eBay

andyandted · ‎01-21-2017

I recently sold an item on ebay. I clearly stated the item was as is, I clearly stated what I had tested and what I did not. Thus I stated the item was sold as is and I started the bidding at .99cents. The buyer is now demanding a full refund for something I never tested. He states that because it was "USED" he will be allowed to return it? At this point feeling bad for the buyer, I offered a partial refund as a good will gesture. He refused and continues to demand a full refund. Can someone enlighten me as to my prognosis.

momcqueen · ‎01-21-2017

Returns are fairly straightforward.

Offer him a full refund in exchange for a Return. If he doesn't like it, he doesn't need to keep it.

You might, however, be required to fund the return postage if he opens the Return case stating it was not as described.

Was it?

pocomocomputing · ‎01-21-2017

What was the item? eBay Used condition can mean it is functional depending on the category. Stating As Is in the description will not over ride this.

In Consumer Electronics, eBay "Used" usually means this:

An item that has been used previously. The item may have some signs of cosmetic wear, but is fully operational and functions as intended. This item may be a floor model or store return that has been used. See the seller’s listing for full details and description of any imperfections.

You cannot state As Is in electronics categories (and others) for Used to override the"fully functional". You should list with condition "For parts or not working" which is better suited for As Is items if this condition is available.

In other categories, eBay "Used" means this:

An item that has been used previously. See the seller’s listing for full details and description of any imperfections.

andyandted · ‎01-21-2017

Yes he has done that. My issue is that the item was clearly marked, I do not feel obligated to give a full refund. If that the case why list anything as untested and as is. I feel I did my part, I fulfilled all my obligations in this sale, and now the buyer demands full refund? Where does the craziness that is the Buyer Protection stop!

momcqueen · ‎01-21-2017

If you list an elephant in the Dog category, buyers are entitled to expect to receive a dog even if the photo and item description shows an elephant with a sign around its neck that reads, "Elephant!" eBay categorization trumps any seller's item description always.

p.s. The above example is rhetorical. I don't think anyone is allowed to sell an elephant here. But I could be wrong.

recped · ‎01-21-2017

@andyandted wrote:
Yes he has done that. My issue is that the item was clearly marked, I do not feel obligated to give a full refund. If that the case why list anything as untested and as is. I feel I did my part, I fulfilled all my obligations in this sale, and now the buyer demands full refund? Where does the craziness that is the Buyer Protection stop!

Which item?

"What else could I do? I had no trade so I became a peddler" - Lazarus Greenberg 1915
- answering Trolls is voluntary, my policy is not to participate.

andyandted · ‎01-21-2017

@recped wrote:
@andyandted wrote:
Yes he has done that. My issue is that the item was clearly marked, I do not feel obligated to give a full refund. If that the case why list anything as untested and as is. I feel I did my part, I fulfilled all my obligations in this sale, and now the buyer demands full refund? Where does the craziness that is the Buyer Protection stop!
Which item?

It was the Sony MD recorder.

momcqueen · ‎01-21-2017

If you couldn't run a proper test, you probably shouldn't have listed it as Used but instead For Parts or Not Working because, as it turns out, that's what it is. I think you'll have to accept a Return with return postage paid by you. For a full refund. I don't see this working any other way. I'm sorry to tell you that.

2nd-time-around-jewelry · ‎01-21-2017

I have sold many electronics in the past As Is For Parts Or Repair. It doesn't seem to matter even if you state all the things wrong with the item. A lot of buyers still think it will somehow work or that they can easily fix it. When it isn't what they expected they will ask for a refund. And eBay will side with the buyer most of the time. The buyer just needs to say Item Not As Described even if it was clearly described & they can get a refund. The system is not fair to the seller.

momcqueen · ‎01-21-2017

http://pages.ebay.ca/help/sell/item-condition.html#tech

In this category, Used means functional. There's nothing to be done about it now but accept a Return and move forward having learned a valuable lesson.

i.am.vivian · ‎01-21-2017

@andyandted wrote:
My issue is that the item was clearly marked, I do not feel obligated to give a full refund. If that the case why list anything as untested and as is. I feel I did my part, I fulfilled all my obligations in this sale, and now the buyer demands full refund? Where does the craziness that is the Buyer Protection stop!

How was it clearly marked? You say in the listing, " I can not properly test it due to limited time so selling as is". As the others have explained, choosing the category "Used" means you promise absolutely that the item "is fully operational and functions as intended". You are not allowed to suggest that "maybe it works and maybe it doesn't, I haven't got time to check it".

If you can't be completely sure, you need to list an item under "For Parts or not working".

Like the others have told you, you may as well accept the return. You can always resell it later, this time "for parts". You will need to pay return shipping on a "not as described" case, and if the buyer is in Canada you can send them a return shipping label. If the buyer is not in Canada this is trickier. It is not possible to send an international label, so usually the seller & buyer have to come to an agreement. If you find out what tracked shipping is from buyer to you, you can send the buyer the postage amount and tell them to return it with USPS First Class International, for example.

If the buyer never returns the item, apparently you can get your shipping fee back. That would be to prevent buyers from filing false NAD claims and not returning the item just to get a discount. What you should NOT do is let your irritation cause you to ignore the case until the buyer has eBay step in and solve it. That rarely turns out well for the seller.

femmefan1946 · ‎01-22-2017

dustmite-- I think you may misunderstand.

As others have explained, if you use "as is" or "used", eBay will side with the buyer because the unit is deemed to be functional.

If you use "For Parts" the Not As Described claim will fail.

Words are important, not matter what DJ Trump may say.

andyandted · ‎01-22-2017

Lesson learned, need a lawyer to read all the fine print, but your right, it is stated plainly eneough when you figure out where to look

pocomocomputing · ‎01-22-2017

@andyandted wrote:
Lesson learned, need a lawyer to read all the fine print, but your right, it is stated plainly enough when you figure out where to look

The issue of "As Is" has been discussed in the eBay.com USA forums a few times so I am familiar with it. For some reason it has come up in these eBay.ca Canada forums a couple of times recently so I posted to your topic.

From the discussions I read on eBay.com, it appears some buyers look for items listed as used and described "As Is" so they can try to get a discount after buying claiming the item does not work. You cannot dispute it with eBay since the As Is disclaimer because it is listed as "Used - fully functional".

If you list with condition "For parts or not working", then most likely your auction for the "Sony MD" would have had less activity and lower bids. But maybe not, so hard to tell. But you would have had a better chance of not having a claim against you.

If you do list an item as "For parts or not working", description should be limited to cosmetic condition. I have read that even stating "unit powers up but not tested" can result in an "Item not described" claim if the buyers says it does not power up (truthfully or not). Just take a few good pictures and let the pictures speak for themselves.

You winning bidder may be deliberately trying to scam you. You will not know.

I would suggest just telling them "Return for refund". Do not offer a partial refund.

PS Where is the buyer, what country?

2nd-time-around-jewelry · ‎01-22-2017

Not necessarily. I sold an item recently not as used but as Not Working For Parts Or Repair. The buyer requested a return & I had to refund him. eBay sided with the buyer.

momcqueen · ‎01-22-2017

Buyers can request a Return for any reason. Generally, a seller needs to just accept it and move on.

Did your buyer claim SNAD on Not Working For Parts or Repair? How did that go wrong?

pocomocomputing · ‎01-22-2017

@dustmite007 wrote:
Not necessarily. I sold an item recently not as used but as Not Working For Parts Or Repair. The buyer requested a return & I had to refund him. eBay sided with the buyer.

Is this for the ARCHOS 605 WiFi Audio Video Player you recently sold?

While it is listed as For Parts or Not working in Consumer Electronics, in the description you stated "It was working fine, but has been in storage & when I checked it, it had stopped working. It may just be the battery. So selling As Is For Parts Or Repair." So with that sentence you implied to the buyer that it was working and just needed a battery. If you had not put that sentence, you may have had a better chance of selling the item without a claim.

When sell with eBay Condition "For parts or not working", you cannot say anything about the condition in the description. Nothing.

Even then the buyer might be able to claim not as described.

2nd-time-around-jewelry · ‎01-22-2017

I know that now. Best to just be quiet & not say anything. I was brought up to be honest & truthful but that doesn't work on eBay. It will come back to bite you sometimes.

momcqueen · ‎01-22-2017

So it was returned. Did it work like you hoped with a new battery? When you relist it, how will you describe it?

momcqueen · ‎01-22-2017

(At least, I hope you asked for a Return before you refunded. Otherwise, the buyer could have got it working and said it didn't because they knew you wouldn't know otherwise or be able to claim you did. It's better to know for certain whether something works or doesn't so that there is no grey area to exploit.)