Negotiating a return.

[patchr_jth5b0r5m]

I purchased some old-model computer RAM from a seller with a good reputation.  It was a product recommended for my system by the manufacturer's agent on their community forums.  I received the RAM, tried it, and it appears to not be compatible.  Technically I don't know that for sure because I have no other way to test it, but that's my assumption.  It simply doesn't work in my system.

I contacted the seller by direct message to explain the situation and ask about returning it, offering to pay the return shipping.  I didn't get any response for a full week, after which I filed an actual return request with the reason "item doesn't work/defective" (which are two different things, I should add, and I dislike that they're lumped together).

The seller has responded unhappily, saying that I have harmed their reputation with Ebay somehow by using the "wrong" return reason and that they would have to pay all of the shipping both ways (in other words, declining the official return process) but then saying that I could ship it back to them directly if I want (outside of Ebay's return process, so zero protection for *me*).

All I want to do is give this RAM back and get a refund for the actual purchase price.  I'm happy to foot both the original shipping and the return shipping, because I fully understand that even though I did my research, this shouldn't actually *cost* the seller anything.  I'd just like to let them resell the product under their own listing (they have more available) rather than try to resell it myself at an undercutting price and without a way to actually prove that the RAM is genuinely functional.

So:  I don't know how to proceed.  The seller seems to be antagonized by the whole thing, and Ebay's rules/process seem to be part of the problem (as to who pays for shipping and what the different return reasons mean behind the scenes).

Should I consider myself fully in the wrong and just write this off?  Should I let the return "grace period" expire and ask Ebay to step in and see what they do?  Can I close the existing return and then re-open it with a different reason (is that even possible?  and would it fully fix the shipping cost issue?) ?

I'd appreciate some advice from more experienced buyers and/or sellers.  Thank you.

[pjcdn2005]

Just for background...Item not working/defective (regardless of why it isn't working)

is considered a 'not as described' reason for returning versus  a buyers remorse reason which is why in ebay's view, the seller is responsible for return shipping. The first few choices in a return are buyer's remorse, the rest are considered not as described.

A seller can't refuse a return for that reason so I'm not sure what you mean by the seller declined the return.  If they don't actually accept the return you should be able to ask ebay to step in after a few days and in many cases, they will force the seller to refund you without requiring a return.  However, since you believe this may be a buyer's remorse reason, ask the seller to accept the return so that you have a return address to send the item to...buy the postage yourself and send the item back.  You will need to send it back with delivery confirmation otherwise the seller could simply say that they didn't receive it back.

[doc-holmes]

You should have opened a remorse return. That is, if the seller accepts them. The buyer pays return shipping shipping in this case. The case you incorrectly opened was a "not as described" return. The seller pays return shipping in this case. I would cancel the incorrect not as described case, and see if it's possible to open a remorse return. If it isn't possible, or the seller doesn't accept remorse returns you'll unfortunately be out of luck.

[patchr_jth5b0r5m]

A little clarification:

1.  It would be nice if Ebay made it clearer what the listed reasons "mean" if they don't explicitly mean what they say.  This RAM literally is *not working*.  There is no alternative reason that fits the case at all.  I can *trust* the seller's claim that the product is 100% working, and *assume* that means it's not compatible with my system, but I have no way of proving that.  It absolutely could be the case that this RAM is DOA and it would behave in the same way.  So while I'm willing to make that assumption, I don't really understand why I'd be required to pick a not-true "reason" in order to fudge Ebay's mechanisms into working as expected.

2.  Can anyone confirm 100% whether or not I can close an existing return request and then open a new one on the same item with a different "reason"?  And if I did so, doesn't this still leave the seller stuck with the original shipping cost (i.e. the first shipping *to me*)?

3.  The seller actually sent their return address in the body of a message (which seems to be against the rules) implying that I am expected to ship outside of Ebay's process (so no delivery confirmation protection, etc).  That's where I start to be uncomfortable about the state of this situation.

[mcrlmn]

What is your motherboard manufacturer and model and what Ram, DDR2, 3, or 4, did you buy?

I'll tell you if it's compatible.

Is your operating system x86 or x64?

At PC startup, did you go into your bios to see if the memory stick is recognized?

A simple Google of the motherboard to take you to the manufacturer and specs would accomplish the same thing.

There is also free simple software to check memory for defects.

[patchr_jth5b0r5m]

This part is already thoroughly handled.  The motherboard is very old with an extremely limited published QVL list.  Literally none of the memory on that list exists anymore.  The RAM manufacturer recommended the memory (exact model) that I purchased as being compatible.  In testing this memory, I used all best practices: ESD protection,  starting with a single stick in the motherboard's "most compatible" slot (this is listed in the manual), clearing the CMOS when installing the new stick to fully reset detection of the RAM and delete all previous timings, removing all add-in components (cards other than the GPU, disk drives), the works.

The system outright does not boot.  It doesn't start the display and there is no beep from the system speaker (which I confirmed works on boot with the old RAM).  However, technically this doesn't tell me whether it's a compatibility problem or that the memory is simply dead.

Anyway, that is somewhat off topic to the issue of attempting to negotiate this return, and how I've apparently annoyed the seller by filing a return request using the only "correct", applicable return reason (after waiting for a week with no response to my normal message inquiry).  I guess I'm a little annoyed at Ebay's return process when the exact consequences of those options are not very well explained (or at least not when you're making the choice; maybe there's more detail tucked away in the Help section that I didn't know I needed to look for).

[pjcdn2005]

I can confirm that if you close the return you will NOT be able to open another one.

You didn't receive anything saying that the seller accepted the return then...correct? If so, the case must be in limbo right now and you shouldn't close it although it will automatically close eventually...I'm not sure when.

If you send the item back and the seller doesn't refund you and you have proof of the return (delivery confirmation) , there is still the option of opening a case with Paypal or your credit card, depending on how you paid.  If the return is not being done through ebay, then the seller will have the choice of giving you a partial refund  or a full refund. 

If the seller accepts the return through ebay, you can still pay for your own shipping and enter the tracking number and the seller will have to refund you for the item and original shipping.

[clemowbooks]

and that they would have to pay all of the shipping both ways (in other words, declining the official return process) but then saying that I could ship it back to them directly if I want (outside of Ebay's return process, so zero protection for *me*).

I think you misunderstand.

As long as you can prove that the seller has the product back, basically by using a tracked service, it doesn't matter who paid for the return shipping.

This has been a point of discussion when the return shipping will be international and the seller cannot send a return shipping label to the buyer.

So you open the Dispute put the tracking number for the return shipment in the textbox and when the item shows as delivered, you are refunded.

[patchr_jth5b0r5m]

Thank you, I appreciate the confirmation that closing the existing return will NOT allow me to open a new one.

[mcrlmn]

Not what I asked.

You lost me midway through the first paragraph.

Remorse or NAD... Who knows.

[patchr_jth5b0r5m]

If I post all of that (which would have to include the exact RAM model) I'm effectively identifying the seller, which seems like a rude thing to do.

This isn't "remorse", I *wanted* that RAM to work because there are very few options available.  If the manufacturer's representative says it should work with my specific motherboard, I'm going to take that as the final word.  I don't mean to offend with that, but surely you can understand why I would consider the RAM manufacturer the best authority (short of the motherboard manufacturer, which couldn't care less).

[patchr_jth5b0r5m · Accepted solution]

This ended up working out amicably.  Ebay's policy was the biggest hurdle.

I paid for the return shipping, and used an alternative means to refund the seller for the original shipping.  The seller gave me a full refund per Ebay's requirements, and I left positive feedback.

So the seller isn't out any money (just a little time), has the product back to re-sell, and I got about 2/3 of my total expediture back, which is fine.

Ebay really needs to improve their return system.  I left a detailed discussion on that in one of their surveys but I have no idea how seriously they take those.  And of course I'm only one voice among millions, so...