Canada Post Holding Lettermail Deliveries Hostage- Then Charging Buyer Package Rates to Release!

[teenytrinkets]

This is the weirdest thing I've ever seen and I'd like some of the longtime sellers that regularily use domestic lettermail to chime in!

These aren't my sales, but rather purchases by someone on one of my buy/sell groups.  She buys small cosmetics that easily fit into an envelope and through the slot - freely.  But she buys a LOT, and her carrier has recently been holding all of her oversize lettermail and delivering cards that indicate an amount owed to pick up (~$16 for the difference in counter package rate vs. o/s lettermail).

Now, normally I wouldn't be that bothered with a particular buyer that was having a bit of a p---ing match with their postie, but this situation is troubling....and one I consider a disservice to all of us sellers that use lettermail.

As sellers, when we ship something o/s lettermail to our buyers, it should:

a) get delivered straight into the mailbox; or

b) get returned to sender for insufficient postage; or

c) be MIA

Since when did insufficient lettermail postage become the responsibility of the buyer?  

AND - doesn't sufficient postage calculation happen at the origin counter or distribution centre (not at the delivery post office/depot by the carrier or other local Canada Post employees)???

Some are speculating that this is a new thing!  That Canada Post is clamping down on products being shipped via lettermail!  Tell me this isn't true!!!

[cumos55]

Here is a link to Canada Post.... and read about what is not allowed in lettermail... not acceptable

https://www.canadapost.ca/tools/pg/manual/PGletterml-e.asp#1380754

[recped]

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@teenytrinkets wrote:

Since when did insufficient lettermail postage become the responsibility of the buyer?  

!!

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Since about 100 years ago!

Maybe 40+ years ago when the postage changed by a couple of cents my mailman knocked on the door to collect 2 cents because somebody used an "old" 15 cent stamp when the current rate was 17 cents.

Fast forward to today, if you ship a package with insufficient postage and an online label Canada Post can charge any shortage back to the shipper instead of collecting from the recipient. If you use stamps then they may collect from the recipient. For letters it depends on when the shortage is noticed, often the only time anyone checks it's the carrier standing at your mailbox.

I've had a couple of lettermail items returned to me in recent years, usually for thickness but also for one where the silly 10 cent stamp fell off (I'm careful about that now and when using those low denomination (licking required) stamps I make sure the self adhesive P stamps are helping to keep them attached (seems like every sheet of 5's and 10's have junk glue and don't stick reliably especially on a poly bubble envelope.

[teenytrinkets]

TOTAL news to me.  Has anyone ever had this happen to them personally (and not 40 years ago...lol)?

[recped]

From Canada Post Q&A (impossible to link to......)

An item is returned to sender when:

• The address doesn’t exist.
• The address on the package is incomplete.
• The person the letter or parcel is addressed to has moved without providing a forwarding address.
• The package or letter is refused by the person receiving it.
• The postage due isn’t paid by the addressee on demand.

So when a letter or package (using stamps) has insufficient postage they first try to collect the shortage from the addressee, if they don't want to pay it gets returned.

[teenytrinkets]

Wow! This is news to me! I've had a couple returned to me, but never any reports of claiming from the recipient!

Thanks for the info!

[recped]

Depends where the postage shortage is found and where it's going to, that International Letter the stamp fell off was back in my mail box the next day so found at the local sort facility. Domestic lettermail might not be spotted until the carrier at the end does their morning sort, better in that case to get it from the recipient than send it back.

[fh991586]

Working for a non-profit, I deal with a lot of mail all year long. I can tell you that some letters will go through with unsufficient stamps (like when an international destination gets the national rate because it was in the wrong pile fed to the stamp machine), but sometimes it will bounce back to the sender. It always depends on how it's processed at the depot (manual or machinery), and it they have the time to deal with it. I got some returns the next day, while others took a week.
Packages aren't processed the same way now: the sender will be billed the difference directly in their account if there was a mistake (official weight higher than declared in electronic submission), so a return or COD is less likely than years ago.

[ilikehockeyjerseys]

With oversized lettermail, underpaid packages go through. I can't say how often though. 

I use stamps for my packages, because it is faster than paying at the counter and easier to track expenses. So for items over 100 grams, I have to add additional stamps to the 1.94 stamp. One time, I accidentally underpaid a package, and only realized it after mailing the item. It went through fine. Maybe it helps that I typically drop a handful of packages in at once, so if all other packages are proper, the one (accidentally) underpaid one might not have stood out. 

Once in a blue moon, I've probably also exceeded the 2CM thickness without issue, but it's not something I'd be comfortable doing on a regular basis. According to the person who works at my post office, they know of people who exceed it on a regular basis, and apparently have no issues. YMMV though. 

So with oversized lettermail, it seems like you have to be very unlucky to have it assessed as underpaid or not within the 2CM restriction. 

[ricarmic]

I have had oversize sent back as being too thick when it wasn't (I have my own PO thickness plexiglass guides). My PM rechecked it, it went through fine, they put it back in the mail and it arrived ok the 2nd time.

Someone on the receiving PO/end got a little overzealous....

I have never heard of any of my buyers having to pay (that has ever let me know).

I haven't (so far) had any come back with insufficient postage, however I do write the amount in the upper corner so if some fall off presumably they can see the right amount was there and the partial postmark (stamps on the box kinda guy) shows that too. They'd also need their calculator because the OS stuff has a LOT of stamps on it!

[peng039663]

l send items in the mail using a large brown envelop, then l glue 3-4 pieces of cardboard together that fit inside the envelop, but not exceeding total 0.75 inches thick. with a razor, l cut out a shape resembling the item to be shipped and wraped tape round the whole thing so it cant move. the cost is around 4-5 bucks depending on the grams weight. the envelop / package seems like it has 40-60 pages inside, it is firm and you cannot tell there is something buried in there. lt always seems to work. but Canada only, never the USA. The USA customs will intercept it, so always parcel post for that.

[femmefan1946]

It's the human touch.

If the postie has a sore back, or had a fight with the foreman, or takes a scunner to the recipient, she has the rules on her side.

I've had lettermail returned for more postage occasionally.  This would be my error usually.

Your friend should be taking note of who is sending the shortpaid items and let them know.  The sender may end up being unable to ship by post if he is constantly underpaying and cheating the system.

Canada Post is pretty lax about a few pennies. It's more efficient to ignore the odd  error than to try to collect but if the sender becomes a notorious scofflaw, it's more serious.

Puts me in mind of those back of book ads in tabloids and adventure magazines selling licenses to ship for a penny. The license was $4.98 or something equally risible.

The scammer would collect those $5 bills and the  license would arrive with a penny stamp (instead of the legal 5c rate) "proving" the license was valid and two one penny stamps in change.

Once caught out the sucker would usually be too embarrassed to complain and the scammer had closed his PO box and disappeared.

[marnotom!]

For what it's worth, I once received a lettermail item from the United States with "postage due" rubber stamped next to what stamps the sender had put on the envelope.

Of course, the Canada Post letter carrier didn't bother trying to collect from me.