The extortion tactic of a buyer.

[ezcalc]

I sold a set of golf clubs through eBay.

More than ten days after the receipt of the item, the buyer contacted me about the crack in the shaft and demanded a partial refund with a  threat of negative feedback.

But he does not want to return the clubs.

Apparently he damaged the graphite shaft installing a grip, which happens with frequency, in that the picture of the crack he sent does not match the pictures in the original post .

What's odd is that the eBay froze my Paypal account and arbitrarily asked me to generate a return shipping label.

But I never authorized the return and the buyer does not want to return the clubs either.

I sent a bunch of emails to eBay and talked with an eBay rep, but still no resolution in one way or another.

The buyer never returned my emails asking to send me the picture of the clubs or escalate to a dispute.

How much longer do I need to wait get a response from either eBay or the buyer about this stupid situation?

Incidentally, as a buyer, I once filed a dispute over a software I bought through eBay, which turned out to be a fake.

At that time, Paypal would not get involved in the dispute because "the item was not tangible", but I got my money back through the credit card company.

Please tell me what you guys think about the frustration I am having with eBay.

[pjcdn2005]

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@ezcalc wrote:

Neither the buyer nor the seller want the return.

Does the ebay have the right to force a return by lying about the fact?

I am freaking mad about the abuse of power or bullying by the ebay.

I may sue the ebay so as to put them in the right place.

---

They have the right to force a refund in the item is not as claimed in the listing. You say that the item has been altered, but ebay has no way  if you are lying or if the buyer is lying so they give you the option of accepting the return.They are not going to guess who is telling the truth so unless you have confirmation from the buyer that the problem was caused by them the buyer will win if he continues the claim.   If you look at your listing it says on the top part of the listing that the item is covered under the ebay money back guarantee (MBG) and when you decided to sell on their site you automatically to abide by their rules. 

A couple of people have mentioned to wait until the buyer opens a case and obviously that has already happened otherwise the amount would not have been frozen in your account and there would have been no mention of a return at this point. I don't know why ebay has said that you have accepted the return already unless you somehow clicked on the return for refund accidentally but even if you didn't, eventually ebay would have the right to force a return or/and a refund.

I know that neither you or the buyer want a return but that's how eBay's MBG works.  If the buyer is unhappy with an item they open a return request and if you and the buyer can work something else out such as a partial refund, the buyer can close the request. If nothing can be settled between the two of you then the buyer can ask ebay to step in. If he does that, then ebay will either tell him to ship the item back or refund him without requiring a return.

Let's say the buyer is bluffing and that he will not ask ebay to step in...that would be be best scenario for you because the claim would eventually be closed. It's up to you if you want to wait him out and see what happens. It may work out for the better or it may not.  There's no point in arguing that ebay can't do any of these because it is all stated in the user agreement.  It's always a good idea to read the rules before you sell anything on an online site. Most of the time there are no problems but it is good to know what you are getting into.

[ezcalc]

Needless to say, the ebay does not have the right to flip my response backward from no to yes.

So, just forget the ebay protocol, rules, or whatever.

I don't want to hear another nonsense by saying that ebay does not know who is telling the truth, either.

Just focus on the legal aspect of the action the ebay took in handling the case at this stage.

It is outright unlawful to fabricate a factual basis to coerce, induce, or create a situation.

That is a tort of extortion and thus actionable.

In other words, the ebay may rule that the seller should take the return as per the ebay rule.

That is completely different from fabricating a factual basis.

All I am asking is that ebay should follow the law.

If the seller responded no to the buyer's demand, then there should be the next step for the ebay or the buyer to take.

What is it?

[pjcdn2005]

If the seller responded no to the buyer's demand, then there should be the next step for the ebay or the buyer to take.

What is it?

I answered that in the last post.

If nothing can be settled between the two of you then the buyer can ask ebay to step in. If he does that, then ebay will either tell him to ship the item back or refund him without requiring a return.

[ezcalc]

I do sense a bunch of ebay operatives here in this forum giving stinking advice under the guise of an unbiased ebay seller.

It's frustrating to repeat the simple question that any random people understood already.

Once again:

Why is the ebay falsely and arbitrarily saying that I chose to accept the return against my will?

Is this a routine ebay strategy in handling a dispute?

I hereby encourage other ebay sellers or buyers to join this thread about the ebay's abusive tactic.

[ezcalc]

For those who still don't understand the point I am trying to make with the post.

Why didn't the ebay in the first place say something like:

"You are required to take the return"

instead of 

"You accepted return", which is an enraging lie.

Another point I want to make it clear here:

I am not a dealer.

I as an avid golfer buy and sell golf clubs and prefer ebay for safe transaction.

The ebay should know that I am a honest ebayer as I proved as such over a decade..

I even paid for the counterfeit items only if I get to use the item such as DVD.

Of course, I do not forget to warn the seller about  the illegal item.

Simply because I sympathize with the ebay sellers who are struggling to make a living on ebay.

I don't abuse others and don't get abused by others.

[hlmacdon]

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@ezcalc wrote:

For those who still don't understand the point I am trying to make with the post.

Why didn't the ebay in the first place say something like:

"You are required to take the return"

instead of 

"You accepted return", which is an enraging lie. 

---

It sounds (and it isn't really clear because you haven't described the situation clearly) that the buyer opened a return request. If that is the case and you didn't respond to the return request then ebay will automatically either force the return or issue the buyer a refund in full. When the return request process is initiated funds relating to that transaction are frozen.

It seems like you are getting hung up on the notion that you have to approve the return and you think you don't have to because you wrote that you don't accept returns. This just isn't the case. You've been given good advice by other sellers (and yes they are sellers), so it may be more productive to follow the advice rather than calling them operatives or idiots.

[ezcalc]

OMG! Such a giveaway.

I am perfectly OK to take the return. Alright?

Just don't put words into my mouth.

Just don't tell me that I promised something that I did not.

That's what the ebay did to me.

Now an important question is:

Is this what ebay usually does to other sellers?

If they do this on purpose in bad faith, then it's a serious matter from a legal perspective.

[hlmacdon]

---

@ezcalc wrote:

Now an important question is:

Is this what ebay usually does to other sellers?

If they do this on purpose in bad faith, then it's a serious matter from a legal perspective. 

---

Again, if it happened as I describe then yes. That is the standard procedure. If a return request is initiated for a not as described reason, you have to accept a return or come to an agreement with the buyer. You can read here to see which reasons count as not as described. If you do not respond to the return request for a not as described item, ebay will step in. You should have accepted the return or offered a partial refund. If you thought your buyer was being dishonest and had reason to think so, you could have accepted the return, and if they did not mail the item within 5 business days you could have had the return request closed and your funds unfrozen. Note however this does not prevent a case being opened, so you are best served in reaching an agreement with the buyer, which is considerably cheaper than employing the services of a lawyer.

[ezcalc]

Obviously, you did not even read the posts properly.

First off, just speak for yourself unless you are an ebay rep.

Can you tell  the difference between the following two sentences?:

1. "You accepted the return"

2. " You have to take the return"

The ebay should have sufficient info about me from the email records and others over the years.

Let me tell you this much.

I am a retired academic.

As such, I do feel that it's a moral duty to speak or fight for the underprivileged.

[ezcalc]

I followed the link you kindly put.

It states that the seller has the right to refuse the return and there is a course of action the buyer can take.

That is different from what you and many others are saying.

So the ebay made an egregious mistake and I need to know whether the unlawful action was deliberate or not.

[kh-leslie]

Hello everyone,

This thread is getting a bit heated.  Please remember that it’s fine to disagree with others, but discussion should always remain courteous and respectful.

Thank you for your cooperation.

[ezcalc]

Hello everyone,

Please read the previous posts before you make your own.

More importantly, try to answer responsibly and accurately.

Now that I know the ebay rules thanks to this forum.

most of the responses turned out to be completely wrong.

Is this just a coincidence?

Am I not allow to suspect some shills planted in the forum to manufacture some consent?

Remember folks, it's important to criticize others freely.

[femmefan1946]

Even li-leslie is not an eBay employee.

She works for Lithium who run the Boards and reminds/enforces the Board standards.

All the Canadian staff is in Las Vegas for the annual smoochfest this week.

The respondents are members like yourself, but with many more years of experience and many more transactions under their belts.

I've been selling by mail order since 1980 or so, and have seven eBay accounts, dating back to 1998.

I've also managed B&M retail stores and been part owner of a public auction house which was online before eBay existed.

Sometimes it is just barely possible, that what you want and what you get are not the same thing.

Your customer has opened a Dispute.

EBay believes that you have refused a return for refund.

The posters here are in agreement with you that the buyer changed the item in question, and should not be eligible for a refund at all.

Either you can send the buyer the $60 he demands and hope that that is the end of it.

Or you can demand that the entire set of clubs be returned, paying for the return, refund the whole original payment on delivery, and relist whatever you get back.

Which is it to be?

[ezcalc]

I want to have this thread removed or sealed.

I am tired of hearing the uninformed or misleading responses without addressing the fundamental question.