Fraud protection?
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01-16-2014 07:02 PM
Hi
I'm interested in selling some of my stuff on Ebay.
But I've heard that some buyers fraudulently claim that they haven't received the item or that there was nothing in the box when they've receive their package.
My question is, is there a way to protect myself against these kind of fraud?
Thanks!
Fraud protection?

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01-16-2014 07:25 PM
It depends on what items you are selling.
As for me I sell items that weigh heavier which require Expedited or XpressPost with tracking number, some with tracked packets (only up to 1kg).
It is now getting too expensive to ship them to International countries, around $45.00 or higher depening on weigh. Of course I am losing possible many potential buyers if I have to use Tracked Packet or XpressPost to ship my items to them.
I am puzzled as to why Canada Post don't offer tracking number for $1.00 like USPS does. I have small packets with actual stamps for $1.10 plus $1.00 for a tracking number which I have receved this month. If USPS can offer that service, so why can't Canada Post do the same?
I am sure that many of us sellers in Canada would be happy to pay extra for tracking number to ship our items, it would be a good business.
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01-16-2014 09:35 PM
Just purchase loss insurance from Canad Post - it's cheap. If a buyer claims that he did not receive the item - after Canada Post investigates, you get your money back, plus the postal costs.
Old enough to know better. Young enough to do it again. Crazy enough to try
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01-16-2014 10:24 PM
You can protect yourself against loss in three ways, but before you choose which way you have to understand your own limits and also how likely fraud is.
I have been selling everything from cast iron wood stoves to discount postage to vintage sf paperbacks to rare postage stamps by mail for some 30-odd years.
In my experience, the chances of damage in the mail is very low, providing you package carefully. Remember that your package will be handled mechanically for the most part and your package may drop two feet from one conveyor belt to the next and have a 50 lb parcel drop on top of it. Package accordingly.
Then the postie will take all the mail for your customer's address and fold the largest item around everything else and hold it all together with a rubber band. So if it shouldn't be folded, use a stiffener that can't be folded.Package accordingly.
The mail may be slow but it does go through. Ship only to Paypal addresses, and if there is a difference between the eBay and the PP addresses, make sure the PP one is correct. Coverage is to PP addresses.
There are, in my experience, more 'loss' or 'not recieved' claims from eBay than anywhere else. But they are still very few.
So paying for 'insurance' against loss or damage in transit may be counter-productive.
Some sellers use Canada Post (or couriers) which provide insurance and /or tracking and/or Delivery Confirmation for a fee.
These are different things.
Insurance repays you if your parcel is damaged or lost. If you have already refunded your customer and the "tracking' later shows the parcel delivered (late but delivered), insurance will not pay you.
Tracking follows and records every step of the way. It is expensive and unnecessary because what Paypal needs to mediate a Dispute is
Delivery Confirmation, which is cheaper. But again, you may lose a Dispute due to late delivery and later lose out on insurance because the parcel is delivered.
Most people are honest, and if you ask, your customer may refund the refund. If she doesn't , she may still feel guilty about it.
And there is third party insurance: buying either one-off insurance on parcels from a company like shipsurance or an annual contract from a specialty insurer like Hugh Wood International. Both can be cheaper than postal or courier insurance. These do not to my knowledge include tracking.
And then there is that old favourite: Cookie Jar Insurance.
Especially for those of us who sell low priced items, Cookie Jar Insurance just means adding a few pennies, rarely more than a dime, to every asking price and putting those virtual pennies in a virtual cookie jar. They are premiums on self-insurance.
When a buyer complains, the seller pays out from his Cookie Jar (or from his third party insurer or from his postal insurance claim) and the buyer is made whole.
Tracking and Delivery Confirmation are unnecessary because the buyer never goes to Paypal.
And it is PP that needs to know that the parcel has or has not been delivered before they can pay out.
Just to make things clearer or not: some categories are low fraud and the lunatic fringe is small. But if you are dealing with some demographics (check for the prevalence of backwards baseball caps) are a mixture of entitled and dishonest. Also dumber than they think they are.
If you are selling sportscards, coins, video games, any electronics or jewellry, you are going to have many more scammers than I see in my rather staid selling categories.
Well, we may not have parted on best o' terms. I realize certain words were exchanged. Also, certain... bullets. -- Captain Malcolm Reynolds
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01-17-2014 06:26 PM
@femmefan1946 wrote:
'
".....Insurance repays you if your parcel is damaged or lost. If you have already refunded your customer and the "tracking' later shows the parcel delivered (late but delivered), insurance will not pay you......"
Actually Femme - they will. If you purchase loss insurance from Canada Post and a buyer claims they did not recieve the item. Canada Post will do an investigation and if the buyer still claims that the item was not reiveved they will refund the item cost and postage to the seller - even if the tracking number shows it was delivered (somewhere). If you think about this - that means if you post an item over the PayPal limit of $250.00 or what ever it is - you don't have to spend the extra money for Express Post and a signature to the USA.That's PayPal rules - not Canada Posts.
As far as late delivery goes - Canada Post will not pay out for Expedited or Express But they will for Priority. They will refund the cost and the delivery fees if it is delivered late.
Old enough to know better. Young enough to do it again. Crazy enough to try
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01-17-2014 07:57 PM
@rosscd57 wrote:
Actually Femme - they will. If you purchase loss insurance from Canada Post and a buyer claims they did not recieve the item. Canada Post will do an investigation and if the buyer still claims that the item was not reiveved they will refund the item cost and postage to the seller - even if the tracking number shows it was delivered (somewhere). If you think about this - that means if you post an item over the PayPal limit of $250.00 or what ever it is - you don't have to spend the extra money for Express Post and a signature to the USA.That's PayPal rules - not Canada Posts.
As far as late delivery goes - Canada Post will not pay out for Expedited or Express But they will for Priority. They will refund the cost and the delivery fees if it is delivered late.
I believe Canada Post will pay out on Xpresspost parcels that are not delivered within the guaranteed time. Working out the guaranteed delivery date takes a bit of careful checking (using CP's delivery standard tables), but they will reimburse the seller where the delivery is beyond the noted standard.
There have been a couple of posters who have reported getting payments in the last week or two on Xpresspost items due to late delivery.
With respect to the Canada Post investigation on claims of non-delivery, are you referring to claims made by Canadian purchasers, or are you certain this also applies to US and international as well? If it doesn't, then signature confirmation of delivery would still be required for US and international parcels in order to preserve the Paypal seller coverage. I would think it might be difficult for CP to conduct an investigation involving another country's postal system, and/or a resident of another country. Have you had this occur with a US or overseas buyer?
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01-17-2014 08:38 PM
Yes I have - he lived in California and I believe he legitimately did not recieve the item. I refunded his money at the 35 day mark - a number that the both of us had agreed to. I had fully insured the item - a vintage radio.
Canada Post asked me for his telephone number which I got from him. When I told him they wanted to call him - he had no objection. Actually if he did not give me his phone number, I was prepared to get it through eBay. They called him - he confirmed he did not get it and they refunded me $$360.00 plus postage.
The package was likely delivered to the wrong address. Whether or not they spoke to USPS - I don't know.
Since this happened - I stopped using Express Post with signature because the increased costs make for a tougher sale in the US - it almost doubles the cost. I just use Expedited and insure everything to the max.
In Canada of course, with Expedited Post, all it costs is an extra buck for signature and a buck per hundered dollars of sale price over the initial $100.00 that is included.
Old enough to know better. Young enough to do it again. Crazy enough to try
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01-18-2014 01:32 AM
In Canada of course, with Expedited Post, all it costs is an extra buck for signature and a buck per hundered dollars of sale price over the initial $100.00 that is included.
You must be getting a special deal as it is $1.50 for signature confirmation and $2.05 for each extra hundred for delivery within Canada. But that is still a better deal than using Xpresspost or a courier.
Keep in mind that if you use insurance and you have too many claims, it is quite possible that they will not cover you any longer...especially if those claims are for higher priced items.
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01-18-2014 12:16 PM
You are right on the signature fee - but I'm pretty sure it is only $1.00 per $100.00 of value. I went on to the Canada Post web site and could not fine the correct amount - it does not seem to be available - weird.
Anyone else know for sure - I buy it all the time and |'m sure it is not $2.00.
Old enough to know better. Young enough to do it again. Crazy enough to try
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01-18-2014 01:08 PM
"$2.05 for each extra hundred for delivery within Canada."
That is correct.
It explains why self-insurance (cookie jar insurance) is becoming a new standard in Canada.
Why pay Canada Post 2% insurance when the rate of loss is well below 1%?

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01-18-2014 01:12 PM
From Canada Post calculator:
*Coverage Details: Up to $100.00 included. Maximum $1,000.00 @ $2.05 per $100.00.

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01-18-2014 03:00 PM
I believe that it just went up to $2.05 this month but even before that was more than $1.
According to the following page, it was $1.80 in 2012.
https://www.canadapost.ca/cpo/mc/business/productsservices/shipping/ratescoming2012.jsf
- The price for Domestic additional Coverage (Insurance) for loss or damage increased $0.50 in 2012, from $1.30 to $1.80 per $100.00 of coverage.
- The USA/International additional Coverage (Insurance) for loss or damage increased $0.50 in 2012, from $1.50 to $2.00 per $100 of coverage.
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01-18-2014 03:48 PM
"According to the following page, it was $1.80 in 2012."
Yes, and $1.95 in 2013

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01-18-2014 04:36 PM
@pjcdn2005 wrote:Keep in mind that if you use insurance and you have too many claims, it is quite possible that they will not cover you any longer...especially if those claims are for higher priced items.
So, the faster delivery time aside, I suppose the question is whether Xpresspost USA and international is worth it for the signature confirmation/seller protection (in Paypal claims) where higher-priced items are concerned? It seems from what you're saying that it might be. I'd be interested to hear sellers' views on this.
Never having had to deal with an Xpresspost INR claim (thank goodness), I can't say for certain, but I would think that Paypal wouldn't penalize the seller for too many claims in the way CP would, since the Paypal seller protection isn't insurance coverage per se. I hope I never have to find out...
I only use Xpresspost for more expensive items (ca. $200+) to buyers I know will either want or appreciate the faster delivery (such as to west coast states in the US from here in Nova Scotia). For me, the signature confirmation and step-by-step tracking are extra features, not necessities, and in those situations I usually "upgrade" my buyers' shipping from Expedited to Xpresspost as a courtesy.
Incidentally, I don't understand why the actual signature isn't available online for Xpresspost - you get the name of the party who signed, but not a viewable signature. I assume that if you call the phone # indicated by CP, they will email or mail you the signature?

