eBay

pierrelebel · ‎08-19-2015

http://www.ecommercebytes.com/cab/abn/y15/m08/i19/s01

rose-dee · ‎08-20-2015

@73rhc wrote:
Huh?

Are you asking for a history refresher, or disagreeing with me on principle (i.e. just because it's me)?

I'm happy to respond, either way.

73rhc · ‎08-20-2015

It was more rhetorical than anything else. No offence but... I don't have the words!

momcqueen · ‎08-20-2015

I can use it in a sentence: 'Is it a correlation that I'm about to sail off the edge of the flat earth or causation because I'm not willing to question what I'm told is fact?'

pierrelebel · ‎08-20-2015

'A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It's a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it's because it's proven."

Jean Chretien.

momcqueen · ‎08-20-2015

I am... fighting the urge... to quote Donald Rumstead.....

momcqueen · ‎08-20-2015

Can't... fight it much....longer....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_are_known_knowns

rose-dee · ‎08-20-2015

Good heavens, Pierre, I can hear his voice now.

Where do you keep these things to pull out of a hat at the right moment?

I see an enormous filing cabinet, with fingers flying through the index, let's see... under "P" for "proof", cross-referenced under "J" for Jean, cross-referenced again under "C" for 'Chrétien', and cross-referenced under "L" for "Liberal party".

(I'm just hanging out here because it's too hot today for me to do any drawing, no air conditioning so my hands are sticking to the vellum as I work - useless!)

73rhc · ‎08-20-2015

I was thinking more like John Greene Chandler!

pjcdn2005 · ‎08-20-2015

In my opinion it isn't a valid conclusion without proof.

You lost me with the Christopher Columbus reference. Did everyone start believing him just because he said it was true or did he actually go out and prove his theories?

You're saying that they started the defect system to clear out smaller sellers so that the larger ones would have less competition?

What percentage of those small sellers sell collectibles and/or used items? How are they competition for retailers who sell brand new and current items?

Personally I don't think it is a big deal that a seller who has 400 sales in a 3 month period keeps their defects for 3 months versus a year. If you are selling 10 items/month; 120 items per year you could have a 4 percent defect rate before you lost your TRS because you need defects from 5 separate buyers. If someone is selling 150 items a month which is 1800/year should they also be allowed to have just defects from 5 different buyers in a year? That's less than .5%. 1800 sales a year isn't even a big seller. If that rule was really to get rid of small sellers so that the big boys could compete, the threshold would be a lot higher than 400 sales.

rose-dee · ‎08-20-2015

@mjwl2006 wrote:
Can't... fight it much....longer....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_are_known_knowns

OMG, the things we'd like to forget.

You watch, the mods will be here in a minute to spoil our fun and move us on.

OK, then, to get back to the subject at hand:

Definition of Happiness: "A feeling of pleasure, contentment or joy. Feeling something is right or has been done right. Fortunate".

Definition of Happiness: (per the Dalai Lama) -- “Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions.”

and: "If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion."

rose-dee · ‎08-20-2015

@pjcdn2005 wrote:
In my opinion it isn't a valid conclusion without proof.

Many perfectly valid conclusions are the result of deductions from facts, but many aren't. A proof is not the same as a conclusion. A proof is evidence that establishes a fact.

A conclusion is an extrapolation or deduction from facts, but more often from observations or assumptions which then leads to a rational argument or theory -- quite a different animal, and often just as valid. Many theories, conclusions, deductions and arguments were later proven to be true once sufficient facts were available, particularly in the field of science. (Too much philosophy for a hot day)

You lost me with the Christopher Columbus reference. Did everyone start believing him just because he said it was true or did he actually go out and prove his theories?

OK guys, here is the history refresher. Columbus was never recorded as claiming that the earth was round as a truth or a fact. He believed that it was logically round from his rational deductions, at least in part based on Copernicus' theories, and he ultimately validated the argument by obtaining facts and proof (i.e. sailing to the west without falling off the earth).

Many historians speculate that he may have had access to information beyond what was commonly thought to be available to his contemporaries, but there is no proof (i.e. facts, documents) that that is so, and Columbus himself actually recorded very little in this regard, remaining a rather shadowy historical figure.

pierrelebel · ‎08-20-2015

I feel like I am diagonally parked

in a parallel universe!

tobyshitzu · ‎08-20-2015

Counting defects for 3 months works both ways. They are compared with sales over 3 months too. So if one received a number of defects over a short period (say xmas shipping) they can be punished for their record where they wouldn't have been if dsrs and sales counted for 12 months. They don't "go poof' there are sellers who have gotten in trouble when sales fell and they didn't have the sales for 3 month evaluation, so dsrs over the past year came back into play.

The only sellers who get a "specal deal" with dsrs are actually the very small sellers where the 5 and 8 minimum for any consequence allow a much higher %

Of course the very large sellers get a special deal on fees.

If they wanted to get rid of any seller they'd just tell them they are finished. eg at one point years ago ebay decided they didnt want one of their largest "bargain" sellers and dumped them. ebay didnt want digital items and dumped all those sellers. Amzn didn't like selling Kindles at a loss while 3rd party sellers undercut them on profitable accessories, so they raised the fee to 45% to effectively dump them. Much easier ways to get rid of people then a dsr conspiracy

cumos55 · ‎08-20-2015

I feel like I am diagonally parked...in a parallel universe!

and just for some measure of logic and associated fun

If 10 cars are diagonally parked..... They are parked parallel to one another

If 10 cars are parked perpendicular to the curb.... They are parked parallel to one another

If 10 cars are parked ... parallel to the curb... they are parallel parked.

No one can escape being parked parallel to "something".

It is all the same universe..... or is there a parallel universe

cumos55 · ‎08-20-2015

Happiness is sales ... sales ...and ...more sales...

Happiness is creating happy buyers..

Happiness is waking up to a great new day

Happiness is knowing what ... not.. to do

Happiness is happiness..... creating more happiness.

Don't expect happiness..... create your own style of happiness

Understand the reality of eBay ..... and create happiness.. eBay will change... we will adjust

pjcdn2005 · ‎08-21-2015

My Columbus question was rhetorical so the history lesson wasn't necessary but you did prove my point. His 'conclusion' that the world was round was not proven because he told people that x + x has to mean Y. He went out to see for himself and found the proof.

I know that you are going to believe what you want and regardless of what else is posted here so there is no point of flogging this particular point. But imo there is not a conspiracy to get rid of the smaller sellers through DSR's or other ways. I don't deny that ebay has made many changes and many of them are not popular and some don't seem all that well thought out from my point of view but that doesn't mean that they are out to get 'us'.

pjcdn2005 · ‎08-21-2015

@pierrelebel wrote:
I feel like I am diagonally parked

in a parallel universe!

Indeed!

cumos55 · ‎08-21-2015

Selling on eBay is a unique experience.

Many come and many go.

Each of us knows what we want to sell on eBay, and how it shall be done.

Unfortunately many do not realize that success on eBay depends more on knowing

....what NOT to do...

and that is where small sellers have problems

I do suspect ` that eBay does look after its... good... small sellers..... Those sellers that create a pleasant selling experience...

rose-dee · ‎08-22-2015

@pjcdn2005 wrote:
My Columbus question was rhetorical so the history lesson wasn't necessary but you did prove my point. His 'conclusion' that the world was round was not proven because he told people that x + x has to mean Y. He went out to see for himself and found the proof.

I know that you are going to believe what you want and regardless of what else is posted here so there is no point of flogging this particular point. But imo there is not a conspiracy to get rid of the smaller sellers through DSR's or other ways. I don't deny that ebay has made many changes and many of them are not popular and some don't seem all that well thought out from my point of view but that doesn't mean that they are out to get 'us'.

My comments were posted because I see a lot of people who come to these boards with the attitude that a conclusion or theory can't have any validity unless it can be proven based on currently known facts. And a rational conclusion is certainly not the same as a conspiracy.

A conclusion doesn't have to be proven to be meaningful. Many meaningful and even important theories and conclusions, particularly in the sciences, but even in business, have been based on nothing but logical assumptions and observations. Sometimes those theories wait a very long time to be "proven", even though they work perfectly in day-to-day practice. This, in effect is what a "working theory" is.

I point out these things because I see them as alternative explanations worthy of consideration, that's it. I'm not as married to my conclusions as you might think. I have a number of "working theories", but they aren't opinions drawn from preconceived prejudices (like people who will always blame eBay for everything, regardless of the subject). I try to come to conclusions through an attempt to reconcile observations and logical assumptions.

If you'd rather not take the analogy of Columbus formulating a theory based on assumptions and observations (a theory impossible to prove in advance), then think about the A-bomb, a more modern example of a working theory based on very few facts but a whole lot of assumptions. Nobody knew for certain, even Oppenheimer himself, that the thing would actually work until it was proven by collecting facts afterward. But the conclusions/theories were reasonable.

Where eBay is concerned, I doubt we minions can ever hope to collect enough facts to prove anything with regard to steps and decisions this corporation takes. So proof, per se, will likely never be possible here. All we can do is make observations and draw logical conclusions. Some of those may be ultimately wrong, but the process -- including discussion -- can help to clarify matters for us sellers.

Lastly, I don't see eBay as being "out to get us" smaller sellers. I see it as a business decision made by eBay 2 or 3 years ago to focus on and court big retailers. They likely believed they'd make more money from dealing with a few hundred of the biggest professional retailers than having to deal with hordes of individual little sellers, and they were no doubt right -- in the short term.

How much more trouble is it to police, manage, oversee and satisfy millions upon millions of small sellers, the majority of whom sooner or later have a complaint or issue that must be dealt with?

Likely a lot of money was being spent on that effort, and many buyers/sales may have been lost a result of poor business practices on the part of such sellers. Much better to thin out the ranks and make money more quickly, and at less cost, from professionals who know what they were doing. It does make sense, from that point of view, to implement a system that will (automatically) keep the rabble in check and eject the worst offenders.

The trouble is that eBay, in its drive to make quick money for its shareholders, also opened the door to a lot of major fraudsters and professional snake oil sellers (witness the recently reported legal claim with respect to fakes on the site). Now, instead of a myriad of little problems, they have one big problem that has the potential of bringing eBay down a few notches, both in revenue and in public opinion.

So now the head of eBay CS is telling us that fairness will be the mantra for customer service disputes. I thought that was the whole idea in the first place? Why is he telling us that now? Perhaps because there has been a bigger problem than we realized -- the elephant in the room.

pierrelebel · ‎08-22-2015

"... people who will always blame eBay for everything,..."

You are absolutely correct.

The conversation on these boards is unfortunately often controlled by those people. Somehow there seem to be a need to blame when something goes wrong. eBay is the obvious easy target.

"My sales are down this month... it's eBay's fault"

"Few people look at my listings this week... it's eBay's fault"

"I received a few low DSR's yesterday... it's eBay's fault"

"The buyer claims the parcel did not arrive on time... OK let's blame that one on Canada Post or USPS"

"My competitors can list for half my prices... it's eBay's fault"

"Someone copied my description and images... it's eBay's fault"

"... it's eBay's fault ... it's eBay's fault ... it's eBay's fault ... it's eBay's fault ."

I miss the good old days when nobody blamed eBay: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKtlK7sn0JQ