eBay

toysandstuff2015 · ‎02-17-2016

I recently sold a Lego Creator Eiffel Tower (2000.00 +) to someone in Toronto. The package was insured for the amount, tracked, and signed for. It was delivered at 10:37 three days later and signed for. Within three minutes the buyer emailed stating that the item was broken and damaged and therefore demanded their money back. I asked for them to place a claim through paypal and help with Canada Post. For half and hour their repeated emails insisted that I should send the funds back directly that they would not file a claim. Then they changed their story, it wasn't that the item was damaged but that it was sent to the wrong address, and that the signature Canada Post had was not theirs. Again they demanded their money back but insisted that I send it directly rather than go through paypal claims. Canada Post insists the package was sent to the right address, and the person won't talk to them to help with a postal claim. Now they have emailed me (I suspect by mistake) in a list with all their friends listing a kijiji ad for the same item I sold them. Despite all of this their refusal to talk with Canada Post makes any insurance claim impossible and they have started a claim through paypal based on not receiving the item.

How do you protect from this sort of scam? This terrifies me. In the last week two of my high end items for 1000.00 and 2000.00 have been hit with this. People get the item, which is tracked, etc by the post office, then claim they did not get it, file a claim for their money and seem about to win. How do you stop this?

mr.elmwood · ‎02-17-2016

They operate on the basis of fear.

You have a tracking number. Respond to the PayPal claim with the tracking number. When you have done everything correctly, as you have done. PayPal and eBay are with you.

"Seem about to win" is the fear factor.

PayPal phone number 1-866-888-6080

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avenueshopswapsell · ‎02-17-2016

If you have tracking and signature confirming delivery, you should be ok.

I would call Paypal and explain the whole situation, firmly stating that you have delivery confirmation and a signature to back it up.

If the buyer opens a claim through eBay, you have all the messages to back up what the buyer has said, including a Kijiji sale for your item. Again the delivery confirmation and signature should suffice. BUT I would call eBay if a claim is opened here and speak to someone, insist that they review EVERYTHING. Many times when a claim is opened a bot makes the decision, usually for the buyer...:(

mr.elmwood · ‎02-17-2016

I had a claim against me for an INR, a week ago. I called PP and said "I have a tracking number" and I was immediately transferred to eBay. The fellow I ended up talking with, sent the "buyer" the following email:

"... This is to notify you that the item 351638869178 Venture Trans Port Ash Tray Ashtray 97 98 99 black Dash Insert #8186 already arrived at your Address and the tracking number shows that the item is already delivered. So the seller can't do anything about this. You have to contact your local post office or contact eBay so we can give you more information."

Buyer got blown-off by eBay and the eBay case was cancelled. They opened a PP claim and I have heard nothing after I responded with the tracking number.

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pacificwinds6875 · ‎02-17-2016

Happened to me as well, not that much money involved but same scenario. I provided Tracking (showed delivered). Closed in my favor. End of story, buyer blocked. Stay cool, don't panic and you have all the proof you need so do not respond to any emails "off Ebay". Keep all that incriminating items - just in case you need back up proof.

pacificwinds6875 · ‎02-17-2016

wait....I read your post again.
How would they know it was damaged if it was sent to a 'wrong address' and signed for by someone else?? Haha - what a joke if they think they can get away with this - and they won't you know?

hlmacdon · ‎02-17-2016

@toysandstuff2015 wrote:

How do you protect from this sort of scam? This terrifies me. In the last week two of my high end items for 1000.00 and 2000.00 have been hit with this. People get the item, which is tracked, etc by the post office, then claim they did not get it, file a claim for their money and seem about to win. How do you stop this?

The buyer has already sunk themselves with the contradicting story. How do you protect yourself? You've already done the key thing which is ensuring you have signature confirmation and tracking on a high value order, along with directing the customer to go through the official procedures. If the buyer does open a case, before you respond to it, call in with ebay or paypal (depending on where they open the case), and discuss the matter with them directly, including proof it was shipped to the correct address, proof it was signed for, and point out the contradiction messages the buyer has left.

When you get a buyer that is being belligerent and behaving in a very suspect manner, you can also call in with ebay ahead of a case opening via the report a member feature, and get facts surrounding the case put on a file. Also I can not stress enough that paying for signature confirmation for higher value items, even when the amount doesn't officially require it by paypal ($850 CAD/$750 USD is mandatory). These sort of low level scammers rely on sellers being a weak hand that folds under pressure, hence their pressure tactics without opening a case.

mr.elmwood · ‎02-17-2016

@hlmacdon wrote:
@toysandstuff2015 wrote:

How do you protect from this sort of scam? This terrifies me. In the last week two of my high end items for 1000.00 and 2000.00 have been hit with this. People get the item, which is tracked, etc by the post office, then claim they did not get it, file a claim for their money and seem about to win. How do you stop this?
The buyer has already sunk themselves with the contradicting story. How do you protect yourself? You've already done the key thing which is ensuring you have signature confirmation and tracking on a high value order, along with directing the customer to go through the official procedures. If the buyer does open a case, before you respond to it, call in with ebay or paypal (depending on where they open the case), and discuss the matter with them directly, including proof it was shipped to the correct address, proof it was signed for, and point out the contradiction messages the buyer has left.

When you get a buyer that is being belligerent and behaving in a very suspect manner, you can also call in with ebay ahead of a case opening via the report a member feature, and get facts surrounding the case put on a file. Also I can not stress enough that paying for signature confirmation for higher value items, even when the amount doesn't officially require it by paypal ($850 CAD/$750 USD is mandatory). These sort of low level scammers rely on sellers being a weak hand that folds under pressure, hence their pressure tactics without opening a case.

Abso-freaking-lutely what hlmacdon says.

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dgour98 · ‎02-17-2016

About the signatures...I know that Canada post says on their website that Expedited and Xpresspost to US can get signatures, but

i know for a fact that the Paypal print out does not allow that feature. Does the Xpresspost option allow it on Paypal?

momcqueen · ‎02-17-2016

As a fellow toy seller, I feel your pain and fear.

The reality is, unfortunately, that with your high-demand, high-value items and your relatively low feedback numbers, you are a magnet for this kind of thing.

On the bright side, it sounds like you have done everything right. Tracked items with signature. Force the claimants to follow proper, official channels and DO NOT give in to pressure. Keep all correspondence brief, professional and within paypal or ebay's resolution centres confines. And eBay messages wherever possible. Report your buyer(s) by calling Customer Service and you'll be doing all of us a favour in the long term.

Do you know anyone else in your area or circle of friends with a higher feedback number who might consider selling this kind of high-value item on your behalf? I stopped getting the push-around from unethical types, for the most part, once I hit about the 750+ mark. Knock on wood. You'd be better to grow slowly with lower value items and then, if you can wait, haul out the big guns like the Eiffel Tower set.

Good luck. Let us know how things turn out for you in the end. You know we will be pulling for you.

toysandstuff2015 · ‎02-17-2016

Thanks to everyone for their advice. I have spent the day reading and rereading ebay/paypal matters trying to get ready. The emails from the user haven't stopped, but I have stopped responding so we will wait and see. I contacted Canada Post advised them of the situation and asked them to confirm all of the information on their end. They are apparently off to talk with him about the matter to confirm whether it got there or not.

The user's last email about it consisted of:

Life is interesting. Thanks for all the advice.

mr.elmwood · ‎02-17-2016

Mine reared it's ugly head again today. Well, it is getting to be enjoyable as I have a pen-pal now. Because I had tracking, this is what the buyer has been told:

Canada Post 2/12/2013 case closed

eBay 2/13/2016 case closed

Paypal 2/13/2016 case closed

Canada Post 2/15/2016 case closed

Canada Post 2/17/2016 case opened. I am a "fraudister" now.

Today's case will be closed as well. The more they are losing, the more they are attacking me.

eBay and PayPal both state the package is in our control until signed off. Well, yours and mine are signed off. We have done our part as defined by PayPal, eBay, and the Post Office.

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pacificwinds6875 · ‎02-17-2016

Yeah!

Is a 'Fraudster' a nasty hipster? Just kidding! Hahaha

I am so happy this turned out for you (as it should).

May I suggest one thing - I have these really bright labels that say :

ATTENTION POSTMASTER:

DO NOT "Safe Drop". I just made them on an AVERY template.

What that means in postal talk is - even if it's safe and the postmaster has done so in the past - he or she is NOT to leave the parcel when the receiver is not home. They should then leave a postal package hang tag. Customer then HAS to go and show id at the post office to pick up the parcel. It's REALLY handy when you use Tracked Packet USA because a signature is not required nor asked for. XpressPost and Expedited Parcel has a mandatory signature service - I believe.

Here - for all your stress and worry - you need a kitty!

mr.elmwood · ‎02-17-2016

Not fraudster, fraudister, So, I guess that makes me a hipister.

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pjcdn2005 · ‎02-17-2016

@dgour98 wrote:

About the signatures...I know that Canada post says on their website that Expedited and Xpresspost to US can get signatures, but
i know for a fact that the Paypal print out does not allow that feature. Does the Xpresspost option allow it on Paypal?

Expedited USA does not have a signature option so I'm not sure where you see that on the CP site.

Xpresspost USA automatically includes a signature so when you print a label on Paypal, a signature will be required alhough I realize that isn't made clear on the Paypal site.

pjcdn2005 · ‎02-17-2016

@mr.elmwood wrote:
Mine reared it's ugly head again today. Well, it is getting to be enjoyable as I have a pen-pal now. Because I had tracking, this is what the buyer has been told:

Canada Post 2/12/2013 case closed
eBay 2/13/2016 case closed
Paypal 2/13/2016 case closed
Canada Post 2/15/2016 case closed
Canada Post 2/17/2016 case opened. I am a "fraudister" now.

Today's case will be closed as well. The more they are losing, the more they are attacking me.

eBay and PayPal both state the package is in our control until signed off. Well, yours and mine are signed off. We have done our part as defined by PayPal, eBay, and the Post Office.

I'm not sure what you mean by all of your Canada post case closed/ opened etc but did you tell Canada Post that the buyer says they didn't receive the package and did they say they would look into it?

You sound as if you 'know' that the buyer really did receive the package yet mistakes can be made. How are you so certain that a mistake wasn't made in this case and that the buyer does not have a legitimate reason to be upset? I'm not saying that you are responsible for the problem but there may be ways you can help...assuming you haven't done so already.

hlmacdon · ‎02-17-2016

@pjcdn2005 wrote:
@dgour98 wrote:

About the signatures...I know that Canada post says on their website that Expedited and Xpresspost to US can get signatures, but
i know for a fact that the Paypal print out does not allow that feature. Does the Xpresspost option allow it on Paypal?

Expedited USA does not have a signature option so I'm not sure where you see that on the CP site.
Xpresspost USA automatically includes a signature so when you print a label on Paypal, a signature will be required alhough I realize that isn't made clear on the Paypal site.

That has been my experience with Expedited USA as well. I can't for the life of me think of why they don't have a USPS signature confirmation option since the service transfers to priority mail anyways. Even if it was only viewable via the USPS website sellers would at least have that backup.

recped · ‎02-18-2016

@hlmacdon wrote:
@pjcdn2005 wrote:
@dgour98 wrote:

About the signatures...I know that Canada post says on their website that Expedited and Xpresspost to US can get signatures, but
i know for a fact that the Paypal print out does not allow that feature. Does the Xpresspost option allow it on Paypal?

Expedited USA does not have a signature option so I'm not sure where you see that on the CP site.
Xpresspost USA automatically includes a signature so when you print a label on Paypal, a signature will be required alhough I realize that isn't made clear on the Paypal site.
That has been my experience with Expedited USA as well. I can't for the life of me think of why they don't have a USPS signature confirmation option since the service transfers to priority mail anyways. Even if it was only viewable via the USPS website sellers would at least have that backup.

First Class Packages from the USA turn into Xpresspost here in Canada but US shippers can't get a signature for ANY International service even the very expensive Express International.

"What else could I do? I had no trade so I became a peddler" - Lazarus Greenberg 1915
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