how can we organize a sellers strike?

having just lost nearly $300 in a buyer protection case, in which we did nothing wrong (item tracking was uploaded, and item is still in transit), I'm hoping we can organize a sellers strike. The only way to punish ebay and end the slant towards buyers, is to stop listing on this site. Etsy, amazon, there are other options... Anyone?

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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

obviously i expect them to wait. the item is tracked and insured. 85 days because the buyer is too cheap to pay for faster shipping. how is this my problem? what a ridiculous response. whos trolling here?

 

You have been trolled by the buyer who is well aware that when item does not arrive within 45 days, they can ask eBay for refund, and eBay *will* comply to that by taking momey from you. I repeat: don't ever ship anything by SURFACE MAIL. You're pretty much letting the buyer to troll you by offering that option. These sales are NOT worth having. If the buyer is truly serious about buying that item off you, they WILL pay for airmail. Period. Go read the ebay seller/buyer protection policies and save yourself future finanfial losses/headaches.

Message 21 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?


@louiezlane wrote:

85 days because the buyer is cheap. the buyer decided to opt for the cheapest shipping available. come on


Sounds like you used Surface Mail.....rookie mistake, experienced sellers pretty much never use Surface unless it's to the USA or a buyer they know.

 

It seems you offer Surface Mail for overseas, and now you fault the buyer for choosing it, one of the listings I looked at ONLY offers Surface, would you blame the buyer of that item for being "cheap" when that's the only method you offer?

 

Even on that item, the amount you are charging for Surface is ridiculous, it's probably double what it could be sent for via Small Packet Air.

 

 

 

 

 



"What else could I do? I had no trade so I became a peddler" - Lazarus Greenberg 1915
- answering Trolls is voluntary, my policy is not to participate.
Message 22 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?


@louiezlane wrote:

85 days because the buyer is cheap. the buyer decided to opt for the cheapest shipping available. come on


With all due respect, we're now getting to the crux of the problem.  I would never, ever, offer cheapest international shipping to international buyers for something worth $300.00.  I'm sorry to say that the choice you made when listing the item was what produced this result.  This is something though that you can easily avoid next time that won't require a strike. 

 

Had you indicated shipping via Expedited Parcel or Tracked Packet only, you would very likely not have had this problem.  For one thing, a buyer in Russia may not have purchased the item, and if they had, it likely would have gotten there safely within a reasonable time. 

 

For the future, it's a really good idea not to offer your buyers several levels of shipping -- they will choose the cheapest every time and it will cost you money, as you've discovered.  You should choose the shipping option that you are comfortable with, or upgrade when shipping to your buyers (yes, it may cost you another $20, but that would have been better than a $300 loss).  This is a problem with a clear solution that you can control through careful management of shipping options. 

Message 23 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?


@louiezlane wrote:

obviously i expect them to wait. the item is tracked and insured. 85 days because the buyer is too cheap to pay for faster shipping. how is this my problem? what a ridiculous response. whos trolling here?


I took a look at one of your listings at random, to see where the shipping issues arise.  On that item, listed at $220.00, I input Germany as the shipping destination and got $91.15 via international surface shipping!  Not only is that an outrageously high shipping cost, but it will almost certainly get you into trouble with long transit time and/or breakage issues (more handling = more risk of breakage).  

 

If you shipped the same article by Expedited Parcel (air service with delivery confirmation), provided the weight is below 2kg, you'd probably get away with a shipping cost of around $50.  Now, if you're really interested in attracting international sales, you could list the air shipping cost a few dollars below the actual cost, and chip in the remainder yourself.  It might take only one additional sale every few months to cover the extra cost of the shipping "upgrades".

 

You're being given some decent advice on this thread -- particularly if you're selling breakables, you need to retool your shipping strategy or you'll find yourself continually losing money on eBay claims.   

Message 24 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?



I totally agree with using only Air shipping for international packages, but in the case of Russia, even Small Packet Air seems to take an eternity. Packages I shipped this spring by Small Packet Air took 3 1/2 months to arrive, over 100 days. Luckily, the buyers patiently waited and the packages eventually showed up. But it's still very frustrating and I stopped shipping to Russia. I'm actually surprised the poster's surface package is already in Russia after 85 days and is soon to be delivered, as stated. Maybe expedited or tracked would be faster? Not sure, but would hope so, Very sad because I find Russian buyers so very friendly, honest and knowledgable.


Message 25 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

The service to Russia is better than it was last Winter/Spring, it's still slow just not as slow. They cleared some of the giant backlog in customs.

 

 

 

 



"What else could I do? I had no trade so I became a peddler" - Lazarus Greenberg 1915
- answering Trolls is voluntary, my policy is not to participate.
Message 26 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

"you'd probably get away with a shipping cost of around $50"

 

do you have intelligent advice to offer, or are you just pulling numbers out of the air? we didn't set the $91 price, CANADA POST does!

Show me where you can find international air mail from Canada Post for that item for $50, please.

Message 27 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?


@rose-dee wrote:

@louiezlane wrote:

85 days because the buyer is cheap. the buyer decided to opt for the cheapest shipping available. come on


With all due respect, we're now getting to the crux of the problem.  I would never, ever, offer cheapest international shipping to international buyers for something worth $300.00.  I'm sorry to say that the choice you made when listing the item was what produced this result.  This is something though that you can easily avoid next time that won't require a strike. 

 

Had you indicated shipping via Expedited Parcel or Tracked Packet only, you would very likely not have had this problem.  For one thing, a buyer in Russia may not have purchased the item, and if they had, it likely would have gotten there safely within a reasonable time. 

 

For the future, it's a really good idea not to offer your buyers several levels of shipping -- they will choose the cheapest every time and it will cost you money, as you've discovered.  You should choose the shipping option that you are comfortable with, or upgrade when shipping to your buyers (yes, it may cost you another $20, but that would have been better than a $300 loss).  This is a problem with a clear solution that you can control through careful management of shipping options. 


Russia does not Tracked Packet as an available option nor Xpresspost. (I assume that you mean Xpresspost when you mention Expedited Parcel which is only available for USA and Canada.)

 

That leaves International Parcel Air or Surface which have insurance and Small Packet Air or Surface without insurance (assuming the weight is under 2 kg).

Message 28 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

...85 days because the buyer is too cheap to pay for faster shipping. how is this my problem?

 

It is your problem because you offered an inexpensive shipping option in your listing.

 

What does this have to do with the buyer being cheap ?  You offered the option, they accepted that option. 

 

Simple solution, don't offer surface shipping overseas.

 

Avoid the frustration & eliminate that option in your listings.

 

Did you ever consider sending the buyer the Tracking # & assuring them that the package was on its way ?

 

The buyer would be relieved as the package could be traced on its journey to Russia.

 

You have received sound advice from the regulars.

 

Best to lose the edge in your posts.

 

Your credibility is probably already in question.

 

I have been here for years, but time to time i have required some advice.

 

A simple thank you, no longer offering surface is probably my best option, will garner you some respect.

Message 29 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?


@louiezlane wrote:

"you'd probably get away with a shipping cost of around $50"

 

do you have intelligent advice to offer, or are you just pulling numbers out of the air? we didn't set the $91 price, CANADA POST does!

Show me where you can find international air mail from Canada Post for that item for $50, please.


What Canada Post shipping service did you use? International Parcel Air? Just curious. What was the weight of the item? At $91 it seems to be about 2 kg for International Parcel Air when I checked the Canada Post web site Find-A-Rate calculator. Did you also get additional insurance from Canada Post to cover the $300 value?

 

You also mentioned that you have tracking on the package. The Canada Post web site does not mention that tracking or delivery confirmation is available for International Parcel Air or Surface. At least I cannot find a reference to this. Canada Post has changed their web site and it is so hard to find things now.

 

eBay seller cumos55 has used International Parcel Surface when sending heavy books to Eastern Europe and mentioned that he had tracking.

 

Just curious about what International Parcel Air offers for tracking and delivery confirmation..

 

If the package never shows delivery confirmation, you may be able to collect on insurance. Did you get additional insurance?

Message 30 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

Thanx Rose, i didn't know tracking was not available to Russia.

 

The OP mentioned that the package had tracking & was shown to have arrived in Russia.

 

Now I.m confused.

 

Might be best for the OP to post the tracking # so we can see for ourselves.

 

 

Message 31 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

i should be able to offer surface for overseas. the buyer should be able to wait, instead ebay forces them to open a case after 45 days, or not at all.

 

of course we uploaded the tracking number, and we also emailed the same to the buyer. that kind of goes without saying.

 

i'm open to good advice, but not ridiculous garbage from the "regulars" on the forums (who are probably paid by ebay anyway).

 

not offering ground service, with the high cost of Canada Post shipping, is really really bad advice, but typical of what i'd expect from the "regulars".

 

don't have an "egde", just very low on patience with ebay, and the same small group of posters on here who offer really horrible advice. really frustrating. maybe go troll on another feed with ignorant comments and quips, and more bad advice. that's really all the "regulars" are good for.

 

 

Message 32 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

you may be able to collect on insurance.

 

You beat me to it Poco.

 

That is what i was thinking.

 

Just curious about what International Parcel Air offers for tracking and delivery confirmation.

 

Best for the OP to post that information.

 

This would eliminate all the confusion.

Message 33 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

we used canada post international surface.

 

yes we bought extra insurance, but heres the problem;

 

if the item eventually does show delivered, canada post will not pay the claim, and ebay will not reverse the refund. so the package will probably arrive before the canada post investigation concludes, but too late to appeal the buyer protection case. thus, we are out the $300. the advice on this feed has been really bad. claiming ficticious amounts for shipping as rose did is a bit ridiculous. we bought tracking, we bought extra insurance, and both will just end up being more money were out.

Message 34 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

... the advice on this thread has been really bad.

 

Then why keep posting ?

 

If you are not receptive to the regulars, so called bad advice then it is probably best for you to post your concern elsewhere.

 

Message 35 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

if the item does show delivered, canada post will not pay the claim, and ebay will not reverse the refund. so the package will probably arrive before the canada post concludes, but too late to appeal the buyer protection case. thus, we are out the $300.

 

Oh well.

 

BTW, How was everyones thanksgiving ?

 

Message 36 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?


@louiezlane wrote:

we used canada post international surface.

 

yes we bought extra insurance, but heres the problem;

 

if the item eventually does show delivered, canada post will not pay the claim, and ebay will not reverse the refund. so the package will probably arrive before the canada post investigation concludes, but too late to appeal the buyer protection case. thus, we are out the $300. the advice on this feed has been really bad. claiming ficticious amounts for shipping as rose did is a bit ridiculous. we bought tracking, we bought extra insurance, and both will just end up being more money were out.


It would be nice if there was an option to override the 45 day PayPal claim window to 60 or 90 days if both parties agree to the extended time frame when paying. It would make shipping some items overseas more cost effective for both buyer and seller. I would think that this would not be so difficult to implement.

 

As for insurance, as you pointed out, if it ever shows delivered you lose.

 

As others have mentioned, shipping by surface overseas is a risk since delivery time will exceed the PayPal buyer protection of 45 days. I tried Small Packet Surface 3-4 times with lower cost to help buyers with lower shipping cost. I was fortunate that the buyers waited and was also fortunate that the items arrived in 42 days at most. Shipping surface made me too nervous so I do not offer it anymore. The other issue is that the buyers rated me poorly on shipping time DSR (3's) a couple times I shipped Small Packet surface. I did not think that was fair.

 

 

Message 37 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?


@louiezlane wrote:

we used canada post international surface.

yes we bought extra insurance, but heres the problem;

if the item eventually does show delivered, canada post will not pay the claim, and ebay will not reverse the refund. so the package will probably arrive before the canada post investigation concludes, but too late to appeal the buyer protection case. thus, we are out the $300. the advice on this feed has been really bad. claiming ficticious amounts for shipping as rose did is a bit ridiculous. we bought tracking, we bought extra insurance, and both will just end up being more money were out.


You may not actually end up being out the $300 -- see if your buyer is honest enough to let you know when the parcel arrives and to repay you.  Many sellers have mentioned on these boards how good Russian buyers are to deal with.  

 

The amounts for shipping I mentioned aren't fictitious.  Small Packet Air is what I use to ship to Russia (for anything under 2kg), and it is around $50 - $55 for a parcel of about 1.5kg.  Delivery times now seem to be tolerably good, probably for the reason 'recped' mentioned.  I purchase 3rd party insurance coverage for that service.  I do stand corrected by 'poco'  though -- Expedited Parcel does not go to Russia.  I was actually thinking in terms of shipping breakables such as your items to places such as Germany, where a $90 charge for international surface shipping makes no sense.  To Russia - Priority Worldwide is the "premium" service with tracking, delivery confirmation and insurance, at about $90 - $95 for a parcel of about 1.5kg.  Is this the service you used?  

 

As far as I can tell from the Canada Post site, International Parcel Air doesn't include any delivery confirmation.  I don't use surface international at all, so I don't know what the standards are for that service.  In any event, even if surface service has tracking, you're taking a risk that the item won't arrive before the 45 day claim period, as happened here. 

 

The bottom line is that there are some items that are not worth shipping to certain places in the world.  The heavier and more expensive the item, the more problematic it will be to places like Russia.  Add breakability to the mix and you really do have a recipe for problems. 

 

By the way, I'm not sure where you get the idea that I (or any of the "regulars" here) are paid by eBay.  I actually find that amusing, considering how critical I've been of eBay's policies at times.  We're just ordinary sellers trying to make a go of it on this site.  

 

 

Message 38 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?

i'm open to good advice, but not ridiculous garbage from the "regulars" on the forums (who are probably paid by ebay anyway).

 

Wow, way to insult the nice people who had been trying to help you out and giving you advice. To me, all the advices posted here are good advices, so it seems your definition of "good advice" would be "Yeah I agree with you let's organize a strike!!!!!!!!!" Pfft.

 

I can assure you that I'm not paid by eBay, and I'm certain that most of the people who responded to this thread are not paid by eBay to give you sound advice either. Why don't you open your mind and ears and listen to others? If you want to be successful, you need to stop being so stubborn and tunnel-visioned. Selling on eBay is not something for everybody, and it seems this selling venue is not for you. Registering on eBay means you agree to its selling terms and conditions. If you don't like it, find a different venue. It's that simple.

Message 39 of 42
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Re: how can we organize a sellers strike?


@louiezlane wrote:

"you'd probably get away with a shipping cost of around $50"

 

do you have intelligent advice to offer, or are you just pulling numbers out of the air? we didn't set the $91 price, CANADA POST does!

Show me where you can find international air mail from Canada Post for that item for $50, please.


Here are your options for Germany (the country I entered as the international destination for your listing I checked) for a 30x30x15cm parcel weighing 1.5kg: 

 

Small Packet Int'l Air:   $44.66

Tracked Packet (with all the bells and whistles):  $64.59

 

The reason so many sellers love Small Packet Int'l Air is that it allows total combined parcel measurements of 90cm, which can accommodate a lot of different options, and has a 2kg maximum.  It used to have insurance, but that's been discontinued, so you can either use 3rd party insurance or self-insure.  There is no tracking but it's reliably fast. 

 

Tracked Packet would work well for your expensive, breakable items, and you could offer it for not much more than $50 (using your available shipping discount and absorbing the extra cost yourself on high-priced items to attract more sales).  It's not available to all countries, but probably the ones you'd be safest shipping to in any event.  There were some issues about allowable dimensions when it was first introduced, but I think those glitches have been (finally) fixed. 

 

And for the $91.15 you have shown for international surface shipping to Germany in that particular item, you could afford to offer Xpresspost to Europe and other international destinations for $82.96.  In addition, there is a significant discount on Xpresspost if you use online labelling.  I believe it is available to many more countries than Tracked Packet, although not Russia.  

 

So I still don't understand why a china bowl and lid would cost $91.15 to ship to Germany by surface, unless it's very, very heavy or you're using a box that's over the combined 90cm total in dimensions. 

 

If you can accept some advice, which I offer only to help, if I were selling the types of items you currently have listed -- fine china, etc. -- I'd use Small Packet International Air without insurance for items under about $75; Small Packet Air with 3rd party insurance for items between $75 and $150; and either Tracked Packet or Xpresspost for higher-value items (and only Xpresspost for anything over $250, with signature confirmation).  

 

For all of these, I'd restrict my ship-to destinations based on a evaluation of risk in line with my own level of comfort. Some sellers have more tolerance for risk, or a higher volume that can absorb losses fairly easily.  Your risk is of course also associated with the value and type of item you're shipping, not just the destination.  Shipping $10 a piece collectible postcards or DVDs is a snap compared to $300 pieces of collectible china.  If you're selling high-value breakables, you should carefully look at how to minimize the obvious areas of risk by developing shipping strategies attuned to your particular items.  And as you've discovered, buying insurance will not be enough to avoid loss in some cases.  

 

Your item category presents challenges, but can be managed.  You started by railing against eBay for something that many of us felt was an avoidable issue.  There is useful information from the posters here if you're willing to look at it.  

 

 

 

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