eBay

rewelu · ‎05-12-2004

Hi All!

I just became a Powersellers today and am very pleased. I ship a lot of different items around and was actually shocked to find that I made Powersellers.

I see that a lot of people complain about shipping and Paypal costs. First of all check to see that you currently are receiving Merchant Rates at Paypal. It is 0.5% lower than the Standard Rate.

Also, I have developed a calculator (Excel Based) that allows you to charge a shipping price that makes 100% sure that the buyer pays for the Paypal fees. It factors in eBay fees, actual shipping cost, extra marketing enhancements (bold, etc.) and any other percentage rate that gets applied to your final price (eg. AuctionWorks and other back-end sales managers). It took me about half a day to come up with the algebra, but it saves me a lot of money and avoids me guessing shipping prices.

This also allows me to charge fair shipping prices, yet still be competitive. For all you sellers that list in US$, it includes a exchange rate calculator with a real-time feed from www.xe.com.

If anyone is interested, give me an e-mail and I can send you a copy.

It really is very cool and would help you a lot in making future shipping decisions.

shoplineca · ‎05-22-2004

Hendre
Congratulations as that is exactly what you want to do here is to make profit.

Some people learn too late that they are paying more in eBay and PayPal fees than they are putting into their pockets.

There are several sellers who have been on eBay for a number of years selling the same items however each year taking in less and less, not because of the competition but rising costs.

eBay is a strange mix of sellers. Some ocassional, some full-time but if you dont calculate the amount of time put into it, one could be working for less than a couple of dollars per hour.

I assumed if you could write a spreadsheet program to calculate your fees into your shipping costs, that you must have a pretty good idea about the profit you were making on the items that you list.

My commenst were more on a general theme for anyone who might have such a tight margin of profit that the only profit they really put into their pockets is how much they have padded their shipping fees by.

Malcolm

shooger · ‎05-24-2004

Malcolm, you're a well educated and travelled man. You could be making millions a year doing one of about twenty high paying jobs you've told us you have held. You've never mentioned (that I've seen) why you're selling items on eBay (and apparently not having much luck, as you have threatened to quit as well as complain weekly about how horrible it is). Regardless, you're here, and I'll assume you're here to make some money. That's why I'm here. But I don't factor in the time it takes me to buy envelopes. When I read that, I said "wtf" and I think you know what that stands for. 🙂 Envelopes come in a big box. I have a Staples on the road I drive down every day to go to the gym. Every couple months, I pull over and buy a couple 1000 count boxes of envelopes. That is my only shipping material (except for a pen to write addresses with). I'm not going to factor the 5 minutes it takes me every two months into my shipping fee! That's silly. The envelopes cost me about half a cent each, I think. The truth is, I don't really bother to account for them. I slap a stamp on the envelope - I buy these using PayPal money. I only accept PayPal. All my profits go in, all my expenditures go out. I don't know exactly why, but I make about 100% return on my investment every four months. In other words, I make what I put in, and then that much again as profit. So with $3000, it becomes $6000, then $12000, and then $24000 after one year. I'm not saying those are my numbers, it's an example. I really don't know exactly how much I pay for stamps, but all I'm here for is the bottom line. I use my free time (I'm a nurse specializing in psychiatry for my "real" job) to make money on eBay. In the process, I also keep one full set of each release of the product I deal in (I'm also a collector). My $2 flat shipping fee covers all my fees (and yes, a 1/2 cent envelope) for items that I sell for about $7 and less. Items that sell for more than $7 end up losing me a few cents. But eBay rules are eBay rules - we can't increase the shipping cost for expensive items just because they're expensive. Heavy, bulky, over long distances, yes. Expensive, no.

Hendre may have had a slightly "against the rules" idea, but his concepts seem sound. Those xboxes look cheap, from what I know of consoles. I'd buy from him, if I wanted one of those. 🙂

shoplineca · ‎05-24-2004

shooger
I've bought businesses that run by the seat of their pants and the owners never knew if they were making money or not. They would reach into their pocket and depending how much was in their pocket, that was their budget.

These were companies that started small but all of a sudden had sales of $20 to $50 million per year and 200 employees and the owners operated with the same mentality as when they began their businesses, and they were all in trouble.

Thats ok for a small, at home business as a hobby but what I have seen is when someone's business starts to grow, they continue the same methods of running their businesses, never knowing where they were making money, never knowing where they were loosing money.

Hendre is taking the time to factor in his costs at a very early stage and that is a very smart move, especially with a goal of growing the business because along with the sales that grow, your business habits will also have an affect on the eventual success or failure of your business.

You made a comment that you have absolutely no idea about and that is suggesting I have no luck or success selling on eBay. The fact remains that I make in profit selling one item what probably takes you 50 or 100 or more items to sell to realize the same profit. Does that mean I am 50 to 100 times more successful than you are?

eBay is a source of income but like everything else, it is to give me an expected return equal to my investment which includes my time. Why would I spend 25 hours to make $50 for myself and put $100 in fees into eBay's pockets?

So the level of one's success is proportionate to one's own parameters they have set for themselves and their business.

Its not unlike learning to pay golf, you can teach yourself and develop a mean slice but accommodate somewhat for it or you can learn to play properly and achieve greater results and more satisfaction from the game.

Its all a matter of personal choice.

Everyone charges eBay and PayPal fees somewhere (not as much charges, but absorbs them) and my comments were simply put: that if you are selling your items at cost and your profit is in your shipping charges, then you need to find another line of products to sell.

Hendre is very clearly not doing that, and is in fact enjoying a healthy profit from the sale of his products, sufficient to cover his costs and put money in his pocket and he knows that for a fact as he considers all the costs associated with making a profit.

If you are able to do that or at least able to be happy with having some positive cash flow then good for you too shooger.

Malcolm

shoplineca · ‎05-24-2004

shooger
By the way I havent complained weekly about selling on eBay. Have you got a thorn up your ass about me?

I make no comments anywhere about you, offer some assistance to a new PSer, in particular warn him about broadcasting in a thread about collecting eBay and PayPal fees and all of a sudden you come into the thread and take a couple of whacks at me.

Get over it shooger, its getting to be realyy tiring and it doesnt look good on you.

Malcolm

deltone · ‎05-24-2004

Malcolm, I have to agree with what you said. I found that Shooger's comments to you were uncalled for. I have found you to be helpful with any questions or concerns people have had and have never know you to attack anyone, like you were just "attacked".

I know that people have different personalities,and sometimes it's hard to truly judge what a poster's intentions were but I found post 21 very rude and unnecessary.

shooger · ‎05-24-2004

"I make in profit selling one item what probably takes you 50 or 100 or more items to sell to realize the same profit. Does that mean I am 50 to 100 times more successful than you are?"

I guess it depends on how you measure success. If it's by the end price per auction, then yes. If it's by total sales, or percentage increase, or some other measure, then maybe not. I don't know your numbers. But then again, I'm not here to brag.

"Why would I spend 25 hours to make $50 for myself?"

I can't answer that question for you, but I can answer it for myself: Because I can do it at home, because I can put in time whenever I want to, because it's low risk (compared to gambling/stocks/etc), because it's more rewarding than working for someone else, because I'm learning about business and commerce, because it pays for itself and lets me buy flatscreens/vacations/groceries, and because it's an extension of a hobby/game that I already enjoy. Those are my reasons for "working" on eBay for less than what I make in psychiatry.

"if you are selling your items at cost and your profit is in your shipping charges, then you need to find another line of products to sell."

I agree. I hope nobody here is selling products at cost. That seems to violate the number one rule in selling: make a profit. Okay, I have no idea if that's the number one rule, but it should be. 🙂

"By the way I havent complained weekly about selling on eBay. Have you got a thorn up your ass about me?"

Yes you have, and no I don't. I just stated the facts. I'm not about to go count the number of complaints you've made in the last 10 weeks and divide by 10, but I'm sure that if I did I'd come up with a number larger than 1. Anyone who posts/reads on these boards knows you to be the most vocal complainer. I'm close behind you. If you're offended to be pointed out as a complainer, then complain about my post and see what happens. Maybe I'll get banned?

"I know that people have different personalities,and sometimes it's hard to truly judge what a poster's intentions were but I found post 21 very rude and unnecessary."

I agree about some people having multiple personalities. The way you two agree with each other on everything, and feed off each other, makes it seem like you're the same person with two accounts. If you guys are that offended about my post, then you shouldn't be posting on an internet board. You're trolling for a flame war, while claiming to only be trying to help out. I'm used to dealing with passive agressive personalities, so have at 'er. I'll read your replies.

deltone · ‎05-24-2004

I often wondered why so many of the regulars no longer seem to post on here much or at all anymore. I think I just finally figured out why. I doubt it's a coincidence that they seemed to disappear when you made your appearance Shooger. You are a real piece of work.

mevans_dot_net · ‎05-24-2004

I also found post 21 to have a very condescending tone. Shooger, you have to ask yourself, were you trying to make a valid point or take a shot. If you were trying to make a point, it was lost amongst the combative nature of your post.

How do you come to the conclusion two people simply agreeing with one another’s opinions are “feeding” off each other. Maybe they have similar viewpoints on many issues, so what? Shooger, are you just disagreeing for the sake of it? Because I have to tell you, sometimes it seems you make a point of putting yourself at odds with others.

shoplineca · ‎05-24-2004

shooger
I even tried to end my post 23 on this thread with a positive comment towards you but you really have a problem and I think that problem is dealing with people.

I am not going to stoop to your level, you made a big enough impact before on this board such that many people decided to not bother coming to it and posting on it and you are on your way to doing it again.

If you had any decency about you, you would request that eBay pulls your derogatory posts.

Malcolm

shooger · ‎05-24-2004

I invite everyone who is offended to leave. Complain to eBay about me on your way out. Bye! 😛

mevans_dot_net · ‎05-24-2004

Offended? No. I just kinda feel sad for you.

systemagic · ‎05-24-2004

I've just started reading an excellent book: "Power vs. Force" by David R. Hawkins, MD, PhD (psychiatrist). It seems relevant to this thread as well as some others regarding buyer relations. I'd recommend it to anyone. What an amazing Discussion Group this would be if the "Power Sellers" here could boost their "Power" as defined in this book.

tipoftheice · ‎05-25-2004

I love it! Now I don't have to tune into my soaps, I'll just pop into this board! Hee, hee! I did enjoy all the posts on fees and profits, it's true it just goes to show the variety of motives for sellers, some are pure business and profits while others are pleasure and pastime. Let's not forget that's what makes ebay so inviting for everybody. It's the all-American(or should I say Canadian) dream! Hopefully we can land in the middle, making profits and have some pleasure! Cheers to all and good luck!!

Toni

jaymor8 · ‎05-25-2004

Oh shooger, poor poor shooger. I think Deb has been far too generous with you in inferring that many have left the board because of you. Not true. You don't hold that kind of power in here.

Know why? Because you haven't paid your dues. From day one you have been nothing but beligerent and when confronted by it, you become arrogant. WTF??? Yes, we ALL know what it stands for.

This is a very quiet and relaxed board. But make no mistake my friend...if you're looking to have a verbal joust in this place and you're looking to win it...you don't have a prayer. There are far too many well armed, well versed and well intentioned people in here and you can't make the cut. Why, you ask??? Because you haven't paid your dues.

A little sad too, because now you have lost all of your credibility and you CAN'T pay your dues. People will never enter into an intelligent conversation with you now, because firstly, it would be only one-sided and secondly because they know you and when a conversation becomes totally predictable for guaranteed negativity, they lose interest. You end up talking to yourself. And that's a very lonely place to be.

Rethink it kiddo. The whole board can't be wrong. Just take another look!

Jackie...

ultra-collections · ‎05-25-2004

Hey guys!

Before this becomes a blood bath of verbal warfare, please remember we are all here to learn from the posts, I would like to think those of you who provide interesting input!

All said and done, eBay is a tool, Paypal is a tool, as processionals, we can not charge a client more because we use an Eastwing hammer instead of a Dollar Store hammer. If Paypal fees are hurting your profit, then don't use the tool. Simple really!

I think it was best put by Malcolm when he said if you have to get profit from shipping you should look into other items to sell. Again, simple

In any business there are costs, everyone knows that auctions are a form a gambling, while some products might even cost you to sell them, at least you are not sitting on the stock and wasting time and money in making sure that it remains in good condition. On the other hand, a 2.00 investment at a garage sale, and wham 600% return, it is all in the draw of the straw, and that is what makes being a PowerSeller fun!

eBay allows you to charge a "reasonable" S&H fee, this can not increase with the price of them item, figure out roughly what it will cost you to list, pack, and post the item. Clearly mark what you intend to charge for S&H, remember higher S&H rates will push people away from your auctions, they will "look around" This is not good, if ones looks around enough they will find what they are looking for, and on eBay, most people are looking for deals!

If you charge a S&H fee, and imply that you have to cover materials, then the client gets an old supermarket box, chances are they will not come back, however if you use new packing materials, they get a clean, sturdy box and this makes them feel good. Or at least wrap the boxes in paper, show them that you don't mind working for your money. People will only complain when they feel cheated out of their hard earned money, if you over charge them, sweeten the deal with a small gift, or a hand written thank you letter, remember letters are always better when written with a fountain pen! And I know an UltraPlace to get some!

This is slowly turning into a novel, but I hope it has helped. There is nothing wrong with trying to get back some of the cost, just don't try to get them all back, and remain "resonable"

shoplineca · ‎05-25-2004

ultra-collections
Very nice post.

Hopefully it will bring this thread back to the topic and garner some additional supportive suggestions for the OP to profit from.

rewelu sounds like he is going to be an asset to this board.

Malcolm

shooger · ‎05-25-2004

Everyone is an asset to this board. This board is another tool, and only as good as the people who post on it. In reality, the board itself is garbage - using 1994 forum software when recent (2003) editions are freeware available for download. The support is terrible - little or no moderation. But it's the people, not the software or moderators. I value everyone's opinion, even those who are sitting high and mighty, who have paid their dues, and are enjoying getting in on the "pot-shot" action. I can handle it, I'm a big guy. No offense taken. 🙂 I get a lot out of the information and opinions expressed here, and have put a lot back in, when I've got something that doesn't seem to have been said yet. I'm not here to make friends, and I couldn't give a rat's ass if Malcolm and the gang hate my guts. The only reason this board is here is to gather, share, and use information. If I wanted to make friends, I wouldn't be looking here. So, on with the info! B-) I agree with Malcolm, ultra-collections's post made sence. "If Paypal fees are hurting your profit, then don't use the tool." So true. Of course PayPal fees are hurting profits - anything that costs me money is decreasing my bottom line. But I justify it because it's easy, convenient, and a lot of buyers have access to it. Since I started, I have only accepted PayPal. I may complain about some of their policies, and wish the fees didn't cramp my profits, but I find them to be the way for me to go, at present time. Down the road, I'll look at it again.

A side note. When I first came to eBay as a seller, I raised my shipping cost for high priced items, in an effort to cover costs better. Not only did I find buyers didn't like it, but I ended up finding the rules which informed me that this wasn't allowed. I changed to a fixed shipping cost system and never looked back.

jaymor8 · ‎05-25-2004

Shooger - nobody ever said that you had to be 'buddies' with anyone on the board. But it IS nice to 'share' ideas, knowledge, experience and information. In order to accomplish that, you have to listen, think and THEN speak.

You are SO welcome to disagree with anybody on the board and I would be ashamed of you if you didn't express your thoughts honestly. But having said that, that does not include going after a poster. If you dislike/disagree with a post then that's what you deal with. Say you disagree and say why.

To go on the attack of a poster, because you disagree is NOT acceptable. What you said to Malcolm in post 21 (I think) was unnecessarily personal and downright mean and that's inappropriate behaviour. If Malcolm has shared personal details of his life with us, then it is because he trusts who he is chatting with. He is not expecting to have those words or that information FLUNG into his face the moment someone disagrees with his ideas.

There's one thing you should know about me shooger. I would stand up for you against Malcolm in a heartbeat, if he did that to you.....because if it's not right for one, it's not right for the other. But that's not what happened. You say all you want to do is share information and hear other peoples' opinions, well that's wonderful. But as I said before...you have to pay your dues first and what that means is...people have to trust you and feel comfortable that they can speak their mind with feeling YOUR knife in THEIR back. That's all. It's SO simple. You get what you give....always...out of life, out of love, out of family and out of friendship. That rule applies to all aspects of life.

I hope you stay aboard and I hope you regale us with your stories and anecdotes because they're interesting and you have a unique slant on life. But just remember, no man is an island. We all like to speak, but we NEED someone to listen. We're all the same. We're all just people 🙂

Best,

Jackie...