my first charge-back ever.

Sale was from Dec 29/15 and was shipped by Light Packet International with label printed through PayPal.

So now I've got the charge-back case opened and being asked for proof.

I have no "proof" because I didn't use a tracked service right?

Essentially on a charge-back as a seller you're screwed out of your item plus the refund it seems.

[xeposter]

Yeah, I had that with an item (luckily it was only $3 USD) and since I did not get tracking and just threw a stamp on an envelope, the buyer opened a case. I had to refund them because they claimed they never got it. I don't ship in envelopes with stamps any more now!

Alex

[dmil8030]

Hello 'steveb', 

<<I've got the charge-back case opened and being asked for proof.

 I have no "proof" because I didn't use a tracked service right?>>

I am sorry to hear you got one of those.  Sooner or later just about everyone gets clobbered with a charge-back.

If you have proof of shipment (not proof of delivery, as in tracking) you can win a charge-back case.

If you can possibly prove through a shipping label or receipt that the item was mailed to that buyer, offer everything 

and anything in your defense, -- and if you can show that the item was mailed to that address, you might have a chance. 

Otherwise, . . . I hope it wasn't expensive. 

[ypdc_dennis]

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@007steveb16 wrote:

I just woke up to my first charge-back ever.

Sale was from Dec 29/15 and was shipped by Light Packet International with label printed through PayPal.

So now I've got the charge-back case opened and being asked for proof.

I have no "proof" because I didn't use a tracked service right?

Essentially on a charge-back as a seller you're screwed out of your item plus the refund it seems.

---

Light Packet International does have a number, you have to get it from the label for your records. But all it can give you is proof of postage bought, no proof of delivery.

Did the buyer ever leave you feedback for the item? If they did that could be used as proof.

-..-

You say charge-back case, which sounds like the buyer is making their claim through their credit card. The buyer's Credit card deals with paypal who deals with you. Rather than an Item-Not-Recieved claim via paypal.

-..-

[ypdc_dennis]

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@x..e wrote:

Yeah, I had that with an item (luckily it was only $3 USD) and since I did not get tracking and just threw a stamp on an envelope, the buyer opened a case. I had to refund them because they claimed they never got it. I don't ship in envelopes with stamps any more now!

Alex

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That's one of the big differences between Canada and the USA. You have inexpensive tracked shipping, sellers shipping from Canada do not.

-..-

Canada Post rates:

International (outside Canada and USA)

Arranged in order of cheapest choice.

000-030g ..  2.50 .. stamps
031-050g ..  3.60 .. stamps
051-100g ..  5.90 .. stamps
101-200g ..  8.78 .. Light Packet
201-250g ..  9.78+  Small packet (air)
251-300g .. 13.46 . Light Packet
301-500g .. 19.55+ Small packet (air)

Stamps and Light Packet are for items less than 2 cm (0.8 inches) thick

Light packet through paypal does have a number on the label. Proof postage was bought.

Small packet (air) - has a bar code. You can ask for an Originate Scan with receipt at your post office/outlet -- proof item was shipped. The price varies by world region (UK is shown).

Cheapest tracked option:

Tracked packet has tracking and insurance. The cost starts at over $40. Limited to 31 countries.

-..-

[pjcdn2005]

If it is an unauthorized chargeback it should just require proof that the item was actually mailed to the payment address so tracking shoeing that the item was mailed is usually required. However, a few months ago someone posted that paypal let them win a chargeback because they printed their label on paypal...even though there was no actual proof of shipment. That seemed a little odd to me but perhaps it does happen...it can't hurt to ask Paypal about it.

[jersey..authentix]

If you ship without tracking , be prepared for this type of issue. If you are shipping items with a very low dollar value it is understandable that you ship without tracking. For expensive items, it's a mistake to not ship without it.

Very most likely the buyer didn't receive the item, but there are those that prey on people that simply ship using stamps. 

All part of selling online.

[femmefan1946]

You can get tracking when using stamps!

You have to go to the PO counter and get the barcoded label there, but the actual cost of shipping can be covered using those pretty adhesive labels Canada Post has been selling since 1859.

And which can often be purchased online at a substantial discount from PO prices.

If you buy a shipping label online, including Light Packet, you have a numbered receipt for your records, even if the number is only a bookkeeping item and not also a tracking/Delivery Confirmation number.

[ricarmic]

Hi 007! I recently had a charge back as well that worked out ok.

The very first thing I did was send an eBay message advising the buyer that I had received a chargeback regarding an item and suggested that if there was a problem with the item to just let me know.

Turns out the buyer had a credit card problem and the credit card cancelled all transactions including the one for the item they bought from me.

The buyer did a lot of stuff to make sure that I did not get burned. (The item was $52 US$)

If you haven't already, it can't hurt to send a note to the buyer..... one never knows, I was very very surprised when they jumped on helping make sure I didn't burn..... 

[ricarmic]

Ooops sorry I hit send too soon. You have 10 days to respond, in my case I waited until day 9 then added the buyers comments about the situation as my evidence. My item did not have tracking either. (The disputing process takes many weeks....)

[xeposter]

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@ricarmic wrote:
Ooops sorry I hit send too soon. You have 10 days to respond, in my case I waited until day 9 then added the buyers comments about the situation as my evidence. My item did not have tracking either. (The disputing process takes many weeks....)

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Did you try editing your post? I have to do it sometimes after I have posted something and want to change it 😉

Alex

[pocomocomputing]

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@x..e wrote:

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@ricarmic wrote:
Ooops sorry I hit send too soon. You have 10 days to respond, in my case I waited until day 9 then added the buyers comments about the situation as my evidence. My item did not have tracking either. (The disputing process takes many weeks....)

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Did you try editing your post? I have to do it sometimes after I have posted something and want to change it 😉

Alex

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One has to be quick because there is a 5 minute time window to edit a post and then the edit option is gone. Great for typos you miss (and deleting posts!).

[xeposter]

It looks like ricarmic added the 2nd post 3 minutes after the 1st one, so there would have been time to edit it.

Alex

[007steveb16]

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@jersey..authentix wrote:

If you ship without tracking , be prepared for this type of issue. If you are shipping items with a very low dollar value it is understandable that you ship without tracking. For expensive items, it's a mistake to not ship without it.

Very most likely the buyer didn't receive the item, but there are those that prey on people that simply ship using stamps. 

All part of selling online.

---

1st chargeback in 11 years on eBay. I think I can cope with the frequency. This was a Light Packet International label printed through PayPal.

Chargeback initiator has confirmed that his account was hacked back in Dec '15. His CC company & PayPal investigated and have confirmed. This person is located in the USA, hacker was from Morocco.

I've sent all I can to prove I shipped the item to the address listed. All up to PayPal now to see if I'm "covered"

[maximus7001]

In this case I would think that it is ebay/paypal fault since they provided you the address to ship to and promised you seller protection all the way through the process. And now this? What?

[pjcdn2005]

They promise to protect you if you have proof of shipment for a chargeback and proof of delivery for an inr. They don't say that they will protect us no matter what.

[maximus7001]

In this case the OP printed a paypal label so it should be covered. Would need to call in for it before it defaulted.

[pjcdn2005]

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@maximus7001 wrote:
In this case the OP printed a paypal label so it should be covered. Would need to call in for it before it defaulted.

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They might cover it but they aren't obligated to as that isn't proof that the item was actually shipped. But...as I mentioned earlier, I have heard at least one seller mention that Paypal allowed the Paypal label as proof of shipment.

[anne_of_great_girdles]

Same here, my buyer asked Paypal for a chargeback refund after 3 months of purchase. Never had complaints or any communication within the 60 days of transaction, like many buyers, never left feedback so we think no news good news.NOT!!! Buyers can still get refunded months after transactionif they wish or if they have buyers remorse by asking a credit card chargeback thru Paypal saying that the transaction was not authorized by them.

I consider myself a good person and charge my American neighbours the same low shipping cost as my Canadian buyers here without the outrageous 16$ tracking number. I lost my claim case because of not charging a tracking number for a low cost item and trusting my buyer.

We here in Canada have the possibility to upload our proof of postage by showing the Post office bill. It is stated the date, the amount paid in shipping and the specific zip code of the buyer. Ebay or Paypal do not consider this a proof of shipment, to me it is a proof no ? In any case, even if they would accept the post office bill with the zip code a proof, I thought that after 60 days, claims were not allowed anymore so I don't keep the bills after 2 months.

Long story short, I lost my case, the buyer got his money back for an item bought 3 months ago, so even if you sellers think Ebay will protect you because the refund asked is after the 60 day period to open a case, if a buyer ask for a chargeback months after they bought from you, they will take back the money from your Paypal account and there is nothing you can say.

Why did they ask for a tracking number as a proof if the reason of the chargeback is not even about non-received package but NON AUTHORIZED PAYMENT ?

A seller at the bottom of the food chain 🙂

[xeposter]

'Anne',

This post was last replied to on 04-08-2016, 10 days ago.

Not many people are going to see your post because this thread is older. I recommend that you start a new thread so that more people see it although there is a possibility that people will see this one.

Thanks.

Alex