For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

ProvinceSales Tax RateAlso charge sales tax on S & H
Alberta (AB):5%
British Columbia (BC):5%
Manitoba (MB):5%
New Brunswick (NB):15%
Newfoundland and Labrador (NL):15%
Northwest Territories (NT):5%
Nova Scotia (NS):15%
Nunavut (NU):5%
Ontario (ON):13%
Prince Edward Island (PE):15%
Quebec (QC):14.975%
Saskatchewan (SK):5%
Yukon (YT):5%
Message 1 of 33
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32 REPLIES 32

For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

Quebec should be 5% GST only unless you reside and ship from QC where the higher rate applies.

Message 2 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

Thanks Pierre!

 

I'm in Quebec so it's all good.

 

And I suppose we are expected to update the table ourselves when there is a change in a province's taxation rate?

 

I would be honored if your 12,000th post could be in my thread 😄

Message 3 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

Also, did you personally charge taxes or did you assume charging tax was hurting your sales enough that it would be better to keep them included in the price and pay them out of pocket?

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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

"I'm in Quebec so it's all good."

 

Oooops!  Your listings show location Mississauga, Ontario.

 

If you ship from Quebec, your listings should be revised accordingly.

 

 

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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

"...did you personally charge taxes or did you assume charging tax was hurting your sales..."

 

I always sold everything (on eBay, my website, other venues) without adding the tax to Canadian buyers.  I absorbed it.

 

Now, less than 20% of my sales were within Canada.  So the net cost to me was relatively low (less than 2% of all sales).  I looked at it as a marketing cost - a cost of doing business.

 

I also sold in a category where most (not all) Canadian competitors also absorb the tax (if GST/HST registered) or did not charge it if they were not GST/HST registered.

Message 6 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

I sell books.  .....  and the following applies

 

I cannot use the tax table..... because for books  there is a point of sale rebate., PST and the Provincial part of HST

 

So for books GST = HST = 5 %

 

while for postage, the full table applies, except for Quebec, which for me as a seller that lives in Manitoba, the tax is GST = 5 % 

 

 

It is because of this that  the tax is included in the price of a book, or the cost of postage

Message 7 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

Thanks Pierre!

 

I know it's strange but my items are located and shipped from Ontario while I'm located in Quebec (not a drop-shipper either).

 

I would say 25% to 30% of my sales are to Canadian buyers.

 

So far I absorbed the taxes but will now try charging them instead and see what kind of impact it has on my Canadian sales.

Can anyone comment on what kind of impact charging taxes has on sales (vs absorbing them)?

Message 8 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

"... my items are located and shipped from Ontario"

 

As such, only 5% GST applies to taxable items shipped from ON to QC - whether you charge tax to buyers or not, only 5% needs to be remitted.

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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?


@pierrelebel wrote:

"...did you personally charge taxes or did you assume charging tax was hurting your sales..."

 

I always sold everything (on eBay, my website, other venues) without adding the tax to Canadian buyers.  I absorbed it.

 

Now, less than 20% of my sales were within Canada.  So the net cost to me was relatively low (less than 2% of all sales).  I looked at it as a marketing cost - a cost of doing business. 

 


Pierre, I think you've just solved a conundrum for me -- in advance, at that -- thank you!  

 

I am considering becoming a GST registrant because of the recent announcement by eBay that it will be charging GST/HST.  Since I'm located in Nova Scotia, those taxes (15% HST) will add up to a significant amount in a year.  So I'm hoping the registration will permit me to recoup at least a good portion of those payments through ITCs.  

 

On the negative side however, I was concerned that my traditionally low percentage of Canadian sales (less than 10%) might become even lower if I had to charge my buyers tax.  I had never considered absorbing the tax, and that doing so would have a relatively insignificant impact.  Now that I think of it, big retailers do this all the time. 

 

One question though: in "absorbing" your Canadian buyers' GST/HST out of your own pocket, were you able to claim those payments as losses or expenses?  I'm not quite clear how this would be dealt with in terms of business records -- would it be lumped in with "customer discounts/rebates at point of sale" in one's records, and in reporting to CRA?  

 

  

Message 10 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

" registration will permit me to recoup at least a good portion of those payments through ITCs.  "

 

GST/HST registration allows you to recoup ALL taxes paid through ITCs.

 

" were you able to claim those payments as losses or expenses?  "

 

KISS.

 

For income tax and bookkeeping purposes, you add up your revenues (sales and shipping charges)

 

You deduct your cost of goods

 

Giving you your "gross profit"

 

You then add up all your expenses, which you deduct from your 'gross profit" to arrive at your "net profit" (as reported on line 135 of your income tax return.

 

Here is a sample I prepared a few years ago for eBay sellers.  Feel free to modity it to your needs and use it:

 

http://pierrelebel.com/lists/P&L-sample.htm

 

The GST/HST do not show in the P&L as these numbers are handled in suspense accounts.  In effect, the tax (GST or HST) you do not collect but remit to the government reduces your net profit accordingly.

 

If you sell $20,000 a year and 10% of your sales are in Canada ($2,000), you would need to remit about $200 HST/GST on those sales (rates vary by province but average almost 10% across Canada when selling from any province but QC).

Message 11 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

I'm still unclear, how do you account for situations where you pay the GST/HST on behalf of the buyer?  

 

I assume these are out-of-pocket costs for you, so do you group them as a line item (e.g. customer discounts) when reporting to CRA, or simply lump them in with some other category of expenses in your list of expenses? 

 

The reason I ask is that the C.A. who initially set up my business included a line for "customer discounts at point of sale" that is deducted from total income before COGS is factored in.  

 

"In effect, the tax (GST or HST) you do not collect but remit to the government reduces your net profit accordingly."

 

Now I'm confused.  Isn't this equivalent to saying it's an expense (loss) to you when you pay the buyer's tax yourself and should be able to be claimed accordingly?  Even if you consider the tax as part of the sale price, you'd be in effect discounting the listed price by the amount of the tax.  Which I would think would be a loss/expense to you?  

 

Maybe it's not worth all the trouble to register... Woman Frustrated

Message 12 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

KISS

 

You make life a lot more complicated than it is.

 

You worry too much about a small bookkeeping operation that does not really affect anything.

 

Reality is that whatever taxes (GST/HST) you remit but do not charge (a few hundred dollars at most) is in fact a reduction of your profit.  It is absolutely irrelevant and does not change the final results if you look at it as a discount from revenues or as an expense.  The results (money in your bank account) remain the same. CRA will accept whatever method of bookkeeping as long as you are consistent from one year to the next.

 

I spent many years training my adult students in bookkeeping.  These days are behind me and I do not wish to do it again.  Let your accountant guide you. It is not that complicated nor difficult.

 

And yes, GST/HST registration would most likely put hundreds of dollars in your pocket, year after year (more so for Canadian sellers living in NL, PE, NS, NB or ON).

Message 13 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

One last question, if you don't mind.  You mentioned: "GST/HST registration allows you to recoup ALL taxes paid through ITCs."

 

Wouldn't this refund of tax be effectively reduced by the total of the taxes I'd paid out on behalf of Canadian buyers (assuming I decide to absorb them)?  In other words, I'd get all my tax paid back, but I would have also paid out money -- admittedly a lot less -- for those buyers. 

 

On the other hand, if those tax payments on behalf of buyers were claimed as expenses, no loss would result. 

 

Is this what you meant by "The GST/HST do not show in the P&L as these numbers are handled in suspense accounts.", i.e. they don't get factored into profits or losses either way? 

 

Sorry -- that's 2 questions.  Woman Happy

Message 14 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?


@pierrelebel wrote:

 

I spent many years training my adult students in bookkeeping.  These days are behind me and I do not wish to do it again.  Let your accountant guide you. It is not that complicated nor difficult. 

 


I'm sorry, I apologize for imposing on you.  Please ignore my question above.  I appreciated the input you were able to provide. 

Message 15 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

"Wouldn't this refund of tax be effectively reduced by the total of the taxes...."

 

GST/HST works as follows:

 

1) calculate tax (GST or HST) payable on Canadian sales (rate varies by province).  Assuming worldwide sales of $20,000 and sales to Canadians of $2,000, the total GST/HST payable would be about $200

 

2) add up all tax (GST or HST) paid on purchases of goods for resale (whether sold or not) and on all business related expenses.  On $20,000 sales, purchases may approximate $10,000 on which $1.500 HST would have been paid.  In addition, there could be expenses (fees, shipping  costs, packing material, etc...) on which HST would have been paid.  Let's say $2,000 at 15% = $300.

 

Final determination:  tax payable $200  minus tax paid (ITCs) $1,800 = refund of $1,600

 

It is that simple. And yes I have been getting a GST/HST refund every year while I was GST/HST registered.

 

Typically, CRA calls when the first GST/HST report is filed asking for a refund.  Once the seller explains that the bulk of the sales were exported. the CRA agent makes a note in the file so they will not call the following years.

Message 16 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

Thank you for replying.  I think this is how I understood it initially, i.e. that I'd get the bulk, although not all of it, back from CRA, and would be able to claim the rest as an expense (or reduction in gross income).  

 

I only asked these questions because I know you've been willing to help with accounting problems in the past.  I appreciate it, thank you. 

Message 17 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

If your items are tax included and you haven't increased the price by that much then yes, it would be a reduction on gross income. But I don't see it as a true expense because you are not paying that tax, you are collecting it from the buyer and remitting it.  The government doesn't know or care if you added the gst into the cost so to them you are simply remitting it.   

 

Why do you assume that you wouldn't get back all of it?  Do you think that you would collect and remit more in tax than what you now pay for your goods and supplies and what you will pay to eBay on your fees?

Message 18 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?


@pjcdn2005 wrote:

If your items are tax included and you haven't increased the price by that much then yes, it would be a reduction on gross income. But I don't see it as a true expense because you are not paying that tax, you are collecting it from the buyer and remitting it.  The government doesn't know or care if you added the gst into the cost so to them you are simply remitting it.   

 

True, but it's an expense to me if I actually pay it out of pocket (i.e. absorbing it), assuming I don't change (raise) my item prices to account for GST/HST.  It's then basically a customer discount or rebate.  I understand what Pierre was saying about it not mattering which way those discounts are accounted for. 

 

 

Why do you assume that you wouldn't get back all of it?  Do you think that you would collect and remit more in tax than what you now pay for your goods and supplies and what you will pay to eBay on your fees?

 

I was following Pierre's example -- $1,800.00 in GST/HST paid out, minus tax payable (out of pocket) on Canadian sales ($200.00) = rebate of $1,600.00.  It does seem simple.  What am I missing?  

 

Obviously the situation would be different if a seller were simply charging and remitting tax on Canadian sales (or increasing prices to include GST/HST), as opposed to remitting it out of pocket, or taking it out of one's sales income, on behalf of Canadian purchasers. 

Message 19 of 33
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For those who charge taxes, does your tax table look like this?

If you sell an item worth $100 and add GST then buyer pays  $105

 

If you include tax in the sale....

 

Buyer pays $105.......and you calculate tax as  5 divided by 100 + 5  = 4.76 %

 

5/ (100 + 5) = 0.0476 or %4.76 %

 

such that 4.76 % of $105 = $5

 

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For HST = 13 % it is 13 / (100 + 13) = 11.5 %  of total with tax included

 

For HST = 15 % it is 15 / (100 + 15) = 13.0 % of the total with tax included...

 

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Buyers always pay the GST or HST... Then you subtract ITC  and  you then determine if  you pay the extra paid by the buyer... or get a refund.

 

With only 20 % of sales to Canadian buyers... the odds are that you will get a tax refund  based  on the total for ITC

 

If you would have gotten a refund of GST/HST before you add in the tax on fees.....

 

Could it be that this registration for GST/HST would have added  to profit  even without eBay charging a tax on fees

 

 

 

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