Getting a bump in visibility

[ericsells75]

After selling for a couple years now it is abundantly clear that posting new listings gives a temporary boost in visibility. The numbers speak for themselves basically a majority of my sales come within a day or two when I am actively posting new listings. My question is there any other ways people have found to duplicate this? Ie. are there other ways you’ve seen to be ‘active’ with your shop without posting new listings? Changing titles and descriptions on an existing listing? Editing store? Etc…

[ilikehockeyjerseys]

There are two factors to getting views and marketing your items. One factor is eBay's search algorithm and how the average person interfaces with eBay. The other factor is in how you market your own store.

You seem to sell a lot of odds and ends. Different things. This is going to hurt your ability to boost sales, engagement, views, etc. 

If you are sourcing your inventory from thrift stores, garage sales, etc - try to find a niche of similar types of items. 

An example, let's say you sell mugs. That's your thing. You're gonna be the guy who knows everything about mugs, which ones appeal to people, which you will buy. When you list a mug on eBay, you can use each listing to drive traffic to your eBay store by marketing the fact that you have hundreds of mugs and offer combined shipping. Someone who likes mugs is more likely to view your eBay store that has thousands of mugs rather than your eBay store that has thousands of unrelated items. 

All these extra views also supposedly help you in the 'Best Match' algorithm because people interface with your items. 

Then, it also helps you manage your time and run your business more efficiently because it's a lot faster and easier to manage a store where all the items are the same size. If you sell odds and ends, everything is photographed differently. Everything takes a different size box or bubble mailer. Etc. If you sell the same items, you can photograph items assembly line style in seconds per item. You can pack an item in under a minute because they are all packed the same way and you can set up your packing area with the same supplies. 

In short, the nature of your store with so many odds and ends is going to hurt your placement in the 'Best Match'. I don't think there is going to be any magical short cut to improve your placement because you're going to have a difficult time pushing engagement with hundreds of niche items that don't really match or entice customers to engage with more than one listing at your store. 

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@ericsells75 wrote:
After selling for a couple years now it is abundantly clear that posting new listings gives a temporary boost in visibility. The numbers speak for themselves basically a majority of my sales come within a day or two when I am actively posting new listings. My question is there any other ways people have found to duplicate this? Ie. are there other ways you’ve seen to be ‘active’ with your shop without posting new listings? Changing titles and descriptions on an existing listing? Editing store? Etc…

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@ericsells75 

In the past those methods appeared to cause small bumps. Going forward...Long answer....No!! From a multitude of constantly run testing and retesting.

As of late, whenever there is a seasonal announcement with a variety of system updates I have had a signifigant drop in traffic/business. Your mileage may vary. From my personal POV the only major improvement that needs to be made (can't be made soon enough) is the capability to show buyers discounted (actual) shipping values. (Level 4 with CP). Extremely important to consider that there was a basically across the board rate increase with CP September 11 that is affecting what buyers routinely see.

-Lotz

[ilikehockeyjerseys]

In terms of how the average person interfaces with eBay, the average person either goes 'Best Match' or 'Newly Listed'. 

Constantly reposting your stuff doesn't help with newly listed, because anybody who views newly listed on a regular basis already saw your item when you posted it last week, or the week before.

Newly listed is for hardcore collectors, not someone looking for say My Cousin Vinny On DVD because there is no real benefit to seeing the newest of an item that has hundreds of options. They're either clicking on the most appealing 'Best Match' option, or if they are really saavy "Price + Shipping Lowest First", but I suspect 'Best Match' is used more often based on the amount of items that sell that are not the lowest priced.

New listings sometimes get a temporary bump in 'Best Match'. Reposting it only helps if it still gives you a bump in 'Best Match'. The claim is that eBay stopped that exploit. 

A big disadvantage with eBay Canada is that we do not have the same marketing tools that eBay US has in order to boost engagement and turn someone buying 1 item into someone who will buy multiple items. Ironically, Canada has high shipping costs domestically, so it would benefit more to have these features like buy x amount get 1 free.

If you want your items to appear in 'Best Match', you have to find ways to boost engagement. For example, notice how if you get a few lowball offers on an item, it sometimes sells a few days later? Getting a bunch of views, watchers, and offers pushes it up the 'Best Match' (I assume, I don't know for sure), then other people see it. That goes back to me saying you're at a disadvantage due to how fragmented your inventory is. 

I said "mugs" as an example, but I have no idea if mugs are good to sell. My suggestion is that if you're looking for a project, find some sort of niche item that you can zero in on and create an eBay store where you mostly only sell that type of item. 

[flipistics]

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@ilikehockeyjerseys wrote:

I said "mugs" as an example, but I have no idea if mugs are good to sell. My suggestion is that if you're looking for a project, find some sort of niche item that you can zero in on and create an eBay store where you mostly only sell that type of item. 

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Tim Hortons mugs seem to do really well, especially the older travel mugs in good condition.

With regards to the original topic, there seems to be good evidence that items get a boost when they're listed, but I think the entire store also gets a boost on certain activity. I suspect that's both listing as well as making sales. I also think the boost on sales may be regional and the boost on listing may be more general, but I'm not sure on that.  If I have a bunch of items to list, I'll generally schedule them to appear about an hour apart from each other. I don't know if it helps or not, but I can't see it hurting.  I've also noticed a sales bump when I list a bunch of items multiple days in a row (and the sales usually aren't the items I just listed).

[ilikehockeyjerseys]

I don't know anything about mugs, I just chose a random item for the example.

The point is that people speculate part of it is that engagement = higher best match placement. One way to increase engagement is to give incentive for someone who clicks on one listing to click on and engage with (watch, offers, buy) other listings.

If you have a store that is more of a variety of items, you will have a more difficult time increasing engagement because one customer clicks on one item and that is it. 

In terms of newly listed, item specifics, etc - there have been two pretty good threads over the last week or so that should be on page 1 or 2 with info on this. One linking to a podcast interview, and one linking to a Youtube clip. 

[msau4301]

I do auctions which works for me in my vintage Barbie category (but certainly not for everyone) and so I'm lucky in that every week when I post my new ones I get activity with views and some sales, but also on my  re-lists (those that didn't sell on my last 5 day auction). I always thought people looking at the new ones chose "see sellers other items" and that's why the older ones sometimes got noticed but I'm not sure how much is the algorithim thing and how much are my followers checking in because they see I'm listing something new. For myself the Buy it Now does not work for me as well as auctions so I continue as I have for several years now. I know when I have had Buy it Now listed for long it dies off to no activity at all, in the old days I feel they still got some action, things change so much even if something is finally working for us we have to wonder for how long. If you thing new listings are giving a temporary boost you don't have to do a lot even just a few, or even leave some in drafts and release them each week (they'll still be new listings).

[reallynicestamps]

It's often said that when an item that has been languishing on the Unsold List is reposted as Sell Similar, the algorithm sees it as Newly Listed and gives it a boost.

It can be worthwhile to take down some tired listings for a few weeks, give them a quick dusting and spitpolish then relist as Sell Similar.

Then there is Promoted Listing.

Sorry.

I use PL Standard at the lowest (2%) fee on my oldest continuous listings. And by older- I sold an item yesterday that was listed in 2017 .
I also believe with @msau4301  that Stores which encourage "see other items" are helped by PL, since a Viewer can easily find similar items by Searching from the left column once PL brings them to the Store.
The other point about PLStandard is that if it doesn't sell, you don't pay.  And if the customer is pulled in by PL but buys something else, you don't pay the PL fee on the non-PL item.

[intimewithmusic]

@reallynicestamps,

@lotz

 It's my understanding since April eBay has implemented AI to defeat the effect of using "Sell similar". 

The AI will look at your Sell Sim Or Relist and if it has the same photos and generally the same Title/description it will no longer allow it to reappear as a new listing. 

Although activity is important it's specific kinds of account activity that makes a difference.  I posted this link in a separate thread a few days back called "Search issues, Item Specifics, Sales Flux, Sell Sim & everything else explained Valerie Yee of eBay" .

Valeri Yee (19 years with eBay) nicely explains what eBay has done  and what you can do to get a bump in visibility.  She starts 10 min into this podcast and it is well worth the listen.

https://music.amazon.ca/podcasts/abf7e1bc-f597-44fb-8faa-a1eef03537fb/episodes/770a65cb-5555-46c1-ac... 

If the link doesn't work for you it is "THE SELLING ON EBAY RADIO SHOW" Podcast  Episode 61 October 2nd

It should be added that this is NOT an eBay podcast. It's a pair of sellers interviewing eBay.

IT

[ricarmic]

It amazes me the frequency of a sale during the actual time I'm listing items (not of an item just listed). I usually list 10* at a time (theoretically every day, but alas that is much more a goal than a realization) and it takes me 10 to 30 mins depending on what's being listed, how many distractions occur etc. 

The number of sales during physical listing time is much much higher than statistically should be the case, so whilst one is putting stuff up, it is causing something to happen visibility wise.

(This is against a running number of items above 4,000 so 10 is NOT a lot in terms of growing my "size"....)

[flipistics]

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@intimewithmusic wrote:

Although activity is important it's specific kinds of account activity that makes a difference.  I posted this link in a separate thread a few days back called "Search issues, Item Specifics, Sales Flux, Sell Sim & everything else explained Valerie Yee of eBay" .

Valeri Yee (19 years with eBay) nicely explains what eBay has done  and what you can do to get a bump in visibility.  She starts 10 min into this podcast and it is well worth the listen.

https://music.amazon.ca/podcasts/abf7e1bc-f597-44fb-8faa-a1eef03537fb/episodes/770a65cb-5555-46c1-ac... 

If the link doesn't work for you it is "THE SELLING ON EBAY RADIO SHOW" Podcast  Episode 61 October 2nd

It should be added that this is NOT an eBay podcast. It's a pair of sellers interviewing eBay.

IT

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It's an interesting episode. They really need the department leads to talk about things once a month or something. Communication is a big issue, especially when it feels like the "suggestion box" is connected to a black hole. Being able to interact with some of them virtually with eBay Open was amazing.

[intimewithmusic]

   I agree. I follow this podcast because Phillip Jackson (host) is very good at questioning guests. for those that don't know of him his store sells higher end electronic equipment. He stays very current with new issues that sellers complain about.

   In general the podcast episodes are up and down in informational value and it's not often they interview eBay employees.  This instance (episode 61) was due to eBay open. They also had Griff on there in an earlier episode but he's basically a promotional front man whereas Valeri works in the back end and has the nitty gritty knowledge.

   This is the first time I've heard eBay itself address these current issues in detail with clarity. For example I was quite surprised to hear her offer her "litmus test" towards what to promote and what not to promote as well as how to trick the new AI "Sell Similar defense" by rewriting a listing differently. I tried her key word suggestion out in two new listings for books. Instead of putting the title as the first key word I put the author in the front. (Both books same author) . Both books sold within 24 hours to the same buyer. I think her clarity was mostly due to Phillip's skillful interviewing techniques. It took her off guard at times. 

   Although most of this episode applies to Canadian seller issues it's unfortunate there isn't a similar situation where eBay Canadas employees step up to the plate like this. For example it would be nice to have some eBay guidance and navigation towards cultivation of sales to the EU an opportunity that's vanishing for Canadian sellers.

   Great stuff!

[darak10]

personally I think you are right, I think continually listing new items is a factor in their search algorithm that does promote items up the ranking.  I have had too many instances to count where I havent had a sale in 10 hours or so and within minutes of starting listing for the day I make a sale or a number of sales in succession.  Too, too, too many times to count. Many times they happen as I am writing up the first listing of the day.  Not a coincidence imo.  I normally post new stuff 6-7 days a week, although the total volume per day is lower than usual as I dont have time to do more.  

I must qualify that by saying trying to figure out the search algorithm that results in sales is voodoo, nobody knows what works entirely and even if they knew (which I dont think they do) ebay aint gonna tell us, its going to let us keeping fumbling around in the dark to try to figure out what works and what doesnt as they know as well as any behavioral psychologist worth their salt that the intermittent reinforcement is what keeps us coming back right haha.  

[darak10]

as per sales to the EU from Canada, my personal experience with this is that due to VAT this market is now dead to us.  Theres unfortunately no way to resurrect it.  Apart from well heeled Norwegians, Swiss and Austrians - who, compared to the pre July 2021 days of yore, rarely ever come around anymore - its essentially pointless for Canadian sellers to pursue this market imo.  VAT may be a 'value added tax' (value to whom exactly??) for them, but for us it functions as a tariff and a barrier to trade.  Companies cant file complaints with the WTO over how another country restricts foreign companies ability to sell in a particular market, but the Canadian government could do it if it wanted to, if enough people were to pressure them on it.  I had a cheapskate from northern Europe - not Norway, those guys NEVER complain about price haha - the other day try to use this reality to get me to drop the price on an item - oh VAT is so high, feel sorry for meeee - i didnt bite and he (predictably) disappeared.   Its a real shame- I had a real strong presence there, 7 of my top ten intl markets were in the EU, which are all now completely gone.  Its cost me alot of money and turned this from a decent and satisfying full time operation into a middling, cumbersome, increasingly disappointing borderline waste of time for me.   I think this is the reason why ebay is silent about this issue to us, they know the score but dont want to come out and openly say so because they have skin in the EU game and dont want to step on their toes.  

The way I see it intl ecommerce (not including the US, our economies are largely intertwined) is fragmenting due to cost of living /cost of goods increases and customers are being pushed towards purchasing domestically or from nearby countries in order to save money.  One of the few exceptions are the Aussies, god bless them, despite the absolutely stupid shipping prices I have to charge them coupled with their own domestic currency devaluation, they still come around.  What EU customers used to do on here is what Americans still do to us - use us to get a deal based on exchange rate differential. With 20% added on to all EU purchases the incentive for them to buy Canadian is gone forever in a puff of smoke, it wont return for us and imo its a waste of time to pursue.  

The market has shifted for us Canadian sellers to primarily domestic and to a lesser extent the US, fine tuning to these markets is the path forward.  One thing Ive noticed over the last couple years how many **bleep** sellers there are on here from Alberta (hey Dave! haha), especially Edmonton.  Having no provincial sales tax here is a real leg up for us I think.  Maybe we should start an Alberta ebay sellers group haha (I nominate Lotz to run it haha)

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@darak10 wrote:

as per sales to the EU from Canada, my personal experience with this is that due to VAT this market is now dead to us.  Theres unfortunately no way to resurrect it.  Apart from well heeled Norwegians, Swiss and Austrians - who, compared to the pre July 2021 days of yore, rarely ever come around anymore - its essentially pointless for Canadian sellers to pursue this market imo.  VAT may be a 'value added tax' (value to whom exactly??) for them, but for us it functions as a tariff and a barrier to trade.  Companies cant file complaints with the WTO over how another country restricts foreign companies ability to sell in a particular market, but the Canadian government could do it if it wanted to, if enough people were to pressure them on it.  I had a cheapskate from northern Europe - not Norway, those guys NEVER complain about price haha - the other day try to use this reality to get me to drop the price on an item - oh VAT is so high, feel sorry for meeee - i didnt bite and he (predictably) disappeared.   Its a real shame- I had a real strong presence there, 7 of my top ten intl markets were in the EU, which are all now completely gone.  Its cost me alot of money and turned this from a decent and satisfying full time operation into a middling, cumbersome, increasingly disappointing borderline waste of time for me.   I think this is the reason why ebay is silent about this issue to us, they know the score but dont want to come out and openly say so because they have skin in the EU game and dont want to step on their toes.  

The way I see it intl ecommerce (not including the US, our economies are largely intertwined) is fragmenting due to cost of living /cost of goods increases and customers are being pushed towards purchasing domestically or from nearby countries in order to save money.  One of the few exceptions are the Aussies, god bless them, despite the absolutely stupid shipping prices I have to charge them coupled with their own domestic currency devaluation, they still come around.  What EU customers used to do on here is what Americans still do to us - use us to get a deal based on exchange rate differential. With 20% added on to all EU purchases the incentive for them to buy Canadian is gone forever in a puff of smoke, it wont return for us and imo its a waste of time to pursue.  

The market has shifted for us Canadian sellers to primarily domestic and to a lesser extent the US, fine tuning to these markets is the path forward.  One thing Ive noticed over the last couple years how many **bleep** sellers there are on here from Alberta (hey Dave! haha), especially Edmonton.  Having no provincial sales tax here is a real leg up for us I think.  Maybe we should start an Alberta ebay sellers group haha (I nominate Lotz to run it haha)

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@darak10 

Thanks, but no thanks. Between the neverending tinkering with search and the unlevel playing field us Canucks have with shipping (product vs stuff that can go letter) we are in the middle of a uphill climb on an icy road.

-Lotz

[intimewithmusic]

    Unfortunately the change in shipping to the EU is indescriminate.  It is crippling to everyone. How it affects you is about what you sell.

  For myself it's a painful loss because the EU is a great and respectful market for music memorabilia specificaly, printed memorabilia. My EU customers never flinched at the cost of shipping an envelope or air jacket containing a manual. a brochure or a catalog requiring very little packaging .

  eBay US is looking after the problem for it's american sellers which are my competition. I'm not sure why eBay isn't doing the same for Canadians.

[darak10]

amen brother.  profoundly apt metaphor.   I think its time for someone to develop a standalone app / platform for ecommerce sellers tailored to function specifically in one domestic market, cornering domestic business and shutting every seller outside of a specific country out.  Protectionist markets are where ecommerce is headed.  Makes me want our government to do what these foreign govts are doing - Austria is the most recent I read about on another thread yesterday, demanding user fees to access their market - charge sellers user fees to access the Canadian market.  Knowing how clueless Ottawa is about this issue, if it happens, we'll be the last in the world to adopt it.  

I love how when the German law came down, all these german sellers started coming out of the woodwork, with shipping prices to Canada all below $5.  Pathetic - our federal government allows us to be taken advantage of.  

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

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@darak10 wrote:

amen brother.  profoundly apt metaphor.   I think its time for someone to develop a standalone app / platform for ecommerce sellers tailored to function specifically in one domestic market, cornering domestic business and shutting every seller outside of a specific country out.  Protectionist markets are where ecommerce is headed.  Makes me want our government to do what these foreign govts are doing - Austria is the most recent I read about on another thread yesterday, demanding user fees to access their market - charge sellers user fees to access the Canadian market.  Knowing how clueless Ottawa is about this issue, if it happens, we'll be the last in the world to adopt it.  

I love how when the German law came down, all these german sellers started coming out of the woodwork, with shipping prices to Canada all below $5.  Pathetic - our federal government allows us to be taken advantage of.  

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@darak10 

@intimewithmusic 

A portion of all this are the side affects caused first by all the free listings during Covid and more recently with Promoted taking roost. (Large volume sellers will always win that game over the smaller ones.) This is making for a lot of needle in a haystack search and less of buyers perusing a sellers store. Sellers are now playing our favourite game of whackamole trying to stay 1 step ahead. As I recall in my younger days playing whackamole....The house almost always won. Feel free to include how difficult eBay is making it to combine orders. Did someone just say a tornado is approaching? Batten down the hatches!!! ((Now you say Internationally Selling/Shipping too? Yikes!!))

To quote John Lennon...."Nobody told me there'd be days like these..... Strange days indeed."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGgjUFTfRl8

-Lotz

[darak10]

the change to shipping to the EU is not indiscriminate, it was completely intentional and guided by internal state policy decisions.  It is not ebays choice but was implemented by the economic union upon all ecommerce platforms, which is: do business the way we say, or get lost.  I dont know what you know about how the EU operates and makes decisions about day to day issues but its essentially a dictatorship of unelected officials whose policies are determined by German economic interests with every other member state being told to fall in behind lockstep or hit the road.  Dunno if you are a reader but I thoroughly recommend "Adults In The Room" by Yanis Varoufakis, he was the Greek finance minister during their 2015 bankruptcy crisis and its a behind the scenes tell all of how the political union operates and makes political and policy decisions, without getting into detail he makes a very strong argument that the EU as a political entity is destined to fail for a variety of reasons, but thats besides the point.   The answer to your question is simple: they dont intervene because they know that there's literally nothing they can do about it.  Canadian market share is a drop in the bucket to them, pocket change compared to revenues they make in the US or the EU.   That and a company is not going to advocate for the interests of one subset of sellers when its taking in way more money from the subset of sellers who are the quote unquote 'offenders'(not the proper term to describe what Im talking about, but you know what Im getting at).  Basic conflict of interest.  So Canadian sellers are left with two choices:  either accept it the way it is and deal with it, or go somewhere else.   Both harsh and unfair, and it shouldnt be this way, but it is.  

[darak10]

yeah it is interesting, but for me that there are less combined orders than there used to be I believe is due to customers just not having as much money as they used to have to buy stuff.  Promoted listings Ive found are by in large not effective and I think this is pretty much an open secret.  If there is a move against combined shipping, its from the big guys, who dont do it as its too much of a hassle when youre moving a thousand items a day.   

I still get multiple purchases and combine shipping, but its all in the two to four item range, the 10-15-20 item per order transactions arent happening this last year or so.   That and the pricing of so many sellers on here has become just stupid - perhaps they are adjusting higher to compensate for the rate they have chosen for their promoted listing- I look at the prices of so much stuff on here and start laughing its so ridiculous.  Although not as funny as discogs, I noticed some Finnish sellers on there yesterday wanting like $80 shipping to Canada bahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha