HS Codes? For Real???

[lorraine_carol]

I can not believe this is a requirement, including HS codes. I sell mainly clothing. I don' t know how precise these codes have to be but for a seller to include the EXACT code is impossible. There are several hundreds of textile codes and times that by another hundred for various combinations; cotton waste (including yarn waste etc.) cotton, carded or combed cotton sewing thread, retail packed or not cotton yarn (not sewing thread) nu 85% cot no retail cotton yarn (not sewing thread) un 85% cot no retail woven cotton fabrics, nu 85% cot, wt n/ov 200 g/m2 woven cotton fabrics, nu 85% cot, wt ov 200 g/m2 woven cotton fab, un 85% cot, mmfmix, n/ov 200g/m2 Wool is a joke having to know what animal the wool came from along with if carded, combed etc. I suspect cross-border selling/buying will be extinct. Happy Day! Lorraine

[rose-dee]

Oh yes.  This is the newest headache.  I'm in a similar boat, with vintage and reproduction garments of all sorts of textiles, for women, men and children. 

I've just printed out 10 pages of the code listings from Industry Canada and highlighted everything that will likely apply to what I sell -- it looks like potentially 60 to 70 different codes. 

[i*m-still-here]

I really believe that the posters to this board are WAY over-thinking these HS codes.

I seriously doubt that anyone will ever look at them, and in the very unlikely event that someone does take a look and the code is wrong..............  (a very very very very easy mistake to make)........

What's the worst that could possibly happen?

Someone messed up and plugged the wrong code::  Quick:  Call the HS Code Police?  NOT.

(Really, just do your best and don't waste so much energy on it.)

[pjcdn2005]

If an item is going to be assessed duty and taxes then I'm sure that some one will look at the code but it's unlikely that they will compare it to what is in the package. Even if they did, they might change the assessed amount but that is probably all they would do.  If the package is under the duty/tax threshold for that country, I doubt they will even look at the number.

I think that as long as you are declaring clothing as clothing the other nuances probably don't matter that much.If I sold clothing I might figure out my top 5 or top 10 HS codes and use those in most cases. As I'm said...all you can do is your best..there's no point in stressing about it. 🙂

[twicereadbooks]

For those who are selling vintage or pre-owned clothing:

All vintage or previously owned clothing has one HS code - 630900.  Worn shoes also use this code.  This should be your HS code of choice.  You will find it in the Canada Post HS Code if you type in "Used Clothing".  If you choose antique or other, then there will be choices about garment type and fabric content.  It is not worth your bother to get into a head space where you are trying to separate out all the complexities that can be found in the Tariff Codes.  Leave that to the importers/exporters who are sending container loads of newly manufactured product.  Customs people do not really expect perfection on a small parcel containing one or a few items going to an individual.  If you guess incorrectly, you are probably not going to jail.

Remember that for country of origin, if it is not stated on what you are sending, then it can be presumed to be Canadian in origin if there is no evidence to the contrary.

[femmefan1946]

rose-dee:

You are being sensible again.

So is i'm not here.

This topic needs more hysteria, capital letters, and random threats. So far it's no fun at all.

[femmefan1946]

Lorraine - It's irrelevant for domestic sales and your US customers can import up to $200 US before their purchase will be assessed for tax.

[i*m-still-here]

The codes seem to be universal, but unless they are used universally it's highly unlikely that anyone will even give what a few Canadian eBay sellers pop into that slot a second glance.

In other words, the idea that a country would base the duty they charge on this number that a few Canadian ebay sellers pop into that slot might make us believe that there some reason for this extra work now required of us..............

However, in practice it's a long shot.  Room for error?  HUGE HUGE HUGE!

We could probably deal with a simple code from 1-10.................. or even just new vs used vs antique............... but this code they want us to put in there isn't something that any country should take seriously and use to collect duty.

[i*m-still-here]

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@i*m-still-here wrote:

We could probably deal with a simple code from 1-10.................. or even just new vs used vs antique............... but this code they want us to put in there isn't something that any country should take seriously and use to collect duty.

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I just want to correct that.............

The codes themselves are fine, but the odds that we'll get the codes wrong are way too high to be used as a reliable guide for countries to determine duty owing.

If this becomes the Universal Standard, "they" have to come up with a system that's practical and easy to use by all sellers.

For now, it's just extra work and shouldn't have been introduced without first organizing a reasonable way to locate proper codes.

The system as it is is obviously too cumbersome for ebay sellers.

[your_update_is_here]

I'm sticking with 3304300000.

That's the only code I'll be using. 

Let them send out the HS Code Marshalls if someone doesn't like it.

[pjcdn2005]

You just need the first 6 numbers.

Most of your items are under the maximum allowed for duty free imports but you might want to pay more attention when the item is higher priced. You don't want to use an HS code that will end up costing the buyer more in duty.

[rose-dee]

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@pjcdn2005 wrote:

.. you might want to pay more attention when the item is higher priced. You don't want to use an HS code that will end up costing the buyer more in duty.

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'pj' -- I agree with you, and I'm sure that's the main point with these codes, to streamline processing of taxable/dutiable items.  A random or generic code thoughtlessly plunked on an item going to the US could result in a buyer overpaying duty if the parcel is not actually opened and checked. 

I imagine the same is also possible even with a lower priced item that is not physically checked by a customs officer, i.e. an incorrect code could result in duty being levied where none was applicable.  This would obviously not make for a happy buyer -- even if the duty is refundable, the process of getting it refunded would be a big hassle for the buyer.  So I think sellers do need to pay some attention to stating appropriate HS codes. 

I am guessing that the principal reason for incorporating these codes on ordinary parcels is to ultimately make the entire Customs processing automated, with only an occasional "spot-check" by real people. 

My grievance isn't about the codes themselves, or the obligation to now include them, but the way it was suddenly sprung on everyone without notice or explanation.  Very poor and unprofessional of CP and/or eBay Canada.

[i*m-still-here]

Even though it seems that most of the posters here don't sell items over 100 years old some may.

There is no duty on antiques.

For those who sell antiques I just want to point out that there is a separate code for these items and no need to categorize further.

Makes our job a little easier.

9706.00.00				Antiques of an age exceeding one hundred years
9706.00.0020					Silverware
9706.00.0040					Furniture
9706.00.0060					Other

[vintagenorth]

Just wondering, if we in Canada have to use these HS codes, but if these are required  worldwide, then what about the US sellers. How come its just us here in Canada that need to add this info?

[i*m-still-here]

Good Question.

As far as I can tell it's only Canadian eBay sellers so far.

If it becomes a universal requirement they'll likely come up with a system even your great grandpa can use.

It's probably true that big companies all over the world selling brand new items sometimes use these codes, but I doubt that it's a requirement like it is with CPO.

[denim-2000]

Wow.

First the truly disgusting rip-off cash-grab of a program introduced as "GSP", and now this???

I am in awe. Instead of making it EASIER for sellers, eBay intentionally makes it excruciatingly painful. Now printing a 5 minute label takes 25. WAY. TO. GO. EBAY.

Let me put it this way: You effectively made me (and thousands of Canadians) stop buying from ANY American sellers using the GSP program (virtually all). Now you have effectively made me (and thousands of Canadians) stop using PayPal shipping. It's back to the post office for me. THANKS FOR THAT. VERY WISE MOVE.

The next one will be ditching your website altogether that has gone from being something wonderful 10 years ago to a total, dismal failure.

[rose-dee]

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@denim-2000 wrote:

First the truly disgusting rip-off cash-grab of a program introduced as "GSP", and now this???

I am in awe. Instead of making it EASIER for sellers, eBay intentionally makes it excruciatingly painful. Now printing a 5 minute label takes 25. WAY. TO. GO. EBAY.

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EBay was responsible for instituting the GSP, but eBay had nothing to do with the HS code requirement.  Canada Post implemented that change, and whether you buy your labels online or at the Post Office, you're going to have to have an HS code to go with any parcel going out of Canada. 

In fact, at Wednesday's board discussion, one of the eBay Canada staff members confirmed that they had no notice of it either.  Whether you believe that or not, they still weren't the responsible party.  Obviously Paypal did have notice, as they updated their labelling system overnight, to include the requirement for the HS code.  But Paypal/Pitney Bowes are simply doing what is required of them by Canada Post.

Underlying the requirement for an HS code is likely an eventual plan to automatic most, if not all, Customs processing.  In that sense there are probably international considerations driving this change.  After all, it's US Customs that will mainly benefit from faster processing of parcels coming from eBay Canada sellers.  And it isn't just eBay sellers.  This is sooner or later going to be the new normal for any sellers shipping parcels outside of Canada, so we need to get used to it. 

By the way, it doesn't need to take 25 minutes to print a label now.  Rather than looking up every individual item as you sell it, go to the Industry Canada website, to the page showing the major categories of manufactured items, click on a main category that will apply to you, and print out the detailed chart or charts that appear (you might have to go down another level to get to all the details).  Then go to the next main category, and do the same. 

Once you have your charts printed out, go through each chart once and highlight the codes that will apply to your items.  Keep the printouts handy when you're doing shipping labels.  Then you won't need to do a search by product type every time you need a code.  You'll find this is a much easier method than trying to build up your own list of appropriate codes one painful and frustrating search at a time.

I'll put up the link to the Industry Canada main page in the next post, as I didn't copy it before I started typing here. 

[rose-dee]

Here's the link to the main search page on the Industry Canada website:

http://www.ic.gc.ca/cgi-bin/sc_mrkti/cid/cid_e.cgi?func=start_search&search_type=by_product

Forget the search boxes at the top, and just go down the list of main categories (A through U) to find what applies to the items you usually sell.  You can probably eliminate the majority of these categories right off the bat (like "Live Animals"). 

One note: you'll find most computer-related products under "F - Products of the Chemical or Allied Industries", and most printed material, magazines, etc. under "J - Wood Pulp, Paper and Paper Articles".  

I hope this will be of some help.  It will probably be important -- if not immediately, then I suspect eventually, once this system is more universal -- to have the right code, to avoid your buyer over-paying duties/taxes, or having your parcels opened and inspected and/or returned. 

[denim-2000]

Thanks for the info, Rose.

I just wandered down to my local post office and asked about it. This is the response I got:

"Wow, it's already online? Yes, it will be mandatory but for only premium shipping services." She then went off to list three. I think it was international priority, expedited, etc. The other shipping options, will not require mandatory HS codes. I said that those won't have tracking though and she stated that the slow, tracked-package service does and won't require HS codes either.

By the way, she said there will be a $2 charge for the post office to look it up if you don't.

Fun times. I have not tried the slow shipping, tracked item through eBay but I suspect as with the horrendous GSP program, it will either be on everything or nothing at all.

-Richard

[rose-dee]

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@denim-2000 wrote:

I have not tried the slow shipping, tracked item through eBay but I suspect as with the horrendous GSP program, it will either be on everything or nothing at all.

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I've only used the tracked services since this came in, so I can't say for sure that Paypal won't ask for an HS code on Light/Small Packet, but I can't imagine it wouldn't be required for those labels as well, since there are a lot of relatively valuable, dutiable items that might still be shipped by those services (not everybody uses tracking). 

Your P.O. clerk may have been referring (for the moment) only to items actually brought to the P.O. for purchase of labels/postage, and mainly going to the US (where the duty-free personal import limit is $200). 

I'm just assuming it will be required everywhere sooner or later, so I've resigned myself to keep my HS code charts in a small binder next to the computer, since I do sell a variety of items.