They aren't kidding when they say to prepare parcels to have 50 lb boxes dropped on them...

[ricarmic]

This box came back from Russia (expresspost).

Interestingly it came back (as far as I and the Russian buyer can tell) as "Refused".

Now it never made it to the buyer so he did not refuse it.

It appeared to go through customs, so I don't think they refused it.

The buyer purchased something earlier at the same address which they received (which was not tracked). 

So we will never know who refused it.

I have a suspicion that the refusal point refused it because it was damaged and "broken open" but that is only my guess.

These are wicked sturdy custom made boxes I use, which are brand new. It looks like the box was on its small 1.5" side and something fairly jumbo landed on top of it, bending it, which burst the one front corner. (look at the front left corner it looks like the impact point)

Miraculously, the 6 packages of stamps, which nestled in the middle were 100% AOK!

Sadly both me and the buyer weren't. He decided against the shipping cost to send again, so he ate the shipping cost ($50 US) and I lost the fees. We couldn't count it as undelivered because it showed as "delivered" back to me in eBayland, so I simply refunded directly from PAYPAL.  

Anyway I thought it is a good example of just what can befall boxes/packages on their journey!

[esclyons]

Ouch, looks like it got caught in some machinery..

[femmefan1946]

And the Russian customer also misses out on all those high value stamps for use as traders at the stamp club.

[triber]

Several years ago I sent a box of china to someone in Toronto, about a 50 mile trip. I got an email and picture from the buyer showing several broken pieces and tire marks right across the box. He adamantly refused me refunding him anything saying it was not my fault. Of course, Canada Post doesn't refund from damage to breakables.  I had securely packaged it with double boxing and lined with styrofoam and heavy bubble wrap.

[cumos55]

The box did not appear to be strong enough .  A stronger type of cardboard and one layer of bubble wrap should perhaps have been used.  The box should also have been stuffed with newspaper as a buffer to prevent what had occurred .

The contents of the box could also have been bendable in the parcel

Would two layers of cardboard about the item in the box have been acceptable.  

[cumos55]

How could this box have been filled in a manner with something that would not have allowed for it to be bendable in transit.

[cumos55]

Two layers of cardboard.... one on top and a second below the item being shipped....and no empty space in the parcel.

[ricarmic]

My note may have been confusing, the box behaved perfectly!

These are heavy duty corrugated cardboard boxes the cardboard is the same strength as heavy duty bankers boxes, they're only 1.5" high. They are heavy for their size but they're durable. Extra cardboard inside would not have stopped what happened. 3 of the 4 1.5" edges are 3 layers of cardboard deep because of the way the fold together works.

This box came under some high pressure for this to happen. My thinking is now along the line with @esclyons, I suspect it got pinched in the machinery somewhere, that makes more sense than it being on its small side/end and something large falling on it (but that's a more dramatic picture!)

The way that it handled the pressure release, was perfect for me, the stamps inside moved to the middle, and there was no damage to any of them. Despite the burst point, nothing really could get out (there was ebay tissue paper used for the "filler" and the 6 stamp packages were inside another plastic bag inside the box for "humidity" control)

I've sent out over 5,000 of these boxes all over the world now over the last 20 years, I think this is the first one that's ever broken open. Fortunately it hardly even did that! The most usual problem is holes getting poked in the large top or the bottom surfaces which are only 1 layer deep, but holes poked into them is very rare too.

As a note, customs had not opened the box and therefore the inside bag, which might also mean they were the ones that refused it, for whatever reason. The tracking is confusing, it shows it going to customs, being released from customs, going back into customs on its way back to me....

@femmefan1946yes very sadly, the way the box behaved zapped all 3 of the really good souvenir sheets, the selvedge is damaged on all 3, some value remains in them and the other stamps still though!

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

An FYI for anyone that chooses to bubble wrap as packing material and there is the possibility your package "may" be moving by air. There are better quality bubble wraps(very pricy) out there but the garden variety is referenced below. Also to note there are never any guarantees with the assortment of packages that get handled by the various carriers that heavy stuff will not be placed on top of lighter stuff. It happens. Throw in conveyors, chutes and folks with the dropsies, numerous opportunities for something to go wrong.  I constantly re-inforce boxes that are of lighter construction because of those fears. As for the larger bubble wrap it is better designed for large type items that are not super heavy moving by ground.

Can air travel cause packaging air pads to burst or deflate?

I received a parcel from Germany to Chile. The contents were severely bruised due to a lack of packaging material. On second inspection I found a bunch of deflated air pads.

It was a personal shipment, the air pads were used and potentially not in pristine condition, but there were several brands of them, a manufacturing defect can be ruled out. It seems most of them burst, while at least one still had some air remaining and just had a leak that required a bit of pressure to release more air. Surprisingly there was very little air remaining, maybe 20% of the maximum volume.

The contents were light, I doubt they could have damaged a pad at all, let alone destroy them all. Could this phenomena be caused by a pressure difference between the air inside the packs and the cargo plane's hold? It seems a bad explanation considering the popularity of the packaging material.

I did check for needles and dead chicken. 😉

**************************************************************

Simple answer: yes, air travel can deflate or pop air pillows.

Longer answer: Cargo holds are at the same pressure as the rest of the airplane, it's part of the pressure vessel. Generally airplanes are pressured to about 8000 ft, so the air is a lot thinner and therefore there will be a higher pressure differential between the air in the pads and the air in the hold. Thin plastic is somewhat porous and will leak some air, the rate this happens will be faster when there's a higher pressure differential. This differential is known to pop these air pillows to the point many will not use them when shipping by air. Styrofoam, cellulose pops, or crumpled paper are the preferred method.

You can see these forces at work next time you fly yourself by taking an empty disposable plastic water bottle on board. Seal it with the cap at airport altitude before departure. After takeoff as the airplane climbs the plastic will bulge as the cabin pressure drops, and when you uncap it you will probably hear a hiss. Seal it back up and then during descent the bottle will crumple as the air pressure increases.

(Anecdote c/o Aviation.Stackexchange 2016)

-Lotz

[lotzofuniquegoodies]

As an FYI for anyone that there is a "chance" your freight will be moving by air, using bubble wrap as filler would not be preferred method. There are other brands/types of bubble wrap available that is supposed to be more durable/reliable but would be much more expensive than your run of the mill bubble wrap that is available at a local dollar store. As for the larger bubble wrap it is much better designed for larger lighter items moving by ground. Anecdote attached for freight moving by air. As for styrofoam chips it works as better filler but not really environmentally friendly and has been known to royally tick off some customers that are extremely concerned about those issues.

Can air travel cause bubble air pads to burst or break ?

I received a parcel from Germany to Chile. The contents were severely bruised due to a lack of packaging material. On second inspection I found a bunch of deflated air pads.

It was a personal shipment, the air pads were used and potentially not in pristine condition, but there were several brands of them, a manufacturing defect can be ruled out. It seems most of them burst, while at least one still had some air remaining and just had a leak that required a bit of pressure to release more air. Surprisingly there was very little air remaining, maybe 20% of the maximum volume.

The contents were light, I doubt they could have damaged a pad at all, let alone destroy them all. Could this phenomena be caused by a pressure difference between the air inside the packs and the cargo plane's hold? It seems a bad explanation considering the popularity of the packaging material.

I did check for needles and dead chicken. 😉

******************************************************************

Simple answer: yes, air travel can deflate or pop air pillows.

Longer answer: Cargo holds are at the same pressure as the rest of the airplane, it's part of the pressure vessel. Generally airplanes are pressured to about 8000ft, so the air is a lot thinner and therefore there will be a higher pressure differential between the air in the pads and the air in the hold. Thin plastic is somewhat porous and will leak some air, the rate this happens will be faster when there's a higher pressure differential. This differential is known to pop these air pillows to the point many will not use them when shipping by air. Styrofoam, cellulose pops, or crumpled paper are the preferred method.

You can see these forces at work next time you fly yourself by taking an empty disposable plastic water bottle on board. Seal it with the cap at airport altitude before departure. After takeoff as the airplane climbs the plastic will bulge as the cabin pressure drops, and when you uncap it you will probably hear a hiss. Seal it back up and then during descent the bottle will crumple as the air pressure increases.

Remember, there are no guarantees that heavy items will NEVER end up on top of light items. Throw in dropsies, conveyors, poorly trained employees and the old "Some settling may occur" and there are lots of opportunities for items to get smooshed. I regularly re-tape corners, add tubes or foam blocks as required to reinforce a box to increase the odds it will make it from point A to point B. Sometimes it would be nice to see how a parcel does end up arriving at the other end. Then again, maybe not!!!

-Lotz

PS. Grrrr at messages that refuse to send for some unknown reason!!!