eBay

pierrelebel · ‎10-02-2014

The new business cards arrived today:

http://pierrelebel.com/pics/canada/BusinessCard.jpg

My eBay store will be closing next week.

gifts_of_elegance · ‎10-04-2014

I hope you are working with a good Realtor.

Ever think of a having that "perfect" house built?

Or find one in your ideal location that is the right size, sound structure and needs a lot of cosmetic changes. Then you can renovate to make it perfect for you. Don't move in until its finished.

Good luck!

mr.elmwood · ‎10-04-2014

@gifts_of_elegance wrote:
I hope you are working with a good Realtor.
Ever think of a having that "perfect" house built?
Or find one in your ideal location that is the right size, sound structure and needs a lot of cosmetic changes. Then you can renovate to make it perfect for you. Don't move in until its finished.
Good luck!

All excellent suggestions, if, Pierre was twenty years younger! 🙂 What am I talking about! I am a whole ten years younger and I will be building walls, hanging drywall, insulating, wiring, plumbing in a couple weeks,

I know where he is looking and when he told me, I pretty much said "Good luck".

Realtor has nothing to do with it. The inventory is what it is.

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gifts_of_elegance · ‎10-04-2014

@mr.elmwood wrote:
@gifts_of_elegance wrote:
I hope you are working with a good Realtor.
Ever think of a having that "perfect" house built?
Or find one in your ideal location that is the right size, sound structure and needs a lot of cosmetic changes. Then you can renovate to make it perfect for you. Don't move in until its finished.
Good luck!
All excellent suggestions, if, Pierre was twenty years younger! 🙂 What am I talking about! I am a whole ten years younger and I will be building walls, hanging drywall, insulating, wiring, plumbing in a couple weeks,

I know where he is looking and when he told me, I pretty much said "Good luck".

Realtor has nothing to do with it. The inventory is what it is.

Realtors are usually the first to get information on new listings. They also talk to other realtors. Often they know of an ideal property that will be coming on the market and you get first swing at the cat. I used to call people who were in sought after areas or had the ideal house. You'd be surprised how many people actually decide then and there to sell.

I am the same age as Pierrre and no way do I suggest that he do the renovations. You actually save money by hiring a contractor. They get discounts, they have all the tools, they are organized, they have insurance, worker's compensation, etc. At the end of the day, you also have some guarantee. We are too old to do things like that. We renovated between 2000-2006. The dust almost killed me. Trying to live in the middle of renovations is a nightmare and slows everything down. It also ends up costing you more money.

My husband who was also 10 years younger did a lot of the work too. That was then.

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pierrelebel · ‎10-05-2014

"I hope you are working with a good Realtor. "

Actually, we made the decision NOT to work with a realtor, just as we did eighteen years ago when we purchased the house we are in. Instead we are working with a few realtors, none of them on an exclusive basis.

We are also looking for houses not yet on the market. We spent a few dollars to have an advertisement in the local weekly newspaper under "Real Estate Wanted" explaining what we are looking for. We have already received several communications and have one house to visit in two days. The owner is planning to list later this month, saw our ad and figured we collectively could save the commission if the house works out for us and we can agree on a price.

I understand what realtors do and have a lot of respect for that profession. However, I have always felt the percentage commission charged on listing and selling a house is sometimes way out of proportion with the time and effort they put in. In my way of thinking someone putting in ten or twenty hours and getting tens of thousands of dollars in commission does not always make sense.

We briefly considered purchasing a new home or having one built but we are not interested. We want an established mature and quiet neighbourhood. Since we are looking into a small town (population 5,000) the selection is limited. Many houses on our "list" would require substantial renovations (new windows, furnace, insulation, roof, kitchen cabinets, washroom, air conditioning, and/or and/or...). That's OK - it is only a matter of budgeting - we will NOT do the work nor move in until all renovations are completed by professionals.

We are patient. We are in no hurry. We will find "the one"!

mr.elmwood · ‎10-05-2014

@pierrelebel wrote:
"I hope you are working with a good Realtor. "

Actually, we made the decision NOT to work with a realtor, just as we did eighteen years ago when we purchased the house we are in. Instead we are working with a few realtors, none of them on an exclusive basis.

We are also looking for houses not yet on the market. We spent a few dollars to have an advertisement in the local weekly newspaper under "Real Estate Wanted" explaining what we are looking for. We have already received several communications and have one house to visit in two days. The owner is planning to list later this month, saw our ad and figured we collectively could save the commission if the house works out for us and we can agree on a price.

I understand what realtors do and have a lot of respect for that profession. However, I have always felt the percentage commission charged on listing and selling a house is sometimes way out of proportion with the time and effort they put in. In my way of thinking someone putting in ten or twenty hours and getting tens of thousands of dollars in commission does not always make sense.

We briefly considered purchasing a new home or having one built but we are not interested. We want an established mature and quiet neighbourhood. Since we are looking into a small town (population 5,000) the selection is limited. Many houses on our "list" would require substantial renovations (new windows, furnace, insulation, roof, kitchen cabinets, washroom, air conditioning, and/or and/or...). That's OK - it is only a matter of budgeting - we will NOT do the work nor move in until all renovations are completed by professionals.

We are patient. We are in no hurry. We will find "the one"!

Pretty much what we did. We picked our area and started waiting. Started sweating a bit as the lease was coming up on the apt. I have six weeks to renovate the main floor bathroom, move some heating ducts around, frame and insulate the basement, add a couple of rooms. A few things will create some dust, before we actually move in.

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pierrelebel · ‎10-05-2014

" I have six weeks to renovate the main floor bathroom, move some heating ducts around, frame and insulate the basement, add a couple of rooms. "

You are a young man and have the energy to start and complete renovations. I wish...

mr.elmwood · ‎10-05-2014

YOU wish? I wish.

There is an upside to all of this. The Mrs who is the Queen of the local Temperance League will actually go to the liquor store and buy me relaxants.

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gifts_of_elegance · ‎10-05-2014

@pierrelebel wrote:
"I hope you are working with a good Realtor. "

Actually, we made the decision NOT to work with a realtor, just as we did eighteen years ago when we purchased the house we are in. Instead we are working with a few realtors, none of them on an exclusive basis.

We are also looking for houses not yet on the market. We spent a few dollars to have an advertisement in the local weekly newspaper under "Real Estate Wanted" explaining what we are looking for. We have already received several communications and have one house to visit in two days. The owner is planning to list later this month, saw our ad and figured we collectively could save the commission if the house works out for us and we can agree on a price.

I understand what realtors do and have a lot of respect for that profession. However, I have always felt the percentage commission charged on listing and selling a house is sometimes way out of proportion with the time and effort they put in. In my way of thinking someone putting in ten or twenty hours and getting tens of thousands of dollars in commission does not always make sense.

We briefly considered purchasing a new home or having one built but we are not interested. We want an established mature and quiet neighbourhood. Since we are looking into a small town (population 5,000) the selection is limited. Many houses on our "list" would require substantial renovations (new windows, furnace, insulation, roof, kitchen cabinets, washroom, air conditioning, and/or and/or...). That's OK - it is only a matter of budgeting - we will NOT do the work nor move in until all renovations are completed by professionals.

We are patient. We are in no hurry. We will find "the one"!

Pierre, do you pay the few realtors that are working with you for their time & expenses?

pierrelebel · ‎10-05-2014

No.

They will get paid thousands of dollars IF and WHEN we purchase a house through them.

threebears63 · ‎10-05-2014

Pierre, I wish you and Mary all the best in your search for a new home and hopefully a more relaxing lifestyle. Your continuous help and support on ebay is so appreciated. I have been reading and receiving your helpful tips for years, always level headed with good sound advice and practical suggestions. I hope you won't stray too far from your computer, I am just one of many that would sorely miss seeing you on these boards.

Cheers!

Heather

gifts_of_elegance · ‎10-05-2014

@pierrelebel wrote:
No.

They will get paid thousands of dollars IF and WHEN we purchase a house through them.

"IF"

Its the biggest word in the English language.

"IF" you don't buy from them, then they have worked for NOTHING.

As a matter of fact, they don't get paid for anything. Not for sales meetings, not for house inspections, not for duty time, not for Open Houses, not for prospecting, not for giving you information, showing you houses, staying in touch with you, NADA!

They pay outrageous registration, licensing, membership fees for this pleasure, office expenses, and car expenses, dress nice to earn your approval, buy you coffee, etc.etc.etc.

They are on call 24/7/365 days, through holidays, sickness, personal times, family emergency, because they don't want to miss the opportunity that "Maybe" you might buy a house from them so they can provide for their family.

Its like climbing a mountain. No matter how much effort, expense or time you sacrifice, if you don't reach the top, you go away with nothing.

"IF" you are lucky, did not make a mistake in the Purchase agreement, the Seller did not lie to you about the condition of the house, and the purchaser qualifies for the financing, then there is a commission coming to you. But NOT ALL!

Half goes to the listing office & listing agent, and you get to share your half with your broker. If after the deal closes and the buyer decides that he is no longer satisfied with his purchase (for whatever the reason) and makes you his scapegoat, not only do you loose all your share of the commission, you will probably have to beg, steal or borrow to make it "right" for him.

You don't need to use a realtor. But next time before you call a realtor, remember, he/she is a PERSON TOO!

pierrelebel · ‎10-05-2014

""IF" you don't buy from them, then they have worked for NOTHING."

???

Most realtors work on the same concept. They do not charge to list, they do not charge to advertise, they do not charge to have a open house, they only collect IF and WHEN they sell the house.

We see houses on the market for a year that are still unsold. The realtors who listed those houses got NOTHING. The realtors who hosted "open houses" got NOTHING. The realtors who arranged visits with their potential buyers got NOTHING. That is how that industry works (except for a few newer marketing services charging a flat fee)..

I fail to understand your objection.

pierrelebel · ‎10-05-2014

I should add that if a buyer not using an exclusive realtor buys a house the selling agent gets DOUBLE commission (to list and to sell). I did not create the system.

73rhc · ‎10-06-2014

"I fail to understand your objection."

Maybe because you said this:

"I understand what realtors do and have a lot of respect for that profession. However, I have always felt the percentage commission charged on listing and selling a house is sometimes way out of proportion with the time and effort they put in. In my way of thinking someone putting in ten or twenty hours and getting tens of thousands of dollars in commission does not always make sense."

pierrelebel · ‎10-06-2014

As stated earlier (post 24) I have lots of respect for that profession. I can only think in terms of my personal experience. Earlier this year my son and daughter-in-law purchased a townhouse in Toronto for $555,000, four doors down from their previous location. It had been listed on Thursday afternoon and they signed the offer for the full price on Friday. One day!

The real estate fees were in excess of $30,000 for less than one day's work.

I do not know about you but, in my world, $30,000+ for one day's work seems excessive. I understand realtors have to make a living and they have substantial expenses running their business like any business.

Now, who pays the real estate fees? The seller? Really?

Like any transaction, I understand the buyer ultimately pays all fees. When a seller on eBay offers "free shipping", reality is that buyers end up paying the shipping one way or another. When a retailer offers a "tax free" day, let's not forget that the taxes do get paid and are part of the costs passed on to the buyer.

When it comes to realtor fees, there are many opinions. Take a look at:

http://www.buzzbuzzhome.com/chat/general-chit-chat/1509/do-realtors-make-too-much

rockp5233 · ‎10-06-2014

Hi Pierre,

I do not know in which province your are looking for, but if it is in QC you might consider St-Polycarpe !!!... Very pleasant little town, a lot of activities and a quiet and secure neighborhood !

Good luck !

rose-dee · ‎10-06-2014

@pierrelebel wrote:
"I hope you are working with a good Realtor. "

Actually, we made the decision NOT to work with a realtor, just as we did eighteen years ago when we purchased the house we are in. Instead we are working with a few realtors, none of them on an exclusive basis.

I'll add my two cents to this discussion, for what my advice may be worth to you. I spent many years in real estate law (both residential and commercial property conveyancing). Although that was in BC, I'm sure similar principles apply elsewhere in Canada.

One big problem with "playing the field" where realtors are concerned is that no one realtor can be assured of getting that final commission. Like a roulette game, each one is probably only going to invest as much time and effort as he or she thinks the gamble may be worth.

An exclusive buyer's agent knows that -- sooner or later -- a commission will be coming, and can devote his or her full energies to sourcing the right property. A really good agent will have a lot of contacts in the community (not just other agents), including lawyers who give them tips about upcoming estate sales or foreclosures, as well as regular homeowner contacts and "cold calling" for potential sellers.

A further (not inconsequential) advantage to having one agent working for you to locate a home is that they can spend time getting to know you personally, your likes, dislikes, preferences, etc., and may be quicker to contact you directly with a "hot tip" than someone with whom you have only a casual or arm's-length relationship. Since the buyer pays nothing to his/her realtor, there is no benefit to the buyer in attempting to spread his/her business around.

Lastly, keep in mind that if you engage an exclusive realtor to find a home for you and he or she happens to have (or can create, through his or her own efforts) a listing for a property that you ultimately buy, then your realtor will collect both commissions, an added incentive to work even harder on your behalf.

In many cases, a good realtor will use a percentage of the listing commission to reduce your purchase costs and get a closing for both his seller and his buyer. Since the realtor would have been assured of getting at least one commission anyway, if he pleases two clients and collects at least one-half of the total commission, everybody goes away happy. (BTW, I'm assuming this is permitted in Ontario; it certainly is in BC and here in NS).

After having handed out many, many commission cheques to realtors over the years from law firms, I'm in agreement with you that the commission collected has always seemed rather out of proportion to the time and effort many appear to put into their work. However, in fairness I have to admit that, because it's a "boom and bust" profession for many, and because many wait months for a sale before collecting their commissions, the seemingly enormous commissions can end up having to be spread over weeks or months as income. In some markets there is also a lot of stiff competition, so the available inventory of properties gets divided up fairly thinly.

Still, having worked on the legal end of real estate transactions, I'm no apologist for realtors, and I can tell you from first hand experience that there are realtors and realtors. I've run into quite a few who should never have been let loose on the general public in the first place.

That is where having someone to recommend an experienced, established realtor with an excellent reputation and roots in the community can make all the difference. I should add that such a person is not necessarily the realtor with the most sales or the fanciest car.

Choosing a realtor to work with you exclusively might actually save you some money in the final analysis, if nothing else, and might get you that "perfect home" before anyone else even knows about it. Again, this is just an opinion from someone who has worked with a lot of realtors and had an opportunity to come to conclusions through considerable experience.

73rhc · ‎10-06-2014

Sure, that's one day. But it's often fast or famine. And you are talking about Toronto! It's funny how people complain how much money a certain profession earns, unless they are in that profession! How do you fell about dentist?

And opinions are like you know what, everyone has one!!!

pierrelebel · ‎10-06-2014

"Choosing a realtor to work with you exclusively might actually save you some money in the final analysis"

I do not disagree that - at times - working exclusively with a realtor may be beneficial. We have made the decision not to.

We are not "against" realtors. In fact, we are working with several of them in a very small market where a house typically takes longer than two months to sell. Many have been on the market for over a year! They generally come on this small urban market overpriced and it takes quite some time for owners to realize they will not get what "they think their house is worth".

Things are very different of course in Toronto, Vancouver or any of the large markets in Canada where you still have a seller's market.

We are patient. "The one" will come along.

rose-dee · ‎10-06-2014

@pierrelebel wrote:

Like any transaction, I understand the buyer ultimately pays all fees.

Although this may be a reasonable conclusion in an overheated market (like Toronto or Vancouver) where a seller can expect to get close to full price with few questions asked and little negotiating, generally speaking I think it's not quite as simple as a "free shipping" analogy, i.e. the buyer doesn't necessarily pay all fees in every instance.

In the majority of cases, the seller has to work with his/her realtor to come up with a listing price that will be attractive enough -- taking into account the commission -- to sell, but still sufficient to leave the selling party with the money they need or expect after all the dust settles, even after negotiation.

That's the tough part, for both seller and realtor. Often a buyer's realtor will negotiate the price down to the point where one or both realtors have to chip in some of their commission to close the deal because either seller (or buyer) feel squeezed. In such a situation -- which happens more than you might think -- the buyer and the seller may effectively end up sharing the commission. Occasionally, if negotiations push a price down below the point of the original price less commission, it's arguable whether the buyer is actually paying any of the commission at all.

For example, if a house listed at $300,000 with, say, a 6% selling commission, sells at that price, the seller will have had the benefit of some help from the unfortunate buyer for the $18,000 commission. The commission of course, is deducted (among other adjustments) from the total sale price received by the seller, so the better the deal a buyer's realtor can achieve, the less of the sales price is represented by commission.

In most cases, there's significant room for negotiation, and a buyer with a decent realtor in a market that isn't overheated may be able to push that price down considerably. If the same house actually sells for, let's say $280,000, the seller loses $20,000 but must still pay his 6% commission ($16,800), yet the buyer has paid out $20,000 less than originally expected.

It's a rather different game of negotiating who pays how much of what than in a simple retail model where there is usually little or no opportunity to alter the price. In addition, buyers can often stipulate that other things be added to the deal (such as furniture, appliances not originally listed, garden equipment, etc.) or subtracted from the price before closing the deal (for example, important systems repairs or replacements discovered through a home inspection). I've even seen sellers throw in vehicles to close a deal.

So, again, I think having one experienced realtor representing you can make it more likely that you'll pay proportionately less of the ultimate commission than the seller does.