eBay Grants Itself Permission to Hide Listings in Search Results

[pierrelebel]

By Ina Steiner
EcommerceBytes.com
September 12, 2013

eBay finally granted itself permission to do what it's likely been itching to do for a long time: hide listings it deems unworthy for unspecified reasons from showing up in search results.

eBay sellers are scrambling to interpret what new provisions of eBay's User Agreement mean and how it will affect them. Among a number of changes is one in which eBay could force its returns program on all sellers who allow returns, and one in which eBay grants itself permission to suppress listings.

Not surprising to jaded sellers is the fact that eBay is not giving sellers much advance notice to adapt to the changes despite a promise to give them at least 60 days notice.

For more: http://www.ecommercebytes.com/cab/abn/y13/m09/i12/s01

[bb_cool_stuff]

...hide listings it deems unworthy for unspecified reasons...

A little vague don't you think Pierre ?

Wonder what the criteria is for unworthy items ?

eBay must have been noticed a potential trend emerging.

[inuk_the_polar_bear]

A huge buyer complaint I have heard for years is that the search results were not relevant, contained "hits" that had nothing to do with what the buyer was searching for.

Could this be eBay forcing anti-spam?

How often have I said "That has nothing to do with what I am searching for"?

[bb_cool_stuff]

I can see that.

Tons of posts in regards to Keyword Spamming.

I guess only eBay knows for sure.

[inuk_the_polar_bear]

Why am I seeing  USA only listings on dot com when eBay knows I am in Canada? Not relevant.

I can be signed in, I am on dot ca, filter available to Canada and free shipping. Up come the listings, but, when I click the shipping tab, teher is a charge. Not relevant.

USA sellers who don't put in shipping charges 'cause they really do not want to sell internationally, won't ship outside the country even though they appear to? Not relevant.

eBay used to filter the search results with "What we think you mean and might like even though it has nothing to do with what you want". Not relevant.

Keywords in the description don't match the title? Not relevant.

Sellers that complain the loudest, shouldn't.

[canadianfootballcards]

I'm surprised there's not more discussion about this.

My sales have primarily shifted to Canadian Football League cards over the last year, and reading this, I have concerns about my visibility in key markets.

Many of my cards sell to US collectors in big collegiate states who are looking for past alumni.

Are people in Ohio (Ohio State Buckeyes) going to see my stuff? Are people in Alabama, Oklahoma, Michigan and Indiana?

Because eBay is being so vague about search parameters, I have this worry that Cassini will downgrade my results because A) I'm in Canada,  and B) its little computer head doesn't understand the relevance of CFL cards to US collectors.

And if eBay is not showing my listings to EVERYONE who might be interested in buying them, I feel a bit put off paying non-refundable listing fees.

I don't think of myself as a chicken-little conspiracy theorist, but it's hard to look at the hard numbers sometimes and not wonder how much eBay may be hindering the sales of myself and others.

[inuk_the_polar_bear]

My sales have shifted as well. eBay has changed the search algorithm. It is attempting to figure out the first blend of "features" that is the challenge.

I "think" the number 1 way of getting universal viewing is shipping international with posted rates. You are doing that. I "think" you have great key words. Someone looking for what you have will find it.

I "think" what won't happen is that you will not show up in un-related searches. ie: eBay picking out the word "ride" when someone is looking for motorcycle parts and then showing them a CFL Roughrider card. That kind of thing.

You want Chicken Little conspiracy theories? Hang out at Seller Central on dot com. They are in full swing today.

It's kinda like searching on Kijiji. I type in "convertible" and I get voltage CONVERTers, catalytic CONVERTers. Type in patio doors and I get RVs. Completely unrelated.

[canadianfootballcards]

I did cruise through seller dot com this morning and you are right.

I saw you being refered to as an eBay cheerleader/apologist/shill for taking a reasoned approach to it.

But who am I to judge anyone? Some of you have a whole lot more at stake than I do. This is just a hobby at the moment, something that generates two or three hundred a month, which is usually put back into the business.

Some people are actually using eBay to make a living, and I guess if I had food, shelter and bills at stake I might get a bit more uppity about what's going on.

Still surprised though that things slide by so quietly on .ca sometimes.

IMO it pays to be vigilant and discuss the things that affect us all.

[canadianfootballcards]

Also, it's not the guy typing in Saskatchewan Roughriders that I worry about, nor am I expecting random sales from a motorcycle parts mis-search.

What concerns me is the guy in Tallahassee, Florida who types in FSU Seminoles in the search bar.

Is that guy going to get the results from the guy in Chilliwack, Canada selling CFL cards, even if I have FSU or Florida State Seminoles in my title?

OR, is he going to get page after page of generic dime-a-dozen singles and team sets from sellers in some other areas deemed by Cassini to be more geographically desireable?

It does say twice in that user agreement that seller AND buyer location will be factors.

It's the vagueness that's most bothersome, and given their track record, I don't expect ANY clarification from eBay.

[inuk_the_polar_bear]

If ya don't toe their exact line they will hit you with everything they have. Pardon me, but they are amateurs. I managed an inner city liquor store. Those characters are fleas compared to what I dealt with in real life.

I "think" location becomes a player when shipping destinations and costs are not stated.

I had a buyer in Belarus. That was returned to me by Canada Customs as we are not allowed to sell to Belarus without an export permit, ie, buyer location.

[pjcdn2005]

Pierre

Not surprising to jaded sellers is the fact that eBay is not giving sellers much advance notice to adapt to the changes despite a promise to give them at least 60 days notice.

BB

Not to mention the promise of only 2  (or 3?) changes/year.

A little vague don't you think Pierre ?

Wonder what the criteria is for unworthy items ?

It's as vague as the explanation on how Cassini works and as vague as the exact critieria they use to suspend and/or limit sellers.
Their vagueness is overwhelming.

[inuk_the_polar_bear]

I have always found eBay to be vague. They are just putting their vagueness into words.

I do not think their is much to adapt to. If you have been adhering to best practices all along, plus shipping international with posted rates, 1 day handling, 14+ day returns, free shipping (don't start), great description, yer fine.

There are a huge number of sellers that have NOT updated at all in the last three years. They are the ones being targeted.

I know a seller still using the same description from ten years ago. Refuses to put shipping prices in. He is gonna be hurt.

[canadianfootballcards]

Sold 20 Arena Football League this morning cards to a guy in the United Kingdom today, so I know Cassini is showing my cards to the Brits.

So... that's good.

And I did notice this week that my Omniture (don't laugh) numbers are waaaaaaay up. LOTS of views and unique visitors. Not a lot of sales, mind you, but interesting to see.

I know Omniture is next-to-useless for day-to-day reliability, but for identifying larger trends I think it still holds some value.

Based on that, I'd say Cassini isn't messing with me too much.

As with everything else, I guess this will be a wait-and-see thing. I've weathered all the eBay changes so far with sloooooow, but steady, growth.

Why should this be any different?

[recped]

eBay finally granted itself permission to do what it's likely been itching to do for a long time:

Actually eBay has been doing this for some time and has been fairly upfront about the situations that can make it happen. This addition to the User Agreement just makes the lawyers happy because it gives them a tool to counter the numerous (past, present & future), class action suits they have to do with.

I have no doubt that the managing of exposure will only become more heavy handed as time passes, like most of these situations, just do what you need to be among the ones that buyers see and you should be happy that some of the "refuse" is hidden.

[pjcdn2005]

There is more information in the user agreement but it's still vague.

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/user-agreement.html?_trksid=m40#10

• We strive to create a marketplace where buyers find what they are looking for. Therefore, the appearance or placement of listings in search and browse results will depend on a variety of factors, including, but not limited to:

  • buyer's location, search query, browsing site, and history;

  • item's location, listing format, price and shipping cost, terms of service, end time, history, and relevance to the user query;

  • seller's history, Detailed Seller Ratings, and Feedback; and

  • number of listings matching the buyer's query.

    Accordingly, to drive a positive user experience, a listing may not appear in some search and browse results regardless of the sort order chosen by the buyer.  

• Some advanced listing upgrades will only be visible on certain Services.

• eBay's Duplicate Listing Policy may also affect whether your listing appears in search results.

[pjcdn2005]

---

@recped wrote:

eBay finally granted itself permission to do what it's likely been itching to do for a long time:

Actually eBay has been doing this for some time and has been fairly upfront about the situations that can make it happen. This addition to the User Agreement just makes the lawyers happy because it gives them a tool to counter the numerous (past, present & future), class action suits they have to do with.

I have no doubt that the managing of exposure will only become more heavy handed as time passes, like most of these situations, just do what you need to be among the ones that buyers see and you should be happy that some of the "refuse" is hidden.

---

Although I agree that they have been doing this for a while, I haven't seen them be upfront about it at all. They've mentioned  better search placement but have they admitted to hiding listings? 

The problem that I have with this is that there are so many possible reasons given that if we notice that this is happening to our listings, there's no way to figure out why it is happening. That makes it impossible in some cases to fix the problem.

There are listings that shouldn't be seen and sellers that probably shouldn't be selling at all. But why are those listings and those sellers here to begin with. In many cases they don't seem to react to user reports even if the report is about something as obvious as key word spamming. If they were more proactive there would be less 'junk'

[recped]

They've mentioned  better search placement but have they admitted to hiding listings?

http://pages.ebay.ca/help/sell/duplicate-listing.html

The current duplicate listing policy which has been in effect since last year specifically states that eBay will hide duplicates, they don't end them, they don't refund listing fees, then don't prorate listing fees.

Another situation is how International listings are displayed (or not), that's been going on for years. You might have an expectation that if you ship to a country your listing will be available to buyers in that country. While these listings can be found by a listing number search or a search by seller it may or not be available in a general search.

I think the current addition to the UA is just lawyering up to CYA over these situations.

I have no doubt that eBay will find more reasons to hide more listings in the future but I'm not going to get worked up about it. As it is right now if you rank anywhere past the first few pages in a search result you are effectively hidden.

As always if you have the good items at the good prices combined with reasonable seller metrics your items will be somewhere in search.

[bb_cool_stuff]

I have always found eBay to be vague. They are just putting their vagueness into words.

That is one of the funniest posts i have seem in a while.

[pjcdn2005]

Well stated recped. I really hadn't thought about the duplicate policy or international listings but it is proof that they are already 'hiding' some listings.

I thnk that 'fear of the unknown' comes into pay here because we are never given specifics about how our placement in search is decided on. We are only given generalities so of course there is no way for us to make certain that our listings are being seen. The lack of control can be frustrating.

[cumos55]

Over the past few weeks  Cassini changed how nonfiction books were searched on eBay.com....

I found it to be most interesting

The search is back to where it was many months before this Cassini "Test" Period .

It was because of this effect on nonfiction books that I went searching for more information about Cassini on Google.

and the following link was found.... again, most interesting...

http://ebay.about.com/od/sellingeffectivel1/a/Make-Ebays-Cassini-Search-Work-For-You.htm

Over the past year or so...I have found

(1) Some buyers will not pay less than $10 for a book  (this I have know for years)

(2) Some buyer want to see  an actual photograph of what is selling...no stock photos....  and with a good description of the book.

(3) Condition is important...  My two higher priced books sold before the others in a much poorer condition were sold...No stock photos in my listings

(4)  How a book was packaged   was critical  with one buyer....The first  book that was bought was described fully a "boxed in cardboard for shipping  .....  and the buyer came back and bought several more.... not the least expensive,  and they explained why they bought from me.....  Also ... Shipping to Newfoundland was not the least expensive.

The most illuminating  situation occurred with a book bought by a US buyer....  where there many more more available  and at a lower price for the book and for shipping...

Did he buy the book  because I added  personal comment... or was it the information from the dust jacket, Table of Contents and photographs  from many pages in the book...

The listing was for....

From the listing -----with basic information as well as a personal comment

The Tres Riches Heures of Jean, Duke of Berry, 1989, Introduction and Legends by Jean Longnon and Raymond Cazelles, softcover, published by George Braziller, 224 pages.

The key words  are … 139 color plates ….  With each page of the original manuscript reproduced to exact scale. It is page-after-page of exquisite, glorious artwork…. bright color,   with the accompanying text in Latin, as originally published in the fifteenth century.   The Latin text adds to the artistry on each page…  As presented,  each page is artwork at its best.  The manuscript is reproduced in its original magnificence. 

Cassini will change things... and many sellers will not know how to respond....

Many say the small seller will be at a disadvantage.... Yet they are the ones  that have the time  and do take the time to do more  more than list the basics.

With large sellers it is a minimum... title, year published author and publisher.....  with a stock photo.   and I do get the impression that although eBay promotes a catalogue for books, with Cassini, that will change...

and finally... Several sellers of books  are including information from the dust jacket  and Table of Contents in photographs.... Cassini cannot "mine"  the photographs for a book's content...

Cassini will change things... and... if sellers do not know how to deal with Cassini... they will be left behind  not understanding "What? or Why?"