Return label from US to Canada

Well I really screwed up & got an INAD today. Sold a chain which was marked 14K & I had purchased as gold from what I thought was a reputable person. Buyer tested it & it is not gold. It was sold for scrap price but was still around $600. Buyer opened claim & messaged me at same time. I told him that I honestly believed it was gold & would certainly refund him but needed to contact eBay to see how to get him a label (he is in US). Was not home at the time so said I would do first thing in am. He immediately left me a really nasty FB. And sent 2 more emails tonight saying he wanted his $ & saying he buys lots of gold & that this was a cheap fake. Then said as I sold cheap stuff I should stick to that. I replied again apologizing & saying I would deal with it first thing & would follow eBay's policies & get him a label & refund as soon as I got it back. 
So I sent express to him will I be required to pay to have it returned express? Or can I just have it with tracking? Never had to do this before so do not even know what kind of option USPS has for shipping to Canada. Hoping someone out there will be more familiar with this situation.

Moral of the story is I better get a tester cause this is going to be expensive both from the FB standpoint & the cost to mail to him was over $40 CAD (which I will now have to refund) plus will now have a return label which will be in US funds . Any guidance is appreciated. 

Message 1 of 24
latest reply
1 ACCEPTED SOLUTION

Accepted Solutions

Return label from US to Canada

That's great news. If eBay comped you for a $600 refund, there is a good chance that the chain was legitimate and this isn't the first time this person did this. For high risk items, a very common scam is that a buyer will open an INAD claim and hope that the seller doesn't understand eBay's policies. Especially with Canadian sellers, where a return label can be complicated. Then when the label isn't provided by the deadline, they can ask eBay to step in, get a refund, and keep the item.

 

My first suggestion would be to report the buyer: https://www.ebay.ca/help/selling/resolving-buyer-issues/reporting-issue-buyer?id=4084

 

If this buyer has a history of scamming sellers, or harassing sellers, it is important to report them. eBay usually only takes action if multiple sellers report a buyer.

 

Second, I would contact eBay directly and see if they will remove the feedback. Unless something has changed, eBay's policy is that they will remove feedback from buyers when a buyer fails to return an item by the case deadline. If you can illustrate that the buyer was abusive and refused to cooperate with the case so that you could provide funds for a label, there is a chance they will remove the feedback.

 

As far as how you reply, I would just say something like:

We stand by all items that we sell. We responded promptly to the buyer's request for a return, but the buyer refused to return the item. As a result, we had to ask eBay to step in and resolve the case. We offered to cover the cost of a return and issue a full refund upon receiving the item. While we believe that the chain was gold, we would have been glad to issue a refund if the buyer had chosen to return the item. We don't want a buyer to have to keep an item that they aren't fully satisfied with.

 

The thing to consider is that your reply isn't for the buyer. It's not a spitting match. The reply is to show any future buyers that you're sane and professional. I wouldn't even mention the buyer's abusive language, because then it turns into a he said/she said type thing. A person reading it only sees the buyer's feedback message, which is not abusive at all in tone. So it doesn't help you to accuse or insult the buyer in the feedback response. It makes the seller look crazy not the buyer. Future buyers can't see your messages and don't know if you're being honest about them being abusive. So they might assume if they buy something high-risk from you and even the smallest thing goes wrong, you're going to throw false accusations towards them. 

 

 

View solution in original post

Message 18 of 24
latest reply
23 REPLIES 23

Return label from US to Canada

An experienced buyer who has a seller who is polite and trying to fix a (possible) mistake doesn't generally react aggressively like that. A scammer does. For some reason, people seem to think that the louder they  yell, the more people will believe them. You might be able to get eBay to remove the feedback if you show them the messages, although probably not. Worth a try once you get the return sorted out.

 

I think you can purchase the return label through Shippo and have it sent to you directly. You could sign up with Shippsy and have them handle the crossing of the border, then ship it to you. If you have a cross border address, you can also possibly sign up for Pirate Ship. Get them to add simple export rate to your account since that's a light weight item and have it shipped directly to you. Alternatively if you're close to the border, send it there and go across and pick it up. That'll avoid a possible import fee headache.

 

Make sure you check the return item over good. This screams scam to me. And definitely get a testing kit.

Message 2 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

RE Scammer, you can learn a lot from what feedback the buyer has left, since they quickly left a negative, if they're scamming there probably will be more.

 

There might also be "illegal" negative positives from sellers too.

 

It won't change your problem with this buyer but it might "clear" your previously trusted supplier.....and you don't need to feel guilty anymore 😉

Message 3 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

Update. Well I spoke with an eBay agent first thing this morning & apparently as I am in Canada & he is in the US I cannot buy a return label. He has to go to the PO & get a quote, provide me with that & I will have to reimburse him not through eBay as they cannot do it but via Paypal! So I accepted the return & ticked that I could not buy a label for his country then messaged him. I know he is not going to be happy but guess that is all I can do. eBay assured me that they would not accept a chargeback on this so certainly hope it will go okay. I thought I had best do exactly as eBay instructed for this one.

This buyer sells coins & has assured me he deals in thousands of dollars in gold in a year. So guess it likely is fake unfortunatley.  He has 324 + FB, no -.  But under the circumstances I pretty much need to get it back.

Message 4 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

Well he can't leave nay more negative feedback. But I wrote & told him that I had contacted eBay & accepted the request but was unable to send a label as we are in 2 different countries & eBay is unable to facilitate that. He has send me 3 email since. First one says where's my label, second says I will go to the PO today you scammer, third one says eBay says you will provide the label, I'm going to follow what eBay says I don't trust you. I wrote back reiterating that eBay had told me this was the way it had to be done for cross border. Not sure what is going to happen. eBay assured me that he will not be able to do a chargeback as they document our conversation & all the messages are coming through eBay so they will have a record of it.

Rather worriesome.

Message 5 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

Especially since relatively speaking this is a much larger than usual sale, it hurts in so many ways!

 

Gone are the days where I got excited about someone buying something for $1,000, I almost start worrying from the moment they pay for it, unless its a repeat customer of course.

 

To be fair to the buyer though, they may not have experienced this (cross border return) before either and just as we like to assume problem customers are criminals, it is just as likely the reverse is true.

 

Hopefully things work out ok, it is instructive that you're keeping us posted on the progress, or lack thereof at times.

Message 6 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

EBay can't provide a label but as @flipistics mentioned you can buy one through Shippo.   I've also read that you can sign up with Pirateship even though you have a Canadian address and can buy a USPS label through them.  But I haven't tried that myself.  Because the buyer is being so aggressive, I would try those routes first before sending him the money for the label. That way you make sure you have the type of label and insurance that you want.

 


I don't 'think' there is a rule about having them send it back the same way.  I would think that Priority international would work fast enough.

 

 

 

 

Message 7 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

FIRST- Has he opened a Claim for Not As Described?

 

I spoke with an eBay agent

The agent is wrong.

Phone are sub-contracted.


If he has  opened a Claim you can send him a return shipping label using Shippo.com.

You may still need a Canada Post Solutions for Small Business number to get a Shippo account , but that's easy.

https://sso-osu.canadapost-postescanada.ca/pfe-pap/en/registration/business

You need TRACKED shipping , but there is no need for anything more expensive than the First Class International Packet service, which was at the bottom of the list of services.

EBay demands Proof of Delivery and that service provides that.

 

SECOND - When the chain is returned refund promptly.

Even if you think it has been switched. That's a different process.

There is also a good chance that the price of gold has dropped since the customer bought.

Like others, I think what you sent is exactly what you described.

"The lady doth protest too much" as Shakespeare noted.

 

THIRD - The worst he can do is leave feedback at this point.

Until he opens a Claim eBay will not force you to refund him.

You can leave a response to any feedback.

Don't.

Message 8 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

@katlover1952  DO NOT SEND HIM MONEY FOR A LABEL!

You will never see the money or the chain again and will have to open a PP chain yourself to get the stolen money refunded.

Use Shippo.
I'm a technodolt and technophobe and I was able to send a Shippo Label.

If he doesn't use it to return your chain, Shippo will eventually refund the value of the label.

Message 9 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada


@femmefan1946 wrote:

FIRST- Has he opened a Claim for Not As Described?

 

I spoke with an eBay agent

The agent is wrong.

Phone are sub-contracted.

 


Depends on the question that was asked!

 

"Can I print a USPS return label via eBay?"

 

The correct answer is "no".

 

A USPS label can be obtained via Shippo, Pirateship,  possibly PayPal and maybe even direct from USPS Ship'n'Click.

 

https://www.usps.com/international/international-how-to.htm

 

 



"What else could I do? I had no trade so I became a peddler" - Lazarus Greenberg 1915
- answering Trolls is voluntary, my policy is not to participate.
Message 10 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

And make sure he opens a NAD with eBay before you send him the label. Always do the refund through ebay.

Message 11 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

You can buy a return label using Shippo. It is a bit convoluted. You only need tracking. It might be advisable to pay extra for signature confirmation because you wouldn't want a $600 package left unattended at your door. 

 

As you already stated, there is a mechanism for the buyer to provide you with a quote. My preference would be to use Shippo, because you can ensure you get the service you want and that all the customs stuff is done properly. It can be a big headache if the buyer fills out the customs form incorrectly, and you get hit with an import charge on a buyer return. Don't use UPS or Fedex, only use USPS.

 

You should be sure that the buyer opens a return before you do anything. Provide the label. Ensure the chain is the same one you sent. Then refund. 

 

I understand the buyer being upset if they spent $600 on what turned out to be a counterfeit item, but one thing to consider is that gold is likely a high risk item to sell. One tactic scammers use is to scare and intimidate sellers, along with hoping they don't understand how eBay works. For example, a lot of less experienced sellers don't understand that they HAVE to provide a label before the deadline or else the buyer can get a refund and keep the item. Assuming this buyer is being abusive, it would raise a red flag. Given the issue, it's possible that they are just upset and have bad impulse control - but I absolutely would be very cautious with the return.

 

If they are scamming you, after you provide the label, they will probably try to intimidate you into refunding them without a return. 

 

In terms of the negative feedback, while you didn't know the item was not gold, if it turns out that it was actually counterfeit, their feedback is not out of line. We're still responsible for what we sell, even if we make a mistake. I would simply reply with something simple and professional stating that you do your best to ensure that everything you sell is accurately described. The buyer was provided a return label free of charge, and a full refund pending the return of the item.

 

If you send the buyer a return label and they opt not to return it, you should be able to get the feedback removed. 

 

My only long term advice would be unless you're running a full time business where you're an expert and fully immersed in the field, I would avoid high risk items like gold or jewelry. I have no idea what dealers pay, but you should weigh the amount you'd take home on eBay after fees+expenses vs what a dealer might pay you and decide if eBay is the best option when considering the liability you take on for something like gold. 

Message 12 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

My advice would be to figure out Shippo, and use that to provide a label. 

 

I absolutely would not leave the case in limbo before the deadline. You can find issues in the past where people have been told they can provide money for a label, and the buyer is inactive, but eBay steps in and refunds the buyer. I suppose it's possible eBay might rule in your favor if you can illustrate that the buyer refused to get you a quote, but that's a big risk to take. 

 

The other factor is that the buyer acquiring the label means that you might have to deal with additional issues. If they ship with Fedex or UPS, you're going to get a massive brokerage charge. You may be able to get a refund from the CSBA for the import tax portion of the charge, but the brokerage from Fedex/UPS is not refundable. Printing a USPS label and properly marking it as returned merchandise decreases the chance you will get hit with an import charge. If you are hit with one through USPS (Canada Post), the unrefundable brokerage fee will only be $10. I don't know the Fedex/UPS formula, but for a $600 item it is usually pretty substantial (maybe $50-$100).

Message 13 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

 

Update:

After I wrote & asked him to get me a quote for a label from USPS & yes he did open an INAD claim he sent me several nasty unprofessional messages through eBay calling me names etc. He said that he checked with eBay & that they told him I must supply the label & he was not going to do anything further & that if I did not send him a label eBay would step in.  I really was not sure what to do so I called eBay back. Told them the story & asked them to check the messages he was sending & what I had sent to him. Took a few minutes but the agent checked & was extremely sympathetic. She looked at my long history with eBay too I guess as she mentioned that.  She said I basically had 2 options but if I wanted the chain back to contact FedEx & get a label. The other option was they would step in & deal with him for me but I would not get it back & they would close my case.  I said I really did not want to deal any further with this buyer as it was rather stressful & he was obviously uncooperative. So they basically closed the case & I did not have to refund, they would. So I will never know if it was not real gold or whether he was trying to scam me. He was definitely trying to intimidate me. She further suggested that I block him as a bidder. I was actually pretty shocked about it all but thinking they must know more than I do about him. And I do not know if they will make him return the chain to them or what. I was just extremely grateful to eBay for dealing with it. They indicated they were not pleased with how he handled it but not sure what they do about that either. Just wanted to update you all & thank you for your comments & suggestions. I sell mostly jewelry but generally costume. I do have a few more gold ones so will get them checked out before listing.

One final question. The negative FB is right there at the top of my page. How do you suggest I respond to this now. As I am not getting the chain back will never know if it was real or fake. 

Message 14 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

Just a note that by default the negative isn't at the top of the page for feedback viewers because it shows feedback by default in "most relevant" order now. When I look at your feedback, the negative is almost off the first page, it's 4th from the bottom.  Of course if I change it to most recent then it's at the top of the page, but if someone wants to see it they're going to know how to find it anyway. The most visible part is the 97% to folks.

 

In terms of responding as has been discussed in other threads, just keep the response professional and courteous. I would avoid saying anything about the users behaviour (I never use the word "you" in responses).  If it were me, I'd say something like buyer raised concerns about the item, I stand behind the accuracy of the items I list, and I tried to work with the buyer to try to resolve it to everyones satisfaction.

 

Note though that the buyer can respond to that feedback, and you can't respond to their response so there is a risk of that.

Message 15 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

Thanks ricarmic. It is at the top of mine & did not realize that it did not show that way on everyone's screen. Perhaps 3 000 plus + FB  will outweigh one negative for most people. Sure hope so. Just not sure if I should reply. This buyer was pretty belligerent so he might just be vindictive enough to reply. However maybe not as eBay did indicate that how he handled things was not acceptable to them. 

 

Message 16 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

I like to think of it as though replying to a negative feedback is in a weird kind of way "advertising" in terms of how you as a seller/business respond to problems. 

 

If I see a response to a negative feedback that shows that the seller tries to work with the buyer, I am heartened that if I buy something and there is a problem there is a good chance that the seller will work with me.

 

However if I see a seller response thats ALL CAPITALS CALLING THE BUYER A KNOB OR POOR EXCUSE FOR A PERSON ETC then I know that I am very likely not going to have any help if I buy something from them and there are issues and I would very much take that into account when I decide whether I buy from them or not.

 

I definitely agree your situation is a difficult one, it is hard to know what will happen. I think I would reply but I think it would also take me a while of crafting the right response wording, which would be a challenge.

 

If you do put  a professional response up and the buyer responds with something bad, depending on how they rant you might be able to get it zapped by ebay, but again that comes up to chance/who you have on the phone CSR wise.

 

I hope it works out however you decide to proceed!

Message 17 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

That's great news. If eBay comped you for a $600 refund, there is a good chance that the chain was legitimate and this isn't the first time this person did this. For high risk items, a very common scam is that a buyer will open an INAD claim and hope that the seller doesn't understand eBay's policies. Especially with Canadian sellers, where a return label can be complicated. Then when the label isn't provided by the deadline, they can ask eBay to step in, get a refund, and keep the item.

 

My first suggestion would be to report the buyer: https://www.ebay.ca/help/selling/resolving-buyer-issues/reporting-issue-buyer?id=4084

 

If this buyer has a history of scamming sellers, or harassing sellers, it is important to report them. eBay usually only takes action if multiple sellers report a buyer.

 

Second, I would contact eBay directly and see if they will remove the feedback. Unless something has changed, eBay's policy is that they will remove feedback from buyers when a buyer fails to return an item by the case deadline. If you can illustrate that the buyer was abusive and refused to cooperate with the case so that you could provide funds for a label, there is a chance they will remove the feedback.

 

As far as how you reply, I would just say something like:

We stand by all items that we sell. We responded promptly to the buyer's request for a return, but the buyer refused to return the item. As a result, we had to ask eBay to step in and resolve the case. We offered to cover the cost of a return and issue a full refund upon receiving the item. While we believe that the chain was gold, we would have been glad to issue a refund if the buyer had chosen to return the item. We don't want a buyer to have to keep an item that they aren't fully satisfied with.

 

The thing to consider is that your reply isn't for the buyer. It's not a spitting match. The reply is to show any future buyers that you're sane and professional. I wouldn't even mention the buyer's abusive language, because then it turns into a he said/she said type thing. A person reading it only sees the buyer's feedback message, which is not abusive at all in tone. So it doesn't help you to accuse or insult the buyer in the feedback response. It makes the seller look crazy not the buyer. Future buyers can't see your messages and don't know if you're being honest about them being abusive. So they might assume if they buy something high-risk from you and even the smallest thing goes wrong, you're going to throw false accusations towards them. 

 

 

Message 18 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

I like @ilikehockeyjerseys sample response, now I know who to ask if I'm stuck about what to say!!! 😉😉😉

 

PS the very hardest part is NOT to write them whilst one is still furious which can be very very hard to do!

Message 19 of 24
latest reply

Return label from US to Canada

Thanks for your response. While I did not actual report him, I guess I kind of did by phoning eBay the second time & asking them to review the messages he had sent to me (& I to him) which they did & then came back & shocked me with their offer. The agent & I talked about it just being his word that it was fake as I did not have it tested & how it could be he was trying to scam me. I really would like to know but never will now. I am sure eBay knows more than they are saying. This is why I wonder if I can say "while we believe" or if it should be believed. I am really torn about whether or not to reply. Wished I had asked the agent about it when I had her on the phone but I think I was in shock & just did not think about it.  You are right about getting it removed depends what agent you get on the phone in all likelihood. Everything I am reading these days is telling me they do not remove -FB anymore. Your comments are appreciated. 

Message 20 of 24
latest reply