Canadapost lettermail to USA

I have some items to ship that are < .8" thick  which is the lettermail maximum (<80grams). I usually enclose them in cardboard so they lay flat and even in the envelope (4"x6").  Sometime i get hassled by the clerk to use parcel service and/or fill out a customs declaration at 3-7x the cost.  Normally I would use chitchats via USPS but sometimes CP is more convenient. What is your experience with CP?  

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

It doesn't matter if it touches the side of the 2cm slot: the rule is that the enveloppe must be able to go through UNASSISTED.  If you let it fall into the slot, and it doesn't jam, then it's within the specs.  You can buy the official plastic template here: https://www.canadapost-postescanada.ca/shop-magasin/en/mail-pack-ship-fournitures-de-poste-demballag...
I don't know why it's only available to be a small seller/business to buy it nowadays, as I got mine in a postal office 20 years ago, but you can become a member for free.  Everyone should enter the program anyway, because you get discounts on almost everything except regular stamps!

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

Like many things with the post office it all depends on who's on the other side of the counter. The "rules" will vary a lot between PMs.

 

I've had many PMs over the last 40+ years, had everything from can't touch to as long as two of them can pull on it to get it through without breaking the plastic it is ok to don't care as long as it doesn't come back.

 

Generally my experience has been as long as it goes through easily the PMs have been fine.

 

 

Message 22 of 50
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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

If you purchase discount postage make sure to consider any shipping and taxes and remember that $50 face would actually cost $50 plus tax at the post office.

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

You can lodge a complaint about the post master if they don't follow the rule of their own template.  But if you go to a postal outlet within another business instead of an official post office, you might be dealing with someone who wasn't trained properly.

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

@fh991586  the only ones I've ever had a "problem" with are fill in folks, or in the times when I had to send stuff in the city.

 

I am happily in a wee village, I've always had very much above and beyond service in all my 40+ years from the PMs.... they especially appreciate us eBayers that buy real stamps in this day and age..... I use a combination of new stamps and old stamps because I sell to collectors and they very much appreciate modern stamps on their packages.

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

Thanks for the template information. I just ordered one now. I had asked them quite some time ago at the office if something like this was available and they told me that it had been long discontinued. Guess not. Thanks again.

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

Warning: Long post ahead.

 

I work as a postal clerk, and have managed an authorized dealer post office as well; I consider myself well-trained (I've been doing this for over five years) - I've done all the online training (which I can assure you 95% of clerks in authorized retail settings have not done), and I've read the 1100+ page "Retail Operations Manual". In addition I've been selling online for nearly a decade now so I also consider myself adept in the various rules regarding shipping things around the world.

 

There is no "official" word/rule/regulation from Canada Post regarding how exactly the Oversized Lettermail item must fit through the slot. Anyone saying "it can't touch the sides" is just assuming that's the rule and/or they were told that by a superior at one point and have continued to run with it. As far as I'm concerned, as long as I can jam it through that 2 cm slot then it can go as Oversized Lettermail domestically. If it like barely fits through I'll tell the customer "it's right at the limit - I can send it Lettermail if you want, but it's at your risk; worse case scenario it will come back to you with postage due". I don't think I've ever had a customer come back and complain that their Oversized Lettermail item was returned to them due postage. As others have said, this interaction can be completely bypassed by just applying your own stamps and depositing the item in a mailbox.

 

And then we get into the sticky mix that is sending "non-Letter" items via International Letter-post. The Canadian Postal guide breaks International Letter-post down into "Acceptable Items" and "Unacceptable Items". Acceptable items include "items made of paper or other material with general characteristics of paper (for example, photographs)". This is very cut and dry: Is the item you're mailing made of paper or a paper-like substance? If yes - go ahead and ship it Letter-post! It no - sorry, you'll have to fill out a customs declaration and ship it as a parcel.

 

If we look at the items specifically deemed Unacceptable to be sent via Letter-post  (and ignore the obvious things like dangerous goods/unmailable items) there are three main things specified: (1) small packets; (2) goods; and (3) film, audio, or video recordings (for example, diskettes, CDs, or DVDs). Pretty vague, right (at least for the first two)? By saying "small packets" they're basically saying "hey, if your item doesn't look/feel like a regular letter, it probably shouldn't be going as a letter and if it's in a non-paper envelope then it is automatically suspicious". Canada Post doesn't provide an official definition of what they mean by "goods", but Google gives a definition of "merchandise or posessions" which is a fairly standard definition. Guess what: literally EVERYTHING that you sell (i.e. it has a commercial value) would be considered "goods" and therefore TECHNICALLY can NOT be shipped via International Letter-post and must go as a parcel with a customs declaration. Yes, even if you're mailing a piece of paper (which is acceptable to go as letter-post!), but it's a piece of paper that you SOLD (i.e. deemed as 'merchandise' with a commercial value), then it is now considered "goods" and should be sent as a parcel with a customs declaration.

 

Now with that being said, does everyone follow these rules? Of course not, or this wouldnt even be a topic of conversation. The simple fact of the matter is that the vast majority of your mail is sorted by computers and conveyor belts that have no idea what is inside the outer casing. Neither Canada Post, the customs agency in the country you're sending to, or that country's postal service has the time to assess every piece of mail coming into the country to try and determine whether or not it's a letter. And for that reason I tend to run with the rule "if it looks like a letter, it is probably a letter". In my experience as long as your item is packaged in such a way that it looks like a letter it's going to be delivered to it's destination just fine. Is there a chance it could be rejected at some point and returned to you? Of course. Is there a chance your mail could be heavily delayed if someone catches it and sets it aside for "further processing"? Definitely (and that 'delay' is probably going to be quite significant because the people at customs aren't going to be in a huge hurry to deal with items that they KNOW you tried to fraudulently sneak by them). Is there a chance you could be investigated by a postal inspector and potentially fined for your actions which may or may not be considered customs fraud? I mean I guess, but the chances of that happening are pretty low, especially if you're an eBay seller only sending out a few items a day/week.

 

Any opinions expressed here are my own and do not represent the opinions of Canada Post. If you ask me questions on this topic while I'm in uniform at work then I'm probably going to give you a different answer than if you ask me while I'm sitting at home on my computer.

 

In summary: Can you mail something you sold online via International Letter-post? Technically, no.

Do people still do it? Yes, of course.

Should you do it? Ultimately that's a decision that you need to make and depends on your risk tolerance. But in my own experience, 95% of the time it will arrive just fine if it "looks like a letter". The other 5% of the time the items just disappear into thin air. Did they disappear because they were sent improperly without a customs declaration? Who knows.

 

My one piece of "golden advice" to any Canadian online reseller would be to NEVER set foot in a Canada Post location, and NEVER trust a single piece of information that is said to you by ANY employee or representative of Canada Post. I realize the irony of me saying that but it's 2021 - there is no reason you need to set foot in a post office. You can find answers to your questions online either through official channels, or by asking fellow resellers. You can print your labels online (at a cheaper price than going into the post office!) and have your things picked up or drop them in a mailbox. And you can buy stamps online (at a cheaper rate than going into a post office!). This is YOUR business - do what makes sense for you from a business perspective.

Message 27 of 50
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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

Message 28 of 50
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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

 - there is no reason you need to set foot in a post office.

 

Actually there is. I use stamps purchased ata discount and there is no way to deduct the applied stamps from the online shipping label.

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

@dinomitesales 

 

Thanks again for all the very useful but hard to nail down information (at times). Honest perspectives are greatly appreciated.

 

As far as it goes for setting my feet inside a postal depot the main reason I do is to get that original scan to let my customers know their items are on the way. Letters I drop in the bin. The clerk scans and gently places in a bin for later pick up. (Also lets me know if i have or haven't missed the driver that day. The other reasons I don't like using the red bin is sometimes my items are on the heavier/bulky side. No worries of crushing someone's el delicato parcels that were sent without proper packing material or they just don't fit. Now if CP would have added a slightly larger mail slot with their darn community mail boxes? Are they really 2 cms?

 

 2omehe.jpg

-Lotz

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

Yes, I know there are a few reasons to still go into a post office, such as the one you mentioned (although there are very few people doing this these days so I would consider it an edge case). Others include purchasing Registered Lettermail shipping and getting your items scanned in if you don't do enough volume to request a pick-up. Or hey, maybe you have a great relationship with your local clerk and they treat you well and handle your items just the way you like. Awesome - bully for you.

 

I still stand by my main point that for the vast majority of cases there is no need to be going into a post office if you don't need to. Especially for Lettermail-related issues/inquiries, which was the main topic of conversation on this thread. And unless you have an established relationship with the clerk you're dealing with take anything they say with a heavy grain of salt (this goes double for any authorized dealer locations).

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA


@dinomitesales wrote:

 

Any opinions expressed here are my own and do not represent the opinions of Canada Post. If you ask me questions on this topic while I'm in uniform at work then I'm probably going to give you a different answer than if you ask me while I'm sitting at home on my computer.

 


Excellent post and I couldn't agree more with this part haha. This applies to many situation too... When I am at work and I know everything is recorded, I stick to the "book" for everything I say. When I'm at home or when I'm chatting with friends who are asking for my opinion, I tell them what I truly think and also give them the standard answer for reference lol.

 

I sell books and I mail anything under 200g with letterpost, anything above with small packet air. Because the price point for 500g letter/SPair are so similar anyway, I'd ship SPair for the internal tracking code on the label (I get delivery status on most of the USA ones). Personally I only had one letter bounced back (aside from the ones when buyer gave me wrong address) and it wasn't insufficient postage... I used a bunch of discount postage and I guess whoever bounced it back mis-counted it. So I simply took it back to a CP outlet and literally counted it together with the clerk to have it remailed. Ever since then I just wrote the postage on the envelope with the math and it didn't get bounce back again. 

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

Thanks for explaining this in such detail.

 

I am surprised that only 95% of the questionable lettermail arrives and the rest just disappears. How did you come up with this number? 

 

Up until now, I have gone to the post office to get the official $3.19 "stamp" on my letter because I believed it would increase the chances of not being returned. My "Lettermail" is about 18mm thick so very close to the limit.

From your explanation it does not make any difference?

 

 

 

Message 33 of 50
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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

You can buy oversized stamps (1.94) and USA stamps (1.30). These equal 3.24, which is 5 cents more. In certain scenarios, the 5 cents extra will be worth the convenience of not having to stand in line at the post office. 

 

You can also make up exactly 3.19 with 1 x 1.30 + 2 x .92 + 1 x .05. The only problem with this is that you may have trouble finding 5 cent stamps. Also, if you're doing high volumes, it will take more time to make up bubble mailers with four stamps including one you have to lick. 

 

 

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA


@martik777 wrote:

I need the clerk to buy the $3.19 postage. I guess I could just apply some standard demonination stamps.


My local depot no longer carries a variety of higher denomination stamps. If I expect to have (Canadian) oversized letters I just ask the clerk to preprint the denominations I use by placing the appropriate max weight on the scale and manually printing the quantity required. They will have the printed days date on them but never had an issue using over time or buyers complaining. This way you will have on hand and can drop in a bin as you use.

 

-Lotz

Message 35 of 50
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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

Received the metric slot thing I mentioned earlier.

It is sturdy and accurate.

My only complaint is that it is only 165mm long and the slot is 150 mm long.

This means I can't easily measure the larger envelopes (8x10") a size I don't often use anyway.

Message 36 of 50
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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

What do you mean?  It's not supposed to be used to measure anything, but check if it fits within a specific range!  If your item doesn't get through the slot, then it's too big for that category...

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

If an envelope is 200+mm long on both sides then it can't be 'fed through' a slot that is only 150mm wide in order to check if it is under 2 cm thick.    It could still be less than maximum thickness and more than 155mm in width or length and still be an oversize letter.

 

An 8x10" envelope is 204mm x 254mm

The maximum for oversize lettermail is 380mm x 270mm

Message 38 of 50
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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA

Just today at CP, l mailed a 1974 uk 10p coin to the states, the stamp should have cost $1.92. Hardly an 1/8th of an inch thick, l got charged another 1.95 as it would not pass easily through some slot she had. Now the coin was $1.50, so basically lost the lot. Absolutely no point selling coins.

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Re: Canadapost lettermail to USA


@terence427427 wrote:

Just today at CP, l mailed a 1974 uk 10p coin to the states, the stamp should have cost $1.92. Hardly an 1/8th of an inch thick, l got charged another 1.95 as it would not pass easily through some slot she had. Now the coin was $1.50, so basically lost the lot. Absolutely no point selling coins.


Another possible plan of attack would be to sell in mixed lots and use a tracked  calculated service to make it both worthwhile for you and your buyers. Really all depends on your potential volume of items.

 

-Lotz

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