Warning - travelling to the US

[sunward-hobbies]

I just caught a story on the radio. Didn't get more details but summary.

Seems the US is planning to have everyone, even Canadians, to have passports to enter the US by the end of the year.

NOTE - it does NOT take 7 days to get a passport. It now takes a lot longer.

And the US is being tough on all. No excuses.

You have been warned.

Angelo

[recped]

One more reason to avoid going to the USA and another completely rediculous and pointless bit of isolationism and paranoia!

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The travel initiative requirements will be rolled out in phases, providing as much advance notice as possible to the affected public to enable them to meet the terms of the new guidelines. The proposed implementation timeline is as follows:

* December 31, 2005 – Passport or other accepted document required for all travel (air/sea) to or from the Caribbean, Bermuda, Central and South America.
* December 31, 2006 – Passport or other accepted document required for all air and sea travel to or from Mexico and Canada.
* December 31, 2007 – Passport or other accepted document required for all air, sea and land border crossings

More info at http://www.travel.state.gov/travel/cbpmc/cbpmc_2223.html

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What exactly is the point? The 911 guys all had passports...

Ben
"What else could I do? I had no trade so I became a peddler" - Lazarus Greenberg 1915

[shooger]

The way I heard it (on the news on TV) was that by 2008 you may be required to have a passport when going across the border in a vehicle. They said that this was a proposal and hadn't been made law.

But still... kinda lame.

[jakeeangel]

Nope. Recped is correct. Those are the dates for requirements at the different entry points. They also say that Americans returning from Canada and elsewhere must show their passport to regain entry into the US. They're not just "picking" on us as some people seem to think. They're trying to make their citizens more secure and I applaud it. I only wish Canada would do something to make us more secure.

The Canadian passport is one of the easiest in the world to forge. 😞 It seems kind of silly to make the document mandatory when it isn't exactly completely secure. Hopefully they'll fix the flaws.

---

[shoplineca]

The Canadian Passport is NOT one of the easiest to forge however it is one of the most valuable passports in the world because of the great acceptance of Canadians in most countries.

The US Passport is far easier to forge and in fact easier to counterfeit the entire passport however the US passport is not the passport of preference for International travel by people wishing to avoid scrutiny.

As one of the most valuable passports in the world, the Cdn passport has very a high black market value and stolen Canadian passports fetch one of the highest rates.

I am not aware of any counterfeit Cdn passports where they have been produced from scratch due to the extremely high security features in them, only manipulated (forged) stolen ones.

186 blank passports stolen from a Toronto passport office in 2002 were selling on the streets for $1,000 each. Those same blank passports sold in any one of a number of foreign countries would have sold for more than $25,000 USD each.

With respect to Canadian retaliation, we will be instituting the same demand on Americans with the same time lines for them to carry passports to enter Canada.

At around $100 a pop it will be an expensive venture all around. Why doesnt the US just rebuild the Berlin Wall around itself because that is what is really happening there in their drive to keep the world out and pretend they are protecting their citizens.

Or maybe they can just stop invading countries and not create so many enemies.

Malcolm

[proud-to-offer]

I really don't see what the big deal is about having to present a passport. Personally, I always bring my passport when crossing the border or flying anywhere outside of Canada. It makes life much easier.

Although the US is our neighbour, they are a separate country and are entitled to set their own rules, as to what type of documentation they require for entry. I don't fault any country for requiring a passport be presented upon entry. To me, it just makes sense.

~Bonnie

[rd1000]

It is certainly no surprise. I don't see a problem except that it is going to cost people who wouldn't otherwise need one $100 or so.

The retaliation thing is just childish. And unnecessary. US citizens will need them to return to the US anyway! Unless there are a few more army deserters that want a safe place to hide, they will have to return. I am not sure what Ann MacClellan is trying to accomplish.

Then again, I don't understand much about what is happening in our country anymore.

Rob

[sunset_sports_cards]

Ahhhh.....both countries are in kahoots with each other. Canada says to the US..."if you make us have passports to enter your country, we can make some extra money with a higher sales of our passports!"....I wouldn't be surprised if the cost to get them goes up. The US then says...."Ok Canada only if you promise to do the same, that way we can benefit from it too"!... That is probably how that went down in the political world. 😞

[recped]

"if you make us have passports to enter your country, we can make some extra money with a higher sales of our passports!".

I don't know the current cost for a passport but I doubt very much that there is total recovery of costs in the fee.

In this thread $100 was mentioned, (last time I had a passport it was 20 bucks), do you really think the Canadian governement only spends $100 to issue a passport? what does a gun permit actually cost? several thousand I would guess!

And the big deal about needing passports....I thought FTA and then NAFTA were supposed to facilitate the free & easy movement of goods, services and people.

Ben
"What else could I do? I had no trade so I became a peddler" - Lazarus Greenberg 1915

[shoplineca]

Ben
There are a number of items that the US has forced tarrifs on us contrary to NAFTA that NAFTA has ruled in Canada's favour and the US has appealed and lost.

Some of those matters are now before the GATT who have ruled in our favour again but the US is appealing.

NAFTA has never been used, it has been misused and abused.

I was a consultant to NAFTA. My best friend just left the NAFTA Secretariat where he was Deputy Secretary (he actually started the Secretariat's office). During the final negotiations, I flew back to Ottawa from Washington with Simon Reisman who was our principle negotiator and we spoke at great length (he was on the Board of Directors for my parent companty that I worked for).

The whole deal was going to die and Ben Mulroney sent in Pat Carney at the last minute and she made hundreds of concessions to the US just to get the deal through as Mulroney would have faced an immediate loss of power had it not gone through and an election would have been forced on them.

In principal, North America needs a trade treaty however we shouldnt look at NAFTA as something to toss out, rather think of it as the first draft from which we can sit at the table again and make improvements to it, to protect North Amerrica NOT FROM each other, as we are presently using it, but to protect North America from Asia and Europe.

Malcolm

[recped]

Malcolm

I thought FTA and then NAFTA were supposed to facilitate the free & easy movement of goods, services and people.

You didn't have your sarcasm radar turned on!

What I really like is the daily complaining from the USA about how much they are being hurt by FTA/NAFTA. Mexico doesn't like it, the USA doesn't like it and Canada doesn't like it....why do we have it then? (or are one or more of the parties not being totally honest?).

Ben
"What else could I do? I had no trade so I became a peddler" - Lazarus Greenberg 1915

[shoplineca]

Are you asking if I trust any of the 3 governments? If I feel that there is honesty amongst politicians anywhere?

The saying "the only good politician, is a dead politician" pretty well sums it up for me I think.

I just completed my 85 year old mother's income tax return. Had it not been for McGuinty's tax for recovery of the OHIP premium, my mother would have had to pay $37.

However McGuinty can take pleasure in getting an extra $150 from an 85 year old widow who may not be able to afford living in her same apartment this year because of his cash grab.

Give a politician power and it goes straight to his pocket!

Malcolm