Fantino defends Uganda grants policy against religious, anti-gay claims

[puckstopshere]

International Co-operation Minister Julian Fantino is defending the way Canada hands out money for development projects abroad.

He’s under fire in the House of Commons following a Canadian Press report that funding went to an evangelical group that has described homosexuality as a perversion.

Ontario-based Crossroads Christian Communications, which produces television programs, received $544,813 in federal money to help dig wells, build latrines and promote hygiene awareness in Uganda through 2014.

Uganda has been shaken by virulent homophobia in the past and Foreign Affairs Minister John Baird has condemned plans for an anti-gay bill there that could potentially include the death penalty for homosexuals.

Crossroads recently described homosexuality as a perversion and a sin on its website, although the post disappeared after the group was contacted about it.

Fantino tells the Commons that projects are financed based on results, not religion.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/fantino-defends-uganda-grants-policy-against-religious-...

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

I also don't recall praising this Christian group.

Defense is praising.......post 6...... "I think digging wells, constructing latrines, and promoting hygiene awareness in Uganda is commendable" .....then >.....there is the following sentence after that.

Cellophane

[pigdog47]

Like I said, I can't recall praising this Christian or suggesting Uganda was a Muslim country.

Perhaps a retraction of those allegations is in order here, lollipop.

[art-in-the-making]

I understand that the religious beliefs espoused by the organization being funded to do this work are a source of consternation to some here, to which I say:     awwww.  Isn't that just toooo bad.

It wouldn't be in the least surprising if the link between aggressive evangelizing mixed up in everything from schools to drinking water,  and Uganda's death penalty policy towards an orientation were more than just passive like-mindedness.

pd may have failed to put two and two together, although the calculation was done for him in post two.

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

lollipop LOL

A few years ago I was in a legion. There was a guy in there who was loud and obnoxious. The barkeep could do nothing with him so she looked at me. I told him to sit down and drink his drink quietly. He got up and said "I can lick you". I told him I don't taste so good.

The ambulance attendants said he would be ok in a couple of days. The cops didn't charge me because he instigated the situation. One cop just said "if I could charge him with being stupid I would".

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

What he did art was as he has done in the past..... blurted out his real feelings and then suddenly realized what he had done and then tried to find his bike.

[puckstopshere]

 awwww.  Isn't that just toooo bad. 

Uganda gay death penalty rejected by Pastor Ssempa

A backer of Uganda's Anti-Homosexuality Bill has told a parliamentary committee he does not support the proposal of the death penalty for some homosexual acts.

But Pastor Martin Ssempa urged MPs to pass the legislation, which tightens laws against homosexuality.

The bill's proponents and opponents have been making their case during two days of public committee hearings.

The bill, first introduced in 2009, sparked international condemnation and had been quietly shelved until now.

Uganda is a largely conservative society and many people condemn homosexuality both as unAfrican and unChristian.

But in recent years, some gay rights groups have been set up in the country.

A parliamentary spokesperson told the BBC it was unlikely MPs would get to vote on the bill before the current parliamentary session ends this week.

A new parliament is to be sworn in next week, following elections in February.

'Killing our society'

Uganda has come under intense international pressure over the bill, which proposes increasing the penalties for homosexual acts from 14 years in prison to life.

It also proposed the death penalty for a new offence of "aggravated homosexuality" - defined as when one of the participants is a minor, HIV-positive, disabled or a "serial offender".

But according to AP news agency, MP David Bahati, who proposed the legislation, last month said that the death penalty "was something we have moved away from".

Pastor Ssempa also rejected this clause but nevertheless urged the Legal and Parliamentary Affairs Committee to back the bill.

"The parliament should be given the opportunity to discuss and pass the bill, because homosexuality is killing our society," AP news agency quotes him as telling the MPs.

An opponent of the bill, Anglican Bishop Christopher Senyonjo, told the committee that the proposals would not stop homosexuality and further criminalising gay people would adversely affect the fight against HIV/Aids.

Under the proposals, people could face jail for failing to inform the authorities if somebody confided their homosexual activities to them.

"If we criminalise the LGBT [lesbian gay bisexual and transgender] community further, it will drive Ugandans further underground and compromise the relationship of medical, counsellors and clergy that is sacrosanct and needs to remain confidential,"

How can we expect doctors to treat everyone when this bill will require them to report on their patients who are LGBT?" he said.

Some gay activists in Uganda have said the public hearings were intended as a diversionary tactic from recent protests over high food and fuel prices.

In January, David Kato, a campaigner who led condemnation of the Anti-Homosexuality Bill, was murdered not long after suing a paper that outed him as gay. Police denied the killing was because of his sexuality.

Three months before the murder, Uganda's Rolling Stone newspaper had published the photographs of several people it said were gay, with the headline "Hang them."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-13346693

[puckstopshere]

The private member's bill was submitted by Member of Parliament David Bahati on 14 October 2009. Same-sex relationships are currently illegal in Uganda—as they are in many sub-Saharan African countries—punishable by incarceration in prison for up to 14 years. The proposed legislation in Uganda has been noted by several news agencies to be inspired by American evangelical Christians. A special motion to introduce the legislation was passed a month after a two-day conference was held in which three American Christians asserted that homosexuality is a direct threat to the cohesion of African families. Several sources have noted endemic homophobia in Uganda has been exacerbated by the bill and the associated discussions about it. American evangelicals have also been accused of taking advantage of social and economic circumstances in Uganda to export the American 'culture war' to Africa.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uganda_Anti-Homosexuality_Bill

[pigdog47]

Ambulance attendants are called "paramedics", in the same way that doctor attendants are referred to as "nurses".  A touching story, nevertheless, even if perhaps embellished and fictionalized.  It would be interesting to hear how you ended up a resident in the Big House, where Canadian  taxpayers funded your involuntary stay.

Art, I will look into the passive like-mindedness you are suggesting.  I would be extremely surprised to learn of any mainstream Evangelical Canadian organization currently in support of executing or imprisoning people based on their sexual orientation.  I currently sponsor a Ugandan  girl (Brenda) through the support of an organization called IN (International Needs).  Having talked at length with a couple that works in Uganda, there is no great affection for the current Ugandan president, and even less so for his wife.

[art-in-the-making]

I will look into the passive like-mindedness you are suggesting.

You won't have to do much looking - it's actually a much similar process to Harper's method of selecting senators. Getting rave reviews, apparently.

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

Ambulance attendants are called "paramedics",

I'm old school and I use old school phrases often, some because I was brought up with them and they just stuck and others because of where I am from. I even prefer nurses in a white uniform dress and a white hat and a police 'van' I still call either a paddy wagon or a black Maria.

Come'on up and I'll even introduce you to the barkeep.  

It would be interesting to hear how you ended up a resident.....

That was a different situation, the same as others when I was a guest in smaller facilities.    

[art-in-the-making]

As the four-week provincial election campaign drew to a close, Wildrose candidates Allan Hunsperger and Ron Leech, both pastors, caused a stir with statements that critics called intolerant. Mr. Leech told a radio station he had an advantage in his Calgary riding because he is white. Edmonton’s Mr. Hunsperger, in a year-old blog posting, said gays will spend eternity in a “lake of fire, hell.”

-Globe and Mail

Mind you, this is just what these guys say when they're running for election. Who knows what they say amongst themselves?

[pigdog47]

I will look into the passive like-mindedness you are suggesting.

You won't have to do much looking - it's actually a much similar process to Harper's method of selecting senators. Getting rave reviews, apparently.

Have to agree with you on this one.  Not sure as to "why" this particular outfit mentioned in the OP decided to take a homophobic stance with it's website.  Offensive and gratuitous, IMO.  

Ran across a very witty fellow via Google just now called The Propaganda Professor, who might just be the equal to Rex Murphy with his skill with words and phrasing them.  I think you will find his thoughts highly interesting and well written.  I did, and my belief system is very different than his, but I can appreciate a well-reasoned position laid out with dashes of humour and sarcasm.

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

I would be extremely surprised to learn of any mainstream Evangelical Canadian organization currently in support of executing or imprisoning people based on their sexual orientation.

LOL

This is no different than people down south in the 50’s and 60’s and even today who on one hand would say that Black people or Native people should not be murdered and in their other hand they hold a bible and manipulate passages to say condemn both. Same as gay people are supposedly condemned in some man made book that is suppose to be the word of an invisible god.

This Crossroads group that got over a ½ Mil from our government….our taxpayers money….preach in Uganda that homosexuality is a perversion and a sin……..hence the laws of Christian Uganda have made it illegal punishable by incarceration in prison for up to 14 years as well as penalties for individuals, companies, media organisations, or non-governmental organisations that know of gay people or support them in any way.

These religious organizations feed the hate in Uganda with their two handed doctrines while using money raised in Canada to dig wells and the rest of it to hang crystal chandeliers in their offices, build big homes for the Mainse family and put new Lincolns in the driveway.

This is the same evangelistic organization that Ron Mainse, an ordained minister and a leader of Burlington’s Crossroads Christian Communications, was ordered to repay $138,000 in commissions he received from Gordon Driver, who was the mastermind of a $14-million US Ponzi scheme. Along with Mainse David Rutledge of Ancaster, Mainse’s cousin and also an ordained minister, was ordered to pay back nearly $263,000 in commissions he received. Yeah great family, great organization….dig a well here….dig a latrine there….get people to donate money for the 'poor people'…. and then build those houses and buy those cars and dabble in a little Ponzi.

In my view there shouldn’t be an evangelistic or for that matter any religious shows on TV. They are nothing but infomercials to rake in money while using poor people as their gimmick. If someone wants to donate to any of these groups…..put on your boots and go to church and do it there. The days of selling religion on TV like a Vegomatic should be over!

[ilurkthereforiam]

Canadian taxpayers shouldn't give money to any agency that propagates hate towards any group of people.

Imo if you want to use religion to hate people your religious organization should lose it's tax free status.

[pigdog47]

Yeah, people should have to go to a brick and mortar store to buy things too. 

No more on- line banking either, or ATMs.  

[pigdog47]

😉

Canadian taxpayers shouldn't give money to any agency that propagates hate towards any group of people.

Imo if you want to use religion to hate people your religious organization should lose it's tax free status.

Hey Lurk, I agree with what you posted.

I knew this day would eventually come, even though I dreaded it.  

Might run into some problem with what constitutes "hate"

Would MADD have problems cause target drunk drivers?

[prior-of-verity*shake-hands-with-your-devil]

Yeah, people should have to go to a brick and mortar store to buy things too.

No more on- line banking either, or ATMs.

Might run into some problem with what constitutes "hate"

Would MADD have problems cause target drunk drivers?

Gotta love the aroma of desperation.

[ilurkthereforiam]

Would MADD have problems cause target drunk drivers?

No. the only thing that drunk drivers have in common with each other is that they get behind the wheel after drinking.

They don't have the same sexual orientation, belong to the same religion, have the same national origins or skin colour.

Imo drunk drivers should get a mandatory prison sentence on first offenses and much more serious charges if they hurt someone while dui.

[pigdog47]

I know where a hate forum is! 

[puckstopshere]

I applaud any group that goes to an impoverished country and helps the poor. 

What I don't like is when those "good works" come with strings attached. 

I have been seeing ads on TV lately for a Christian group that helps children around the world.  They state that they help kids, no matter what their faith.  It would be nice to think that this were true.  Except that the real goal is to replace whatever that faith is with Christianity.

When I donate to a charity, I don't specify how that money should be used.  I choose charities that don't have an agenda.  By doing that, I am secure in the knowledge that I am not forcing my beliefs on someone else. 

It is easy to influence a starving child when you put a bowl of food in front of him.  He wil sit and endure an hour long presentation on the Christian faith; not because he wants to, but because he is starving.  I am not a Christian.  I have always loved the mantra that we should put Christ back into Christmas.  I think that should be - put Christ back in Christian.

I know that Christians are taught that it is their duty to spread the message of Christianity.  I have no problem with that.  But, to do that by trying to deliver the message to helpless starving children.  That stinks.  If you want to try to convert adults who are not dependant on you for their lives, go for it.  More power to you.

Time to start a new charity - SAVE THE CHILDREN FROM CHRISTIANS