Three Tory MPs ask RCMP to investigate some abortions as homicides

[puckstopshere]

Three Conservative MPs want the RCMP to investigate any abortions performed after 19 weeks in Canada as possible homicides.

The MPs from Saskatchewan, Alberta and Ontario make the request in a letter on House of Commons letterhead to RCMP Commissioner Bob Paulson.

In the letter, the MPs say abortions performed at 20 weeks gestation or later breach Section 223a of the Criminal Code.

The MPs say the killing of Canadian children may continue to grow if they are not thoroughly investigated by police.

The letter is signed by MPs Maurice Vellacott of Saskatoon-Wanuskwein, Leon Benoit of Vegreville-Wainwright and Wladyslaw Lizon of Mississauga East-Cooksville.

Rona Ambrose, minister for the status of women, told the Commons Monday that Canadians don't want to revisit the abortion debate.

[disisus]

What is Section 223a of the Criminal Code?

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

http://yourlaws.ca/criminal-code-canada/223-when-child-becomes-human-being

Basically what is being said is because of new technology a child 20 weeks old and older of course can survive on it's own with the help of a ventilator and surfactant http://www.hamiltonhealthsciences.ca/documents/Patient%20Education/Surfactant-lw.pdf

Before 20 weeks the possibilities of survival is very few if at all because certain aspects of the lungs have not developed. So if a child can breathe out of the womb on it's own (with a bit of help) then it is considered a living human being.

Greetings Les. CYE 

[disisus]

Greetings Deacon.

After reading the article, it appears the MP's want to go back as far as the year 2000 ( 13 yrs. ago ) and prosecute women that had an abortion that was and still is considered legal. Unless the law is changed, I don't see how the RCMP can lay charges. Even if the law was changed, I don't see how you can make it retro-active.

The Federal gov't has the ability and the power to change the law if they want to. So far, they haven't and Harper insists they won't. That's not to say they won't in the future but for now, he's more interested in staying in power and opinion polls don't support that position. They just keep testing the waters every year hoping they can get public support.

The only support I've heard of so far is for sex selection. I think most Canadians are fundamentally against that.

This is a very touchy subject but the truth is, you can't legislate what someone else does with their own body. Like trying to outlaw suicide.

Even if you outlaw abortion, they'll find some way to do it if they're desperate enough. I know a women, a Christian, who was totally opposed to abortion for any reason. She believed in personal and moral responsibility and wasn't shy about stating her opinion on how other people should behave. Then she became pregnant. She wasn't married and didn't have the means to support a child. She had an abortion. According to her, her situation was unique and can't be applied to others. According to her, she was having a nervous breakdown and it was the only choice she had. Of course she was unique and that never happens to anyone else. LOL.

I don't agree with abortion - but the inability to walk a mile in someone else's shoes can result in injustice's.

So if Canadians really want to end abortions, then putting in laws that make it illegal is not enough. We have to put our money where our opinions are. Surprisingly I never hear the MP's that want to ban it suggest we give women who find themselves in that position financial support to carry thru with it. Or social services to deal with it. There is a huge waiting list for people who want to adopt. It's something like a 10 year wait in some locations. I know a couple who adopted a baby from overseas because they couldn't get one here.

All I hear from these MP's is how they want charges laid. So they're proposing throwing them in jail? Does that include the fathers?

[cats1953]

How many children in Canada are waiting to be adopted today? 

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

How many children in Canada are waiting to be adopted today?

Maybe lots, I suppose either one of us could look it up and get maybe an average number. Quite a lot of them are older kids and few want them. Some are of another race and fewer want them. I knew a fellow a few years back who was an orphan and brought up his whole childhood and part of this teenage years in a Salvation Army orphanage. He went in there at age 6. He often would say when he thought about the past, how many kids like himself longed for a home but all the 'people' wanted were cute little babies. He's done well for himself, he's an airline pilot now....but the past still hurts him inside....the rejection.

Getting back to what Les said.....

I also 'personally' do not agree with abortion. As far as my own view is concerned 'life starts at conception'. The fetus may not look like a child and may not be able to live on it's own even with help, but to me it's still a .....'life'. However I also believe in someone's right to have control over their own bodies from birth to death if they wish. If there was a way to convince women out of aborting, I would do it, but.....as Les also pointed out.....I don't live in their shoes. Whatever decision they make....they will have to live with for the rest of their lives. Also as Les pointed out if it becomes illegal...it will still happen and probably under clandestine conditions that are dangerous.  

[puckstopshere]

The Federal gov't has the ability and the power to change the law if they want to. So far, they haven't and Harper insists they won't.

Wow!  I thought Prior would have been all over this.

I find it hard to believe that three Conservative MP's are allowed to bring up this crap, without some knowledge and some agreement on the part of the boss. 

Harper is a control freak (IMO).  If he didn't want this to be an issue, it wouldn't be one.  Why does it keep coming up - and why does he keep saying it won't happen.  If this was his real opinion, these MP's would have been slapped down before they could open their mouths. 

If it smells like a skunk, it probably is a skunk.

[puckstopshere]

Before 20 weeks the possibilities of survival is very few if at all because certain aspects of the lungs have not developed.

There are miracles being performed daily when it comes to saving a premature infant from what used to be certain death.  While my grandson was in the preemie ward at St. Joe's, we saw babies that were living miracles.  They had pictures of healthy toddlers on the wall.  These were kids who were in the prremie ward after being born prematurely.  There were birth weights as well.  Some of the infants weighed barely a pound at birth. 

Technology and medical science may someday be able to increase the chances of survival and a good life for preemies under 20 weeks.  Then, the law will need to change. 

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

I thought Prior would have been all over this.

Seen it.....couldn’t be bothered…..been over it before…..and Harper is playing both ends against the middle. Things like this….people will do what they want anyhow and no one will be any the wiser.

Technology and medical science may someday be able to increase the chances of survival.

Certainly it will happen.  One day a foetus will be able to be raised outside a womb from the moment of conception. The day will also come where people will only be allowed one or two children….or they will be allowed none unless it’s through maybe a lottery. A long way away of course, but the world cannot sustain the continued increase in population without something to level it off such as a natural disaster of some sort or human’s inhumanity to each other.

[disisus]

I find it hard to believe that three Conservative MP's are allowed to bring up this crap, without some knowledge and some agreement on the part of the boss. 

Harper is a control freak (IMO).  If he didn't want this to be an issue, it wouldn't be one.  Why does it keep coming up - and why does he keep saying it won't happen.  If this was his real opinion, these MP's would have been slapped down before they could open their mouths. 

If it smells like a skunk, it probably is a skunk.

Yes, it's a skunk. I wish they were as open, honest and accountable as they campaigned on.

Harper just keeps testing the waters with back bench MP' without actually taking personal responsibility for it. He is a control freak.