eBay

philestore · ‎01-13-2018

Hi everyone,

If I want to accept a return from a USA buyer back into Canada and print a shipping label (I pay for the shipping fees), what would you suggest? I've seen a few threads and it looked like I can't do this from eBay or Paypal. Is this true? What if the item comes back damaged or the buyer just puts nothing in the box? In this case would I have any kind of protection?

Thanks!

momcqueen · ‎01-13-2018

Did you buy the label through Shippo?

Shippo allows you to purchase Return postage.

If so, come back and I'll give you the walk-thourhg as it's ben explained to me. I participated in a webinar on Shippo when it was first offered and the ability to print return postage was the reason.

If not, you will have to send the buyer funds via paypal (with subsequent proof issued to ebay of this) and tell them exactly what service to use via USPS. This requires research but, luckily, you already know how much the item weighs and the size of the box coming back.

View solution in original post

philestore · ‎01-20-2018

POSSIBLE SOLUTIONS HERE

So I called eBay and did not have to return the item because I explained my point that the buyer's complaint was "remorse" and not "not as described". They closed the case.

BUT, for everyone who will be landing on this post in the future and searching for solutions on how to pay for a return label from USA to Canada, here is everything I found that could work after a few hours of research:

Shipgooder.com... Did not try it, but it's an Ontarian company and from what is described on the website, it appears that you can buy shipping labels with many carriers and put any "from" and "to" addresses in USA and Canada. You can also buy insurance for the parcel. I asked them a question with the online form and they answered very fast. Seems like a good company and prices seem competitive.
Secureship.ca... Did not try. Looks similar to Shipgooder. Did not find any street address on the website. Could be worth a try.
Chit Chats Express, solution #1... If you originally shipped with Chit Chats, then if your customer still has the box and label in decent order and did not throw them away, ask him to write "return to sender" on the shipping label. USPS will bring the parcel back to Chit Chats' US PO Box and then Chit Chats will bring that back in Canada and charge you a 5$ fee.
Chit Chats Express, solution #2... If you shipped with Chit Chats, but your customer destroyed the packaging and/or shipping label, the you can call Chit Chats and they will create a return shipping label for you to their US address. Could be more expensive than the "return to sender" solution. Forgot to ask them.
Shippo... Like momcqueen suggested above, Shippo offers returns labels, but you have to have originally shipped with them.
Stamps.com... Many users on the forums suggest to open a Stamps.com account because Stamps.com lets you print USPS labels with your chosen "from" and "to " addresses. When trying to open an account, they asked me for a US address and they wanted a real address, not a PO Box. I could not put Chit Chats' PO Box for this reason. But with a little imagination, maybe someone can find a US address to open the account, like maybe the customer that is returning the item's address. The last possible problem would be when paying your membership with your credit card, they are asking for your address and there is no field to put in a Canadian address. Don't know if this will end up as a declined transaction if you put a US address that is not the same as the registered address for your credit card. But like discussed a few times on these forums, there is a free Stamps.com account for eBay members... You have to have a promo code I think. Maybe by registering like this they don't ask to enter a credit card. There is also a 4-week free trial. Maybe if you just take the trial they don't ask for a credit card either.
Accepting returns by default... Like suggested by reallynicestamps, accepting returns could be a solution that would prevent this kind of problem from happening in the first place. If you accept returns (buyer pays return fees), then maybe if the buyer has a "remorse" return, he will be more willing to just pay the return fee and return the merchandise himself and not try to invent a story of "item not as described" that could force you to provide a return label if he wins the claim.
Chit Chats Express "possible" solution... A possible solution that I did not try and that I really don't know if it would work is the following... With your Chit Chats account, create a shipping label with your own address as the recipient (to) address. The shipping price will be more expensive, because you will be charged International shipping from Chit Chats' US address to your Canadian address. BUT, I am really not sure if this will work. First because I don't know if Chit Chats has to scan the label first to validate it. Second, because the "from" address will be a border city in the USA, and the real "from" address will be somewhere else in the USA. Don't know if USPS will accept a parcel that displays a "from" address miles away from where it is actually dropped. Try at your own risk!

So, some of these are actual solutions that work for sure, and some are untested solutions that have a good chance of working. I did a few hours of research in case my dispute would require me to print a return label and I thought that sharing them could benefit someone with the same issue in the future.

If anyone tries any of these solutions and can confirm that they work or don't work, or if anyone finds another solution to print a return label from USA back to Canada, please reply to this discussion. I think it's worth updating, because by looking at the other forum discussions, this is a recurring issue and the solutions provided are very often unsatisfying.

View solution in original post

momcqueen · ‎01-13-2018

Did you buy the label through Shippo?

Shippo allows you to purchase Return postage.

If so, come back and I'll give you the walk-thourhg as it's ben explained to me. I participated in a webinar on Shippo when it was first offered and the ability to print return postage was the reason.

If not, you will have to send the buyer funds via paypal (with subsequent proof issued to ebay of this) and tell them exactly what service to use via USPS. This requires research but, luckily, you already know how much the item weighs and the size of the box coming back.

philestore · ‎01-13-2018

Unfortunately, I used some shipping forwarder that brings the parcel to USPS. I think that they offer returns, but the returns come back to their warehouse in the US, and after this, it takes a few days before the parcel comes back to Canada. The parcel would get tagged as "received" at the US warehouse, and could be damaged and me not knowing it, and by the time it comes home maybe eBay would have refunded the buyer with my funds, which are frozen in Paypal...

I would prefer a direct method... This is more complicated than I thought. eBay suggests me to print return label for buyer, but when I click "print return label" it says "invalid ship from postal code"...

snoopwiz · ‎01-13-2018

If you are using a forwarder, are you printing labels through Stamps.com or through the forwarder's own labeling site? If so, I think you can print a label showing your buyer as the shipper, your Canadian address as the receiver, print the label, scan it, send it to your buyer.

philestore · ‎01-13-2018

@snoopwiz wrote:
If you are using a forwarder, are you printing labels through Stamps.com or through the forwarder's own labeling site?

Through the forwarder's website (Chit Chats).

@snoopwiz wrote:
If so, I think you can print a label showing your buyer as the shipper, your Canadian address as the receiver, print the label, scan it, send it to your buyer.

This is actually a very good idea. On their labeling site, I can't change the "from" address, but still I can put my address as the destination and they will charge me USPS International Mail. I will call them on Monday and ask them if it's possible to change the "from" address... Or maybe I could just leave my address as the "from" address and send the buyer the label... would be from me to me but still with USPS International postage paid.

However, this doesn't protect me if the item is damaged, because I can't buy insurance with them...

@snoopwiz wrote:
... are you printing labels through Stamps.com ...

Can I just open an account there and create my return label even if I did not ship with them in the first place? Do they offer insurance?

What happens if the buyer returns an empty box or damaged or worn item? Does eBay protect me or they will just refund him seeing the parcel as "delivered"?

momcqueen · ‎01-13-2018

Hmm.

Well, outside of Shippo, there is no 'direct' method of providing a Return Label other than to research the cost and service you want used directly with USPS.com and then send that EXACT amount of funds (converted to the appropriate currency if applicable) to the buyer via paypal with those instructions as a Send Money. Do a screenshot of that and upload to your Return case so ebay can see that has happened. I had to do this myself with a buyer in Australia for a Return last year which was entirely my fault (mixed up photo with item) and the process did work.

International Returns are not an entirely smooth process. ebay is trying to make them more so, I'm participating in a webinar on that next week as a matter of fact. I could put you in touch with the right people if you like. For future reference.

momcqueen · ‎01-13-2018

SnoopWiz also offers a good alternative to try.

philestore · ‎01-13-2018

@mjwl2006momcqueen wrote:

... I'm participating in a webinar on that next week as a matter of fact ...

If time permits, I would like to participate if possible...

Right now, I am just selling some random merchandise I find on eBay to learn everything... But in the future I want to sell clothing and accessories (which is my main area of work)... and it is known that with clothing and accessories, there are A LOT of returns, for A LOT of different reasons, and if I don't offer a smooth return process, I will loose sales... Also most of the merchandise will be too expensive to just refund and let the customer keep the merchandise.

And using Shippo is not really and option, because USPS is at least 1/2 price on most shipments.

momcqueen · ‎01-13-2018

If any of these interest you, try to register. They're ebay.com-based so some workflow might relate to ebay.com-registered users more than ebay.ca-users.

https://www.ebay.com/rpp/mso-webinars

If you have trouble, let me know. I have a contact but I think that I would need to put her in touch with you, not you in touch with her.

reallynicestamps · ‎01-13-2018

chitchatexpress is (or was) an eBay member.

Perhaps calling the company for their advice?

And don't worry about damage. Most damage is due to poor packaging, not poor handling in transit.

You may want to discuss how to re-package with your customer. Politely.

philestore · ‎01-13-2018

@reallynicestamps wrote:

And don't worry about damage. Most damage is due to poor packaging, not poor handling in transit.
You may want to discuss how to re-package with your customer. Politely.

What worries me more is that he would do it on purpose... or just send an empty box on purpose...

His "item not as described" claim seems to be more of a "remorse" claim disguised in a "not as described" claim. Everything was crystal clear on my listing and I even put the sizing chart (it was a jacket)... Now I suspect he just doesn't want it anymore. He seems to be mad at me for not wanting to refund him. He changed his story a few times and this is why I think it's all lies.

What if he just wore the jacket during a party and sends it back all worn... It's a VERY expensive jacket and I don't want to end up refunding him AND loosing the jacket. Worse even if he sends an empty box and then eBay refunds him anyway because of the "delivered" status.

This is why I was looking for transportation with insurance 🙂

reallynicestamps · ‎01-13-2018

He seems to be mad at me for not wanting to refund him.

Which is why a No Returns policy is, in my opinion, almost* always a mistake.

For one thing, No Returns does not mean No Refunds. Both eBay and Paypal have Buyer Protection policies that see to that.

A No Returns policy means an unhappy buyer will likely open a Dispute rather than starting by contacting the seller for ameliorization.

In hindsight, would a Return for full Refund response have worked out better?

And let me tell you the Good News about Cookie Jar Insurance.

This is just adding a small amount (usually less than a dime) to every asking price and putting those virtual dimes into a virtual Cookie Jar, to take care of problems.

While third party insurance may cover loss or damage in transit, CJI also covers return shipping and returns that are less saleable.**

Most sellers who use Cookie Jar Insurance find that by the end of the year, they have actually made a little money even before factoring unpurchased third party insurance*** premiums.

*Underwear and bathing suits are No Return products.

** NWT returned NWOT, opened packages, Christmas items received back in January.

*** Tracking on low value items for example.

momcqueen · ‎01-13-2018

This was the $866 CAD jacket? https://www.ebay.ca/itm/Parajumpers-Right-Hand-Man-Masterpiece-Parka-Large-Black-PM-JCK-MA03-541-L/2...

I can see that you want to be careful with the Return. I would be too.

momcqueen · ‎01-13-2018

But wait, why are you paying for the Return shipping?

You could accept it as a Remorse Return and he pays to ship it back for his refund.

Is he saying it's Not as Described somehow?

philestore · ‎01-13-2018

@momcqueen

Yeah... the jacket... 1200 USD full retail, he bought it for 677 and he's still not happy... lol I did not know those things were public 🙂

Well, he's pretending not as described, which is not true. I am planning on calling eBay Monday to cut this short and tell them that he invented this. However, I want to be ready in the case that they take his side and force me to refund.

I am not even sure that I would like him to ship it back... What would I do if it was damaged or an empty box...

@reallynicestamps

I understand the cookie jar insurance concept, and I am usually good at it. This is why very often I even ship without a tracking number... Except that this time, it had to fall on the item that is worth 60 times the average value of my usual listings...

Maybe I am being over-cautious because of many bad experiences in the retail industry...

momcqueen · ‎01-13-2018

Everything we all list to sell is public under our users IDs. It takes only a second to find it. User/Items for Sale/Sold.

You'd want to ge thee item back before you issued a refund. If not, you're out-of-pocket almost $700 CAD and also the item itself. You can sell it again.

If you get back instead of a jacket a box of rocks, that's returns Fraud. There are processes in place to cover that, starting with contacting ebay about it and probably ending with taking the matter to local police to gain an incident report number. I don't know for certain the process that is followed, it's never happened to me and I don't think I'm venturing on a limb to say that it doesn't happen very often.

One thing I will say is that the lower a seller's feedback count, the more likely they are to meet 'bad' buyers. There is a certain segment of the online shopping community that looks for new sellers with pricey items and attempts to exploit them. I recall one seller of toys
(not me) who was very new and sold a very expensive collector's set and then refunded their buyer on an Item Not Received case they would NEVER have lost (sent with tracking and Signature Confirmation) just because they were afraid of what would happen next. I felt so badly for this seller, we all told them not to do this, but they did anyway from fear of the unknown.

As a seller, it more than pays to learn the rules and how to follow them.

philestore · ‎01-13-2018

@mjwl2006momcqueen wrote:

One thing I will say is that the lower a seller's feedback count, the more likely they are to meet 'bad' buyers. There is a certain segment of the online shopping community that looks for new sellers with pricey items and attempts to exploit them.

Yeah, you are probably right. A week before my current issue, I had trouble with an oversea buyer (from Georgia), which I did not know, because he ships to a warehouse in the USA. But after requesting his address from eBay, I noticed he was from Georgia lol... Didn't even have an actual address, just a city. And who will file a police report for a 60$ motorcycle helmet fraud? Maybe one day, law enforcement will actually enforce, and enforce internationally, and then we can file complaints with the authorities that will actually end up in getting back our money!!

philestore · ‎01-14-2018

@snoopwiz

How did you open your Stamps.com account? I just tried to open one, but they're asking me for a shipping/billing address in the USA. Can I just put some random address there?

reallynicestamps · ‎01-14-2018

Your Georgian customer was using a re-shipper?

That's not unusual, nor a sign of a scammer.

Your responsibility for delivery ends at the re-shipper's doorstep. And since your item was bulky enough to be a parcel, if you used Tracked Package USA, you have proof of that.

I believe that if there is a Not As Described dispute opened, the helmet has to be returned, but either:

you are only responsible for return shipping from the address you delivered to (the re-shipper) OR
purchases which have been re-shipped are not eligible for Buyer Protection.

Someone who has dealt with such a problem will jump in and correct me.

Glad to hear you have retail experience. Most of the fearful newbies have none and are seeing scammers around every corner.

philestore · ‎01-14-2018

I was 6 years buyer & manager of a big motorcycle clothing and accessories store. Now I want to transpose my experience in retail to online selling. Gotta say that I had my share of weird customers and weird stories. Many stories made me not naturally trustful towards customers, but I am not paranoid either!

I understand that taking a loss once in a while is better than being too rigid because that will scare customers and eventually make me loose more sales than the few losses in the end. However, in the particular case here, we're talking about the most expensive of all the things I sold in the past year, eBay and local classifieds combined... So I wanna make sure I don't get "beeeeeep-ed".