Lost item in mail finally turned up

Hello,

I sent out two packages to two different customers back in early December that really didn't look like they would ever turn up. Just shipped from Montreal to the US, no huge travel time and under expedited shipping as well. Almost 2 months later, and after I refunded the buyers, they are now back on the tracking radar as in travel, and one customer actually has it in hand.

Question, how do I get the refund back? Worst case scenario, the buyer doesn't want to refund,, do I have any recourse?

Message 1 of 32
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31 REPLIES 31

Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

I should have said:  Pierre thought that FALSE claims of item not received with Expedited shipping are possible.

 

Valid claims are obviously possible.

 

Call the Post Office for more information.

 

 

Message 21 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

"I should have said:..."

 

Why not simply admit that post #4 should not have been written.  Different words should have been used. End of story.

Message 22 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

What is your point in continuing with this?

It's a waste of time and no one is learning anything from it.

 

Move On!

Message 23 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

For the parcel that was eventually received by the buyer, the shipper can justifiably claim a refund of the postage from Canada Post. I did this once for an Expedited Parcel to USA that was misdirected by the USPS and took 30 days to reach my buyer. Responding to my complaint, Canada Post immediately refunded the postage.

No doubt the OP's other parcel will be delivered in good order and he'll be entitled to a refund of the postage.

 

Tom 

Message 24 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

I understand that Pierre sells stamps and so he doesn't use Expedited shipping.

 

I don't know why anyone would think this.

I sell stamps and use ExpressPost, Expedited and even Priority Post often.

While philatelists are an honest bunch who usually actually read the descriptions, it makes sense to use tracking on high value items.

 

Like this one (We sold a similar one for $650 as noted in the story.)

http://www.canadianstampauctions.com/Commentary/Number_174.htm

 

 

 

Message 25 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

This thread got a little crazy. I did make a claim with CPO and did receive 2 checks for the insured value of the items, but not the shipping for some reason CPO didn't explain. The buyers have now received free items and it looks like they are ignoring my requests for the money. I really thought after 2 months that the packages would never turn up. My mistake refunding them before the Paypal claim options were used.

Now I have 2 checks that I am guessing I cannot cash, as the items did turn up, according to the tracking. I lost the money, but I assume CPO would think that that is my problem and they did their job. To be fair, it was USPS that screwed the dog on this one, as it the packages went awol in the states.

Message 26 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

Yes, I thought that you might have already filed a case for non-arrival before the packages appeared on the radar again.

 

Since they issued the checks and your buyers haven't re-paid you I don't think you should have an issue with cashing those checks.

Others might disagree.  🙂

 

Odd that they didn't include shipping but it sounds like a complete mess.

 

This is an usual case and perhaps one where the CPO should make sure that no one loses since they do seem to be responsible for the mess.

 

 

 

 

 

Message 27 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

Starti,

In refunding your two buyers, you acted quite properly. You are responsible for the timely and safe delivery of what you sold into the hands of your buyer. I don't believe Canada Post was  obligated to refund you the value of the parcels but I'm not surprised they did - no one can be expected to wait 2 months for an Expedited Parcel to arrive. The fact that it was the USPS that screwed up makes no difference. By accepting the parcels, Canada Post undertook to get them to the two recipients in a timely manner. However, CP certainly should have refunded you the postage.

Anyway, I see no reason why you shouldn't cash those checks.

 

Tom

Message 28 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

Thanks everyone for the opinions and time it took to post them.

Message 29 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

Just to follow this ongoing problem up, I have had one of the buyers accept the refund and accept the item without re-paying or acknowledging my requests to either return the item or money. In the real world they would call this mail fraud and theft, but Ebay and Paypal washed their hands of this despite the crime being perpetrated in their forum. I was told tough luck by Ebay, don't be so honest next time and wait for the claim to open and wait it out. Nice company.

Message 30 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

You mentioned in an earlier post that Canada Post had sent you 2 cheques for the insured value of the item.  Why not simply cash the one that applies to the buyer who refused to repay the refund? 

 

You are not defrauding Canada Post, since they failed to meet their commitments and you were obligated to refund the buyer, i.e. you have still suffered a loss as a result of CP's (via USPS) failure to deliver the parcel.  The fact that the parcel ultimately showed up is irrelevant -- the insurance claim you made prior to that point was accepted and paid by CP, and you had already refunded the buyer in good faith. 

 

With respect to the 2nd buyer, I would hold on to the CP cheque representing the insured value of that parcel and wait say, another 2 weeks to see if the 2nd buyer responds with a repayment of the refund you made to him.  If not, I would cash the CP cheque. 

 

Should the 2nd buyer suddenly have a fit of honesty and repay you, if you feel compelled, you can return the value of the insurance payment to CP.  That would be the strictly correct thing to do, although I doubt CP would ever follow up, and I think they'd be rather confused, frankly, if anyone approached them to repay in this way. 

 

In my experience in many years of legal claims involving insurers, most insurers don't care what happens once a claim has been approved and paid out (for instance in cases of theft of property from a home where some property may ultimately be recovered).  The file is closed as far as they are concerned unless there is some indication of deliberate fraud on the part of the claimant -- such as claiming insurance for something one knows isn't lost or stolen, or where a highly valuable article (e.g. irreplaceable painting) has been stolen and may be able to be subsequently recovered. 

 

I wanted to also clear up what seemed to have been a misunderstanding in this thread -- Canada Post does not provide an on-time guarantee for Expedited to the US.  Those guarantees are for Xpresspost and Priority only.  It does so within Canada though.  See the charts at these links:

 

http://www.canadapost.ca/web/business/mailing-and-shipping.page

 

http://www.canadapost.ca/web/business/mailing-and-shipping.page

 

For this reason, CP wasn't obligated to refund you for the shipping cost, although in my view it would have been the proper thing for them to do in this situation, considering it was a tracked service you paid for.

 

IMO you took all the proper steps.  By the way, to clarify the legal arguments vis-a-vis fraud, it would only have been fraud to make a claim to CP for loss after Pierre was correct in reacting as he did to a suggestion that a seller should look into making a claim after the item was already in the buyer's hands. 

 

However, you made the claim while the parcel was still MIA, so there is no problem.  Even if you hadn't made the (insurance) claim when  you did, in this situation I would still have contacted CP to let them know the situation and to tell them you had refunded the buyers.  There would have been nothing dishonest about that.

 

You're absolutely right though -- eBay isn't helpful in these sorts of situations.

Message 31 of 32
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Re: Lost item in mail finally turned up

Sorry, I see the links above are the same -- when you get to the CP page, just select the "Canada" or "US" tab at top to see the service features.

 

Also, that paragraph up there got cut apart for some reason.  It should have read:

 

"IMO you took all the proper steps.  By the way, to clarify the legal arguments vis-a-vis fraud, it would only have been fraud to make a claim to CP for loss after you knew the parcel had been delivered.  Pierre was correct in reacting as he did to a suggestion that a seller should look into making a claim after the item was already in the buyer's hands."

 

 

Message 32 of 32
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