Canadian with American Ebay location charging higher US shipping with import charge

[retroburbia]

Just wondering if anyone out there can offer there thoughts and wisdom on the following scenario?

1) Canadian Seller lists items through Ebay.com with an American location

2) Buyer (me) buys item, thinking it's coming from the US, and pays for it through PayPal -- payment includes item price, US-to-Canada shipping charge and import charge

3) Seller reveals that he's actually in Canada and wants to ship Canada Post at significantly lower actual costs to himself

4) Seller, after considerable negotiations on Buyer's part (me), agrees to split the difference between the US shipping charge and the actual cost to ship Canada Post within Canada (about half the cost, offering me a $10.00 refund, even though he's still able to pocket some of the difference between the higher US shipping and what it will cost to ship Canada Post)

5) Seller seems uninterested in working through Ebay to eliminate unnecessary import charge

Is there any way I can get Ebay to wave the import charge?

As to the gouging on shipping, my feedback may enlighten future buyers.

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

I just bought a DVD for $24  and ebay seller asked to pay $ 10,00 for shipping & $9.00 for GSP. i would like Ebay to know from now on I will never buy from American seller where the Shipping charges are out of this World plus GSP another private company to dip in my purchase that is the last straw & I would let all my Canadian friends know what a racket ebay.com has started from  Sept.2014. Here is my solution I will ask my friend in states to buy for me & send it me by ordinary USP period. Thanks.

Note. American postal  service is  running billion of dollars deficit  instead of giving better postal rates & increasing their business ebay & USpost are going backward. Thanks  Pal

[mater721]

File a complaint with ebay for false posting and try to get the deal nullified.

Is it an actual import fee or taxes within Canada?

If you can't get deal nullified, then by all means give seller negative feedback with all 1's on the stars.

[femmefan1946]

Is there any way I can get Ebay to wave the import charge?

There is no import charge here.

The seller has set a shipping cost to Canada. He may be shipping US orders from the USA and Canadian orders from Canada. That would be a good business practice.

If the item was being shipped from the USA using the Global Shipping Program, an import charge that includes any duty or tax applicable, plus a small ($4-$5) service charge would be applied.

If the item were shipped from the USA to Canada, without the GSP,  Canada Post could, but probably wouldn't, 'charge applicable tax, duty and a $9.95 service charge before releasing the item to you. The seller has nothing to do with this. It is the responsiblity of the buyer.

If the item is being shipped from Canada, there is no duty and there may be no sales tax (depending on whether or not the seller is registered). 

Handling charges are allowable as part of a shipping charge. Bubblewrap ain't free.

There is no reason to believe that domestic shipping (Canada to Canada) is cheaper than USA to Canada. I pay $12 or more to ship a 3cm paperback from Ontario to Alberta for example.

[retroburbia]

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@femmefan1946 wrote:

Is there any way I can get Ebay to wave the import charge?

There is no import charge here.

The seller has set a shipping cost to Canada. He may be shipping US orders from the USA and Canadian orders from Canada. That would be a good business practice.

If the item was being shipped from the USA using the Global Shipping Program, an import charge that includes any duty or tax applicable, plus a small ($4-$5) service charge would be applied.

If the item were shipped from the USA to Canada, without the GSP,  Canada Post could, but probably wouldn't, 'charge applicable tax, duty and a $9.95 service charge before releasing the item to you. The seller has nothing to do with this. It is the responsiblity of the buyer.

If the item is being shipped from Canada, there is no duty and there may be no sales tax (depending on whether or not the seller is registered). 

Handling charges are allowable as part of a shipping charge. Bubblewrap ain't free.

There is no reason to believe that domestic shipping (Canada to Canada) is cheaper than USA to Canada. I pay $12 or more to ship a 3cm paperback from Ontario to Alberta for example.

---

Sorry, femmefan1946, but I've been charged an import fee and paid it because the seller led me to believe that the item was being shipped by an American seller from an American location. Your assertion that there is no import charge is simply just that, an assertion and, because it is not based on facts or even a careful reading of my original posting, it is thus unfounded. As is your conclusion that there is no reason to think that Canada-to-Canada shipping will be cheaper than USA-to-Canada shipping. I was also charged the equivalent of $30 CAN shipping, and, again, I paid it because I the seller led me to believe that the item was being shipped from the USA. The item in question would cost $15 to $20 to ship from its actual location in Alberta to me in Calgary. In fact, it would cost around the same to ship the same item from Halifax, N.S., as per my experience with dozens of similar items over the last several years. I'm afraid that your shipping example for a paperback is comparing your apples to my oranges. As to bubble wrap, your implication that I don't understand that bubble wrap costs money is unhelpful in the least and ultimately paternalistic. I appreciate the costs of bubble wrap, as I need to buy it to ship items myself. I figure it would cost the seller $2 tops, and it wouldn't cost the seller anything to use a used newspaper to do the same job. Boxes are free if you ask at a local store. Thanks all the same for your posting.

[afantiques]

Just wondering if anyone out there can offer there thoughts and wisdom on the following scenario?

1) Canadian Seller lists items through Ebay.com with an American location

2) Buyer (me) buys item, thinking it's coming from the US, and pays for it through PayPal -- payment includes item price, US-to-Canada shipping charge and import charge

3) Seller reveals that he's actually in Canada and wants to ship Canada Post at significantly lower actual costs to himself

4) Seller, after considerable negotiations on Buyer's part (me), agrees to split the difference between the US shipping charge and the actual cost to ship Canada Post within Canada (about half the cost, offering me a $10.00 refund, even though he's still able to pocket some of the difference between the higher US shipping and what it will cost to ship Canada Post)

5) Seller seems uninterested in working through Ebay to eliminate unnecessary import charge

Is there any way I can get Ebay to wave the import charge?

As to the gouging on shipping, my feedback may enlighten future buyers.

In this situation there is no way for the seller to remove the sale from the GSP without cancelling the sale by mutual agreement and starting again. Even if the seller is located in Canada if they are normally shipping from USA the item could be GSP eleigible, but it is a difficult situation and there is no unofficial way to unwrangle it. The seller will not be seeing any of those international shipping and import charge fees anyway.

As this is a GSP item, however questionable, the FB and bad stars are liable to removal.

[mater721]

"As this is a GSP item, however questionable, the FB and bad stars are liable to removal."

This whole thing sounds like a falsified listing... no recourse through ebay for false postings?

Do we know it is a GSP posting?

Where would the "GSP" money be going?  If PB not involved at all, who is pocketing the extra Pay-Pal payment?

And is your statement about removal of FB true in all cases?  GSP listings can never get bad feedback?  Or is that just on shipping?

I would think leaving Negative Feedback on general experience (subterfuge) with no stars would stick, no?

[retroburbia]

All very good comments, with some interesting food for thought. I hope the Ebay/PayPal/PitneyBowes folks monitor such discussions, as it is their brandnames under the microscope.

As it turns, out the seller, at my request, cancelled the entire sale, and I've received refunds for all three dimensions of the sale: 1) purchase price, 2) shipping charge, and 3) import charge. I'm out the item, but it's tainted with sour feelings (that may only make sense to collectors).

At this point, I want to make a few things very clear about me as a buyer: 1) I don't mind paying fair shipping charges which also include reasonable sums to cover packing materials such as bubble wrap, old postcard stiffeners, etc., and 2) I don't mind paying import charges if the money goes to cover that. However, I don't like paying over-inflated shipping charges just line a greedy seller's pockets. If a seller wants more money for an item, then start auctions at higher prices and/or ask higher BIN prices. I also don't want to pay an import charge unnecessarily, as in the the case stated above, when an item is actually shipped within Canada, though listed as being located in the USA. I galls me that a seller cause a buyer to incur an extra cost when such shouldn't occur, and then when that seller shows no regard for costing his customer more than needed. Nobody wants to pay more than is reasonable.

[mater721]

This all sounds reasonable to me.

If I know what I'm getting into, and all costs are transparent, then only I am to blame if I don't like the deal.

But I have no patience for tricksters or false listings.

[dipmicro]

Nobody complains about free shipping - hey seller, you did not charge me anything for shipping and I see you paid $10.

In my opinion buyer has no place to scrutinize seller's shipping terms, because buyer does not know seller's arrangements, situation and real costs. Also Ebay is not setup for sellers who are able to ship from multiple points of origin, so such sellers simply use most popular one, it is not misrepresentation. Also the shipping services on .COM are USPS-centric, there is no CanadaPost, it is how Ebay is setup, sellers just work within limitations of Ebay.

Hypothetical example - Canadian company has 90% sales to USA, so they hire fulfillment service for US orders but handle Canada orders internally. Fulfillment services are inexpensive, effective and offer lower shipping rates than PO directly. Say CanadaPost does not pickup at this company location, trip to PO takes 15-20min one way, take wages and $0.40/km car expenses and $10 over small number of packages no longer seems so exorbitant. Add rent, utilities, non-production office staff wages, inventory spoils and thefts and other business expenses and this seller may be actually subsidizing his Canadian sales by income from his US sales.

This is not exactly case of OP since he was incorrectly charged import charges, I am simply pointing out, buyer has no right to argue seller charges as long as seller does not bait&switch and delivers agreed item in agreed condition under agreed costs within agreed timeframe, the actual postage means nothing, it is just one of the many business costs.

Good example is Passports Canada. Delivery by courier included in price of passport, in person pickup +$20.

[retroburbia]

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@dipmicro wrote:

Nobody complains about free shipping - hey seller, you did not charge me anything for shipping and I see you paid $10.

In my opinion buyer has no place to scrutinize seller's shipping terms, because buyer does not know seller's arrangements, situation and real costs. Also Ebay is not setup for sellers who are able to ship from multiple points of origin, so such sellers simply use most popular one, it is not misrepresentation. Also the shipping services on .COM are USPS-centric, there is no CanadaPost, it is how Ebay is setup, sellers just work within limitations of Ebay.

Hypothetical example - Canadian company has 90% sales to USA, so they hire fulfillment service for US orders but handle Canada orders internally. Fulfillment services are inexpensive, effective and offer lower shipping rates than PO directly. Say CanadaPost does not pickup at this company location, trip to PO takes 15-20min one way, take wages and $0.40/km car expenses and $10 over small number of packages no longer seems so exorbitant. Add rent, utilities, non-production office staff wages, inventory spoils and thefts and other business expenses and this seller may be actually subsidizing his Canadian sales by income from his US sales.

This is not exactly case of OP since he was incorrectly charged import charges, I am simply pointing out, buyer has no right to argue seller charges as long as seller does not bait&switch and delivers agreed item in agreed condition under agreed costs within agreed timeframe, the actual postage means nothing, it is just one of the many business costs.

Good example is Passports Canada. Delivery by courier included in price of passport, in person pickup +$20.

---

Not sure what free shipping, fulfillment services and passport costs have to do with my case, except insofar as referencing them in a fallacious manner can be used to justify some selling practices, which, by the way, do not apply to the case under discussion. One would think that good customer service principles -- applied in the name of building business through sales -- would involve considering that practices perceived as unfair by customers is not the way to sell. Shipping charges, and the spirit in which they should be properly levied, are not about creating an additional revenue stream to cover overhead and/or increase profit margins. If a seller honestly believes that it is okay for sellers to gouge on shipping and needlessly cost customers extra fees, then I think it's lost on those sellers who actually has the power in the marketplace. Unfair charges upset customers and upset customers don't like spending money and money not spent means no sales. Moreover, I'm afraid that the actual postage does mean something, as postage is the expense I incur. If a seller can be fair-minded and accommodating in this regard, then that seller will get my repeat business. I've had dozens and dozens of sellers give refunds for postage overcharges. I respect this and keep this in mind when I spend my money, because these sellers are considerate enough to give some thought to my economic interests.

[maggiebvintage2010]

I have a question about this one.  If the seller is located in Canada, but has in their listings that product ships from the US, and also has import charges,is this seller listing on .com, using a service such as ChitChat Express to take their sold packages to US, and then using the GSP to ship to Erlanger KY from there on?

The OP states that the listing included import charges in the total costs, but didn't mention the GSP.

It would be interesting to have the original listing number,

[mater721]

"I am simply pointing out, buyer has no right to argue seller charges as long as seller does not bait&switch and delivers agreed item in agreed condition under agreed costs within agreed timeframe, the actual postage means nothing, it is just one of the many business costs."

Wrong.

As a buyer, I have every right to be upset when I find out I've been misled. Related to a concept called trust. It's a poor business plan that ignores this concept.

Maybe you don't care about it, but others obviously do.

[patken123]

As a buyer, I have every right to be upset when I find out I've been misled. Related to a concept called trust. It's a poor business plan that ignores this concept.

Maybe you don't care about it, but others obviously do.

+1.

I think everyone of us care if we  were intentionally misled by a deceptive seller ,it is however up to the buyer to figure that out.

to deceive potential buyers in the manner described in theOP is (as you said )a" poor business plan" and a sign of shortsightedness,so if enough buyers report the listing and leave appropriate/ negative feedbacks,this seller won't be in business much longer.

[dipmicro]

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@mater721 wrote:

"I am simply pointing out, buyer has no right to argue seller charges as long as seller does not bait&switch and delivers agreed item in agreed condition under agreed costs within agreed timeframe, the actual postage means nothing, it is just one of the many business costs."

Wrong.

As a buyer, I have every right to be upset when I find out I've been misled. Related to a concept called trust. It's a poor business plan that ignores this concept.

Maybe you don't care about it, but others obviously do.

---

You took something out of context, cut half the sentence and replied to it.

Explain: if seller delivers agreed item in agreed condition under agreed costs within agreed timeframe. How was the buyer mislead ? 

[retroburbia]

That's the whole point of my complaint. The costs were not agreed upon. It was unnecessary for me to pay an import charge or an overinflated shipping charge. The seller was trying to gouge and I called him on it. Imagine that, a consumer who considers his economic interest, because nobody likes paying more than is fair.

[mater721]

"You took something out of context, cut half the sentence and replied to it."

You mean these two parts of the sentence?

"This is not exactly case of OP since he was incorrectly charged import charges,"

"the actual postage means nothing, it is just one of the many business costs."

Please explain how they help your position. They actually make it worse.

"Explain: if seller delivers agreed item in agreed condition under agreed costs within agreed timeframe. How was the buyer mislead ?"

Conditions of sale are being changed. Or more correctly, the falsified part is being revealed. Did you not read the entire post?

I know that if I bid on an item from NA, and found out it was actually coming from China, I'd be upset. Similar to OP case.

Again, it goes to trust. If seller lied about one thing, they could lying about other things too.

[dipmicro]

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@mater721 wrote:

"You took something out of context, cut half the sentence and replied to it."

You mean these two parts of the sentence?

"This is not exactly case of OP since he was incorrectly charged import charges,"

"the actual postage means nothing, it is just one of the many business costs."

Please explain how they help your position. They actually make it worse.

---

What you highlighted meant that I am with OP regarding import charges. My disappointment is with buyer scrutinizing seller's postage costs. I don't have "position" since I am not involved in OP's case and you are not the judge. Still avoiding answering my question makes me think you have no answer so you are getting overly defensive.

[mater721]

"Still avoiding answering my question makes me think you have no answer so you are getting overly defensive."

But I did answer your question, right here.

"Conditions of sale are being changed. Or more correctly, the falsified part is being revealed."

Which makes me think you are not reading the posts...

"My disappointment is with buyer scrutinizing seller's postage costs."

It's all part of the same transaction wherein seller tried to leverage costs after buyer committed. Now you are cherry-picking.

"I don't have "position" since I am not involved in OP's case"

"buyer has no right to argue seller charges..." Your words. Sounds like you do have a "position"...

"since I am not involved in OP's case and you are not the judge."

I am not allowed to have an opinion on this matter?

As a buyer, I totally agree with the OP, and would A) Give negative feedback on the experience B) report the seller for a false posting C) never buy from that seller and D) not agree to revised terms. I would make sure seller follows the exact transaction.

[kh-leslie]

Let's try to keep the conversation friendly and welcoming for everyone. Interpersonal disputes and hostile comments may result in the thread being locked. Thanks, li-leslie