NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

valve37
Community Member

Makes perfect sense for after all it's not their relatives being beheaded or their children and spouses being raped and murdered. Call it a total disregard and non compassion for fellow man.

 

ISIS mission reveals Liberal divide: Party’s grandees express support for ‘robust Canadian mission’

 

http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/10/05/isis-mission-reveals-liberal-divide-partys-grandees-express-...

 

 

 

 

"It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are."--Unknown
Message 1 of 45
latest reply
44 REPLIES 44

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

False.

 

The US were giving arms to ISIS when they were fighting Assad. Giving ISIS and other resistance group military intelligence. There were CIA groups all over syria. They were droning the hell out of assad along iraqi as well as turkish border. Just because there arent boots on the ground doesnt mean they arent involve in the war. This is 2014, you must not know that they dont fight with horses anymore. They have unmanned flying saucers that drop bombs.

 

LMAO.

 

You must be trolling or something because you are pretty clueless.

 

 

Message 21 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

It's quite a pickle. Here they are arming rebels to fight/topple Assad because he's the bad guy and now the rebels you were

arming are Isis. Now Assad is not only fighting ISIS in Syria but is now launching attacks in Iraq against ISIS.

You suddenly realize that ISIS is worse than Assad. Now what? Do you do an about face and side with Assad. The lesser of two evils. Or do you try and topple both. This is all so confusing.

 

 

.
.
.

.
Unless each day can be looked back upon by an individual
as one in which he has had some fun, some joy, some
real satisfaction, that day is a loss.
Message 22 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

you must not know that they dont fight with horses anymore

 

huge part of the problem is the stampede of arms manufacturers and dealers to get weapons into these people's hands.

 

You would have thought the U.S. would have learned its lesson already 25 times over - arming all sorts of rebels and factions only to have them reemerge on the wrong side of the tracks. Never mind whoever else the French and Russians etc. care to load up with weaponry.

Message 23 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

valve37
Community Member

Team Harper presides 157 to134. Significant that one Liberal abstained and a Greenie voted yeah.

 

Canadian cf-18 Fighter Jets In Libya , Mission Footage

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLQ34F-oOk0

"It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are."--Unknown
Message 24 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

Now they just need a plan so they can tell Canadians what that is.

.
.
.

.
Unless each day can be looked back upon by an individual
as one in which he has had some fun, some joy, some
real satisfaction, that day is a loss.
Message 25 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

Also bears mentioning - seems like people may have forgetten Canada's first casualties in Afghanistan:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarnak_Farm_incident

 

where four Canadian soldiers were killed and eight more injured due to the confused and trigger happy US fighter pilot and his superiors up the line.

 

Not to mention the death by friendly fire and subsequent cover-up of former NFL star turned Army Ranger Pat Tillman

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Tillman

 

This whole ISIS mess sounds like fertile ground for friendly fire and accidents of all descriptions

Message 26 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

You've posted the realities of a previous war Art ignoring the reality of the ISIS war. Here's a redresher of what's taking place in a genocide take no prisoners war. Tell me how you would like to see it dealt with it?

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/shocking-footage-shows-isis-thugs-3932256

"It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are."--Unknown
Message 27 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

While the Harper government passes a law authorizing the spending of hundreds of millions of dollars sending personnel and aircraft to KILL people in foreign lands, we also learn that the same Harper government cut to foreign aid is the biggest of any country in 2013

 

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/2014/10/07/canadas_cut_to_foreign_aid_biggest_of_any_country_in_20...

 

Are you proud to be Canadian?  To live in one of the richest countries in the world?

 

It is all a question of priority:

 

You want to kill people or you want to help them?

 

Keep that in mind next year when the time comes to elect a new federal government.  Where are your priorities?  Killing or helping?

Message 28 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

Maybe you and some others here don't care that this is happening, that ISIS trained kids soon could be killing our kids. Some are just choosing to ignore until it hits our shores. 

 

Teaching to Kill: The Islamic State's Jihad Camps for Kids

 

In a chilling report, a filmmaker from Vice News who embedded himself for a number of weeks with the Islamic State (formerly known as ISIS) in Raqqa, Syria, shows how the extremist jihadi group is indoctrinating children to hatred and violence (see video below).

“For us, we believe that this generation of children is the generation of the caliphate

CaliphateGlossary Item

An Islamic State where Sharia is the basis of governance; usually used in reference to past Islamic empires in the Middle East.

 

. This generation will fight the infidels and apostates, the Americans and their allies, God willing. The right doctrine has been implanted in these children," says an Islamic State member who is running a “training camp” for children. “All of them love to fight for the building of the Islamic State and for the sake of God,” he says.

 

“Abdullah the Belgian,” as he is called, travelled to Syria with his young son, who he has brought to the camp. As the camera rolls, Abdullah crouches down next to his son, who appeared to be about the age of six or seven.

“Why do we kill the infidels? What have the infidels done?” he asks his son.

Self-conscious in front of the camera, the child answers, “They kill Muslims.”

“All the infidels? Like the infidels of Europe?” his father asks him.

“The infidels of Europe. All the infidels,” he son answers dutifully.

The father continues, “What do you want to be, a jihadist or to execute a martyrdom [suicide] operation?”

“A jihadist,” says the young boy.

Once more the topic returns to killing infidels. Abdullah asks his son, “Why do we kill infidels? What have the infidels done?”

“They kill Muslims.” The boy says, looking to his father, as if to say, “Did I say the right answer?”

The Islamic State has set up its children’s camp on the bank of the Euphrates river. Cooling off during the long, hot days of Ramadan, the men of the Islamic State, play with boys in the water. But while it may be fun and games for the children, for the men, it is serious business.

Abu Mosa is the Islamic State’s press officer. Speaking to the filmmaker, he says he lives for the war all the time. Asked about his home and family, Mosa says, “I don’t go [home] at all. The family, honestly, is the least important thing. There is a higher purpose. No one will defend the Muslims if we all sat at home with the family.”

Speaking on the banks of the river while others play, Mosa explains how the children will be “educated.”

“Those under 15 go to a sharia

ShariaGlossary Item

A legal framework to regulate public and private aspects of life based upon specific Islamic teachings. Sharia is a strict system which views non-Muslims as second-class citizens, sanctions inequality between men and women and prescribes cruel and unusual punishments for crimes.

 

camp to learn about their creed and religion. Those over 16, they can attend the military camp,” he says.

 

When asked if the children participate in military operations, Mosa answers, “Yes, those who are over 16 and were previously enrolled in the camps can participate in military operations, because Usama Ibn Zaid (the adopted son of Mohammed) led an army when he was 17 or 18 years old … against the Romans.”

Fourteen-year-old Daoud, who has just enjoyed a swim, is put in front of the camera. “In the name of God …,” Daoud says, “I’d like to join ISIS [the Islamic State] and kill with them. Because they fight infidels and apostates.”

Daoud looks to the side, perhaps at someone off camera for approval. He continues, “The Islamic State, they haven’t done anything wrong and God willing they will not. We love the Islamic State.”

Another child, aged nine, explains that he is going to a training camp after Ramadan ends. When asked on what will he be training, he proudly answers, “The Russian [Kalashnikov rifle].”

When asked the purpose of the training, he says, “To fight the Russians, America. The infidels.”

The interviewer points out to him, “You are quite young. Do you know how to use a gun? Have you shot a gun before?”

The nine-year-old answers, “Yes.”

At one of the many celebratory rallies held by the Islamic State in Raqqa in honor of the group’s declaration of the establishment of a new caliphate, one can see scores of children and young boys. Waving huge Islamic State flags prominently, the children smile and listen to testimonials given by the group’s followers. The children also stand with weapons next to adults who are similarly armed.

The rallies serve as important recruitment opportunities for the Islamic State. There is entertainment as well as testimonials. A man sings, “Beautiful virgins are calling, enroll me as a martyr."

Another man takes the microphone to tell his story:

“I lived in Europe for 25 years, but I always wanted to go to Muslim lands. We left our children and we left the pretty women. We said goodbye to them, we came to the land of honor and jihad

JihadGlossary Item

A holy war waged against non-Muslims on behalf of Islam considered to be a religious duty; also, a personal struggle in devotion to Islam.

 

. This is where I feel at ease, 100 percent.”

 

Tellingly, the man continues, shouting,“ I noticed that only the children say hello to us, and they send us kisses from far away. When old people look at us with a frightened look, they don’t know that we are the best people on the planet. After the prophets, come the Mujahideen

MujahideenGlossary Item

Religiously-motivated fighters that volunteer to wage Jihad against the enemies of Islam.

 

At the end of the event, the crowd is asked to pledge their allegiance to the head of the Islamic State, the self-declared caliph, Abu-Bakr al-Baghdadi.

With their arms raised in a Nazi salute, children and adults recite, “We pledge allegiance to the prince of the faithful, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi. “ The crowd is told, “When I shout ‘the Caliphate,’ you say ‘established.’ “

The crowd complies, many times.

The video ends with chilling footage of prisoners held by the Islamic State militants, who say they are waiting to be whipped by the group. The camera cuts to an Islamic State official who stops a man on the street to ask him if a certain woman is his wife. When the man answers yes, the official tells him that she must change the fabric of her veil. Explaining to the filmmaker, the official says, “So, we advise in a nice way, but those who don’t obey will be forced.”

 

Watch documentary filmed inside the Islamic State

 

http://www.clarionproject.org/news/teaching-kill-islamic-states-jihad-camps-kids

 

 

 

"It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are."--Unknown
Message 29 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

"Maybe you and some others here don't care that this is happening, that ISIS trained kids soon could be killing our kids. Some are just choosing to ignore until it hits our shores. "

 

Frankly either you are missing the point (I doubt it) or you are following the example of the Harper cabinet which is to shame anyone not following their logic and reaching their conclusions.

 

Most Canadians agree that what ISIS is doing is bad and must be stopped.

 

Most Canadians agree that Canada must do its part.

 

Where many Canadians disagree with the government is with the solution offered by Harper to follow the American lead and send our jets to kill people.  We could just as easily participate in the "war effort" by playing a logistical support role and providing assistance and aid.  Canada was right not to follow the Americans in their was against Iraq with its false claim of "weapons of mass destruction".  We all know how that war turned out.

 

To suggest or imply that Canadians not supporting the Harper war effort is approving of ISIS actions is, quite candidly, insulting.  That is not the Canadian way.  One should be able to debate the issues without resorting to that "low blow" approach.

Message 30 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

If you're not supporting Canada bombing ISIS then do you support our allies in doing so? What makes it right for them in your mind and not for us?

 

"To suggest or imply that Canadians not supporting the Harper war effort is approving of ISIS actions is, quite candidly, insulting. That is not the Canadian way. One should be able to debate the issues without resorting to that "low blow" approach."

 

There is no suggestion or implication of the kind in my previous post just the facts for you to decide for yourself.

"It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are."--Unknown
Message 31 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

the realities of a previous war Art ignoring the reality of the ISIS war

 

Actually it is precisely because of the realities of this ISIS operation being such a hodge-podge mixed bag of allies, unclear outcomes and sketchy battle plans that I bring up the friendly fire incidents. I'm sure all the war mongers will be quick to shed a proud tear over a Don Cherry eulogy for Canadians killed in some stupid accident but perhaps a little more forethought is called for in this case.

 

The other thing to remember is that probably 99.9% of these ISIS folks would be selling i-phones, driving taxis, or otherwise living the dream in Damascus and Baghdad if it weren't for the Bush warmongering campaign.

 

This air campaign will no doubt result in another multifold increase in recruits. After a couple of futile escalations of the cycle, the Harpers of the world will then say ok, time for us to have a draft, put a real army over there to wipe them all out forever. Good luck with that.

 

IMO, the best possible action to take is to cut off the weaponry. I don't know how. Am not in that business.

But I am pretty sure that ISIS is not knee deep in high-tech arms factories. So, once you cut off the arms supply, the problem becomes far less dangerous.

 

Now that would be a worthwhile project for Canada to contribute to.

 

 

Message 32 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

"Now that would be a worthwhile project for Canada to contribute to."

 

While it makes sense to many Canadians, there is no "glory' in this approach.  It would not buy any vote. Smiley Sad

 

And yes, decisions made by the Harper government usually have only one thing in mind: will this increase our percentage of votes?

Message 33 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

Art this war will drag on for years and maybe even decades. We will pay for it with blood and money. What is sad is that Harper is using the ISIS threats on Canadians as an excuse for war. ISIS never threatened us until Harper started to say that we should get involve and bomb them. Now we have a new enemy. ISIS who are the sunnis that have been fighting for centuries in that region.

I guess we will find out in the election what kind of Canada we want in the future.
Message 34 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

Coming to a street near you or may already be there. Not to fear the RCMP are tracking 80 returnees.

 

ISIS threat to Canada not imminent but real, CSIS director warns 80 people have returned to Canada from suspected terrorism-related trips abroad, committee hears

 

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/isis-threat-to-canada-not-imminent-but-real-csis-director-warns-1.27...

 

 

"It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are."--Unknown
Message 35 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

"ISIS threat to Canada not imminent but real,"

 

Once again, just like the Harper Cabinet, you deflect the real question.

 

With ISIS as real threat, does Canada need to support the "war effort" by sending combat troops or planes to kill people or should we see our role as support, assistance and aid to those in needs.

Message 36 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

When it comes to fighting climate change, the Harper government takes a back seat

 

When it comes to international aid, once again the Harper government takes a back seat

 

When it comes to using jets in a war zone, the Harper government decides we must join the effort and be right there in front with the "big boys".

 

Someone in Ottawa has a weird sense of priority.  It may be the "Reform" way but it is not the traditional Canadian way.

Message 37 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

So I seen a posting today on facebook .. It was basically saying the US propaganda is bull ...

 

It said

Americans killed in America by ISIS 0

Americans killed in America by Ebola 0

Americans killed by American Police EVERYDAY

 

 

To me that about sums up what the real issues are in America. As for Canada just keep sending Aid non lethal that is .... Then increase our military spending  by alot for defense purposes ...

 

Canada is the 2nd biggest country but our military does not show that we have anything to protect and we do...

Message 38 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

"It said

Americans killed in America by ISIS 0"

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-29469176

 

"Americans killed in America by Ebola 0"

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/08/ebola-dallas-deputy-sheriff-hospital-symptoms-death

 

"Americans killed by American Police EVERYDAY"

 

Has there been any convictions of not following protocall Brand?

"It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are."--Unknown
Message 39 of 45
latest reply

Re: NDP, Liberals to vote NO going to war against ISIS

By American police officers .. Sure there has alot lately actually... 

 

Now convictions or not it is happening..

As for following Protocol Some Yes and Some No..

 

With Police mess up Only the very worst will come to light on the T.V a.k.a New Channels or sites but there are alot out there ..

 

I just watched a video the other day of a Cop beating on a person in a wheel chair punch them so many time so hard in the face the wheel chair fell back then he cuffed her...

 

protocol would see no reason for a police officer to do that.. mouthy ,annoying or ignorant .

 

As for the first Article we also had a native and a white man within the last couple years chop people up... Being Islam isn't being a terrorist ... There are those who are Islam and interpri the writing differently not all Islam people are that way  .. So what I see is just another nut bar that the media and goverments want to use to fuel the hatred of Islamic people as a whole.. in General The Religion is one of Hatred basically set to rule the world but not all follow it in the same manner... My Friend is  Jehovah and believe my family will die and his will live come judgement day .... other i that are of the religion do not believe that at all ..

 

The second story wasn't he from Liberia Coming to the US to get married or something?

Message 40 of 45
latest reply