eBay

raphael@ebay.com · ‎01-20-2016

Hello everyone,

Welcome to our weekly session. I'll be here on & off for most of the day.

I'll start by posting responses to a few posts from last week, those will be coming soon to stay tuned.

Here are the issues I'm currently tracking:

SYI: Form resets IS when switching currencies.
SYI: Form resets IS when trying to update handling cost
Hard block on non compliant images only on relist/sell similar
Missing Tracked Packet destinations
Sold items going into Unsold container in Turbo Lister
Safari browser SYI exhibiting erratic behaviour when trying to select text in description in Revise

merritt-motorcycle-salvage · ‎01-20-2016

mjwl2006... Even though I greatly appreciate it, I wouldn`t bother wasting your time. If the Save on Shipping message did in fact show up for international buyers in this case, it would not matter anyway because international buyers viewing on .com etc. can not purchase and pay for more than one item at a time anyway. No shopping cart / combined shipping outside of ebay.ca... list in CAD funds... it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the obvious.

izzame · ‎01-20-2016

Thank you for your response. I do respectfully disagree, all the buyer needs to do is look at the package, look at the postal mark (a bit more difficult with stamps) the date and time of shipping is there. Most sellers also have postal receipts which has all the info ebay needs and then some. Let's be honest, ebay wants this measurement, but with the least effort to the buyer and IT programmers. I didn't realize an extra box to click for the buyer was too much to expect. Especially in lieu of the potential position you are putting the sellers in. I'm just wondering out loud, are the postal systems aware that in essence, ebay is micromanaging their efficiency through the sellers/buyers and they will probably receive some backlash/complaints also.

momcqueen · ‎01-20-2016

When I take Small Packets Airmail to the postal counter, I receive a Proof of Shipment slip with time, date and bar code that matches the label printed via PayPal. Can that piece of paper be used to appeal a defect for lateness if it shows the item was ACCEPTED as SCANNED at the post office within my stated handling time?

Anonymous · ‎01-20-2016

List/sell an item that it "has issues" clearly noted.

Buyer SNAD's cites the same issues "as noted in listing" as reason for return request.

Ebay sides with buyer what justifies overruling seller terms then ?

lukey9 · ‎01-20-2016

If that is the case when you get a PO stamp with the date and the time on it that gives you the same info as tracking at no extra cost. If I had to use Tracking on each Parcel going to the US or Canada I would not be selling any thing at all buy I would nave a good record on the few items I sold. THe buyers whine and cry now about the price of shipping and if it was not for the high exchange in US dollar it would not be worth even selling any more

raphael@ebay.com · ‎01-20-2016

@thegainfullyunemployableresurrectionist wrote:

List/sell an item that it "has issues" clearly noted.

Buyer SNAD's cites the same issues "as noted in listing" as reason for return request.

Ebay sides with buyer what justifies overruling seller terms then ?

That case would probably have to be escalated but ultimately the seller should win that.

raphael@ebay.com · ‎01-20-2016

@lukey9 wrote:

If that is the case when you get a PO stamp with the date and the time on it that gives you the same info as tracking at no extra cost. If I had to use Tracking on each Parcel going to the US or Canada I would not be selling any thing at all buy I would nave a good record on the few items I sold. THe buyers whine and cry now about the price of shipping and if it was not for the high exchange in US dollar it would not be worth even selling any more

The difference with a PO stamp and tracking data is that the eBay systems can only read one.

I'm not disputing the validity of a PO stamp, but there is no way to upload that to eBay, and no way for eBay to be sure of its authenticity. On the contrary, tracking can be read electronically by our systems. Just explaining why one is an acceptable proof and not the other.

dutchman48 · ‎01-20-2016

Very general questions you can take upstairs to the powers to be:

why does Ebay not fix what needs to be fixed if it may cost them some lost revenue.

Why does Ebay not fix what needs to be fixed if it gives sellers less defects

It seems they spend all their time glorifying the useless fluff and useless changes that do nothing for sellers or buyers but tries to justy over paid employees.

These are serious questions and concerns, so please don't brush them off

dutchman48 · ‎01-20-2016

These will not go away in February!

dutchman48 · ‎01-20-2016

Raphael

You missed the question about ebay refunding return shipping money paid up front for international is no return is made. Free money for buyer unless Ebay returns it to the seller!!!!

izzame · ‎01-20-2016

Sorry, ebay makes a policy, then give the sellers the tools to comply. If ebay can't accept scans of postal receipts. Which again I can't understand as they can and insist on images for listing, a scan is an image. I know I can scan my postal receipt and send it to my neighbour or better yet the buyer, but not ebay.... come on.
So insisting on tracking to "cover" the seller so like others have said, no point in wasting the time listing as it won't sell, usually, and been there done that ..... that's a negative/won't fly. I also subsidized 50% of postage w/tracking still no sale. So, as ridiculous as this sounds, I should assume, come Feb. ebay will be putting in my Paypal account the tracked shipping portion amount for every item sold. Of course not but really thats what they are expecting of the seller. Just subsidize the shipping yourself as we already know it's too much to expect the buyer to pay the extra. See eBay is fully aware of the situation for Canadian sellers regarding shipping rates and has been aware for years. They know they can't out right make it a "rule" to ship with tracking (there would be no need for .ca) so it has become one of the stock answers: Well if you had used tracking"
Just wondering, is it even in ebay's vocbuary to sellers that is, WE CAN, THANKS AWESOME INPUT. Because all I keep seeing is ebay can't do this, can't do that, programmers would have to do this/that/the other thing, still working on that issue, excuses ...... some positiveness towards the sellers justified, numerous issues would be a refreshing welcome.

momcqueen · ‎01-20-2016

I beg to differ.

If photographs of an item that arrives damaged are authentic enough to decide a SNAD claim, why not then photos that demonstrate the proof of shipment?

izzame · ‎01-20-2016

Possibly, that could mean more work for ebay employees responding to influx of emails, may have to set up a specific dept. to only respond and verify. If it means more work or cost to eBay, most likely not happening. Better to put it on the sellers shoulders.

momcqueen · ‎01-20-2016

It would go to the same eBay call centre that handle all the other feedback/defect revisions.

izzame · ‎01-20-2016

Would that be the same call centre that I spent 4 hours one Sat. in July with? 2.5 hours and 2 CSRs to understand the problem(ship International, no one outside of Canada could purchase, referred them to emails were buyers even explained) 2 hours to try this, try that, talk to IT ect. said it was now fixed. Just about to end the 4 hours of frustration and another email through eBay, can't buy your item. Asked CSR if reading email said Yes, so I guess it isn't fixed after all. We will get back to you within 7 days....NOT Called back in Aug. same thing also mentioned more than 7 days have gone by. That CSR said all the right things, promised to get back within 5 days... still waiting. That dept, I feel so much better.

With the above experience, I'll probably give Canada Post themselves a shot at resolving or CP talking to ebay. I know that it won't take too much to get CP motivated if they have to start using their call centre employees taking ebay related calls.

raphael@ebay.com · ‎01-20-2016

@izzame wrote:
Sorry, ebay makes a policy, then give the sellers the tools to comply. If ebay can't accept scans of postal receipts. Which again I can't understand as they can and insist on images for listing, a scan is an image. I know I can scan my postal receipt and send it to my neighbour or better yet the buyer, but not ebay.... come on.
So insisting on tracking to "cover" the seller so like others have said, no point in wasting the time listing as it won't sell, usually, and been there done that ..... that's a negative/won't fly. I also subsidized 50% of postage w/tracking still no sale. So, as ridiculous as this sounds, I should assume, come Feb. ebay will be putting in my Paypal account the tracked shipping portion amount for every item sold. Of course not but really thats what they are expecting of the seller. Just subsidize the shipping yourself as we already know it's too much to expect the buyer to pay the extra. See eBay is fully aware of the situation for Canadian sellers regarding shipping rates and has been aware for years. They know they can't out right make it a "rule" to ship with tracking (there would be no need for .ca) so it has become one of the stock answers: Well if you had used tracking"
Just wondering, is it even in ebay's vocbuary to sellers that is, WE CAN, THANKS AWESOME INPUT. Because all I keep seeing is ebay can't do this, can't do that, programmers would have to do this/that/the other thing, still working on that issue, excuses ...... some positiveness towards the sellers justified, numerous issues would be a refreshing welcome.

Sorry but you are misreading me. I am not tooting the "if you had just used tracking" horn at all.

The thing that needs to be kept in mind is that there is no Canada-specific Standards program. If there was one, it would be totally possible to create a set of Canada-specific rules that take all the challenges of Canadian shipping into account. However, Canadian sellers are measured mainly under 2 programs: the Global program, under which all sellers in the world are measured, and the US program, designed for the domestic US seller. I'm not going to discuss the US program now, other than to say that the US program works perfectly well for the US seller. For the Global program, since it is impossible to build a set of rules that satisfy the specifics of every country and their shipping realities, was designed with padded targets when it comes to the OTS metric, specifically to accommodate for cross border trade. Granted, this isn't the same as implementing all the suggestions brought forth today, but it works, we have the data to prove it.

Another thing that has to be kept in mind is that the new program, even with its imperfect measurement of on time shipping, puts the vast majority of sellers far away from any risk of damage to their standards level. In fact, for good measure I have just looked at all of your dashboard previews before writing this, and literally no one is in danger of losing their current status on February 20, even on the US program where the targets are most stringent.

pjcdn2005 · ‎01-20-2016

@thegainfullyunemployableresurrectionist wrote:

List/sell an item that it "has issues" clearly noted.

Buyer SNAD's cites the same issues "as noted in listing" as reason for return request.

Ebay sides with buyer what justifies overruling seller terms then ?

Based on what I've read on other forums, the best thing is for a seller to phone customer service and ask them to look at the information in the listing so that they can see that the customer's nad reason was clearly in the description.Then ask them to close the return request. If you ask them to escalate or if you escalate the claim online, the majority of time a bot will rule in favour of the buyer and you will receive an unresolved claim mark against you.

Or, some sellers will accept the return and then fight the claim once they get the item back. Ebay will sometimes give the seller a courtesy refund for everything except the return shipping that they had to pay to the buyer.

I haven't had to do either of these things so I'm not giving you first hand info but the .com selling forums often had similar stories so you might want to ask them the best way to handle things.

izzame · ‎01-20-2016

Thank you for your reply as it does clarify the situation a little better. Can you comment on if ebay is looking at creating a Canada specific standards program in the future ?

pjcdn2005 · ‎01-20-2016

raphael@ebay.com wrote:
@musicyouneed wrote:
Thanks for bringing this up. As you know for a Canadian with low cost items, under $10, using tracking is just too expensive. Thanks for trying to get this resolved. I agree that the policy should be updated. I am sure I am not the only seller caught in this web. I personally think that question is measuring the postal system rather than me as a seller. I get the CD out the same or next day but have changed all of my listings to a 2 day handling. I'm not sure what ebay is trying to measure here???

Even if the buyers had a response to getting it on time as: Not applicable. That might help.
The tough part is for us to be able to detect these cases. Like you all we have is a buyer's stated shipping address. No other data point is reliable enough to make the right call every time. This is a huge reason why eBay is moving more and more to a model where tracking is the main data point, that's hard as rock when it comes to knowing what happens to a parcel. But yes, being a Canadian seller myself, I totally know the prohibitive cost of tracking and why it's ludicrous to imagine using it on every item.

Some thoughts on this: putting a "not applicable" option to the binary yes/no question might seem like a good idea, but I would personally not think so. The whole thing about implementing this question was to make it as simple as possible so we can end up with data that is much easier to use. Adding uncertainty to the mix would make it all worthless. Personally, and please understand I'm just brainstorming out loud, I'd much rather see the question re-written in a way that makes it more clear what we are asking. For example, we could ask "did the item arrive at XX address by YY date?" where XX is the address that the buyer stated at checkout and YY the expected delivery date.

Then there is the question around whether the buyer should be held accountable for misstating the true shipping address where the item is going and whether that should be considered a form of avoidance of the seller's terms.

I just want to comment in the part in bold...

For many of us, the information is all ready worthless because if we don't use tracking and the buyer doesn't leave feedback or doesn't answer the question, the transaction isn't part of the total transactions.

I am assuming too the when there is no delivery estimate given in the order details, that transaction isn't used either. Out of 5 transaction that I have today, only 3 of them have an estimated delivery date. The one transaction to South Korea does not have an eta and the item going to a buyer in Canada does not have one either. It seems that when I list on .com and the buyer is in Canada, there is no estimate given. In this particular case, I am using tracking so perhaps they will use the accepted scan but if there was no tracking, the item wouldn't exist as far as shipment times go.