eBay

winepress780 · ‎01-30-2016

I am so frustrated with eBay's GSP so here are some of my frustrations.

Most sellers either have never heard of it or don't know much about it

Some don't know how to find the "option" to turn it off. Most also don't even realize it is enabled on their auctions and what that really means. The majority of things I buy from eBay are one-offs from sellers that don't have huge volumes. The GSP is a waste of my time because I have to explain to the seller and ask them if they would ship direct. In almost all cases these are sellers who would otherwise be glad to ship direct to you if you asked them but can't because eBay has auto-magically enrolled them into the GSP. I've even come across a seller who said "no problem if you bid on it and win I'll ship to you directly" and then I have to explain how with the GSP that is not possible. In the odd case I get the sense that the seller thinks eBay knows what's best for them and so clearly it's GSP all the way for them even if they don't know anything about it. The GSP is a convoluted and expensive system that sellers don't understand.

The GSP can't stand on its own merits
The option "Offer the Global Shipping Program" would be more appropriately called "Force the Global Shipping Program." It is not an offer it is a permanent binding to auctions once someone places a bid or if it is a BIN auction. If it were an offer they would provide the buyer a choice (the seller still having complete control) to choose the GSP as an alternate shipping method. But no informed buyers who know anything about their local customs or how the system works would choose it. So the program has to be forced onto auctions with sellers usually unaware that eBay has auto-magically enrolled them. With a non-GSP auction the seller and buyer can agree on a shipping method and the seller can even adjust the invoice after the auction has been once. Trying to race to both explain and get the seller to remove GSP before the first bid is a barrier to buying and with a BIN it is a lost sale.

Practically useless tracking system
The tracking number eBay provides is not a real tracking number with a real carrier. I cannot go for example to the Royal Mail or DHL websites and enter it in and track my shipment. Both Royal Mail and DHL Global (not DHL Express) hand off to Canada Post and in the case of DHL they even provide the Canada Post tracking number. With GSP the tracking number is nonsense. I've been pointed to some random websites that look like they have been put together by some 5 year kid that say my package is on some flight #. Great and it stays on that plane for a week and half? Royal Mail and DHL (both Express and Global) provide real tracking. GSP tracking is a total joke and is more expensive compared to at least Royal Mail tracking services.

Privacy and opening packages
The CBSA has the right to open everything. Of the few hundred packages I've received abroad, less than a handful have been opened by the CBSA. However, with the GSP Pitney Bowes has opened everything (3 or so packages) of mine and I've heard they open everything to check the contents and potentially repackage. And they put their GSP sticker on it. This makes me angry because as a commercial entity Pitney Bowes (just like eBay) can define whatever privacy policy suits them. The CBSA is a part of the Canadian government and their privacy polices are defined as such. Further unless the seller includes the eBay invoice in it, the CBSA has no reference to the actual auction or my eBay username or phone number. What's one more commercial company collecting information about you and your purchases? Well that argument is a slippery slope and I have an issue with it because Pitney Bowes and the GSP are not necessary.

Get a refund for Pitney Bowes import charges?
I have filled out casual refund requests many times with the CBSA and gotten refunds everytime. All you have to do is provide your invoice and supporting documentation and I go a step further and provide references to the CBSA tariff schedule document. The refund cheque usually arrives in the mail about three weeks later. And there is a real number you can actually call and talk to a real person at the CBSA if needed. With Pitney Bowes you cannot contest import charges because you don't need know how the item was classified and I've heard you can't even contact them. I've only heard horror stories from people trying to get refunds from Pitney Bowes for things like damaged goods or having to send an item back.

Can't combine shipping
There is no technical or business reason for this. It's not hard it's Pitney Bowes software running on eBay's servers surely they are integrated enough by now that this would be easy to do.

The GSP is an automated system based on an incredibly outdated Canada customs regime
I really hope the U.S. increases their de minimus to $800 U.S. because that will really make Canada's $20 CDN de minimus a joke worldwide and an impediment to international trade. I'm hoping this will result in the U.S. government putting even more pressure on the Canadian government. A $20 CDN de minimus is a waste of government money and diverts resources away from important things such stopping illegal goods, counterfeit goods, and other criminal activities. And what is eBay doing here, first they suggest it should be $200 then they backtrack a year or so later and say it should be $80? To me this is indicative that eBay has no idea of the impact of this value and is just grasping at straws trying to see if something will stick.

Further 18% duty on most clothes and shoes is insanity; who manufacturers for example shoes anymore in Canada? $20 CDN and 18% duty is the law, fine OK, but when customs is a hit-and-miss in Canada I'm going to go through the CBSA not Pitney Bowes. In the past I have received many packages worth hundreds (and one even nearly $1000) pass through the CBSA with no fees whatsoever. The fact that it is usually a hit-and-miss with Canada customs is strong evidence that the system and de minimus value doesn't work.

The GSP plays on ignorance and fear
Postal systems such as Royal Mail, USPS, and Canada Post have been in place for hundreds of years. eBay's GSP does not solve any postal issues. Mail still has the potential to go "lost." Contrary to what eBay's GSP implies, it's not that hard for a seller to offer an international tracked and signed service. That is what the post office is for and they will give you the form to fill out. Understandably that importing or shipping certain things may have special regulations or restrictions (like lithium batteries), but for buyers that know what they want and know their local customs laws this is neither complicated nor an issue.

In terms of postage costs it can vary but again for buyers that know what they want and have some experience it is very simple to sort out. I always make sure to cover my seller's costs. It's fine if a seller has fears about shipping things outside based on their past experiences but I'm not talking about these sellers. For a lot of the sellers I've bought from the sale is a one-off and most of them have not shipped outside before. In all the years I've been on eBay with different accounts I've been ripped off 4 times (in addition to one lost in the mail) and all these cases were very clear cut ripoffs so it goes both ways it isn't just buyers ripping off sellers. I appreciate that it is a bit more work for a seller to ship outside their country and if the seller is nice enough I just let it go because I only spend as much as I'm willing to lose anyway.

billybishop72 · ‎04-24-2016

Why should any Canadian feel good about paying ridiculous import taxes to Canada Post when they hire Americans(Pitney Bowes) to collect them?

femmefan1946 · ‎04-24-2016

In addition to supporting local business, the promised turnaround time was much faster than if I'd ordered the part online.

This is something that most consumers don't realize.

Even here on Vancouver Island (I'm in Oak Bay, marnotom!), it is often faster to buy locally and get what you need quickly than to hope that an import will arrive and be useable.

I learned from my mother's business that custom made could be cheaper than trying to make the mass manufactured thing work.

She was a seamstress, and could make a dress that actually fit the client for the same price or less than an equal quality garment from a shop.

And if pressed, could turn it out overnight.

The many many complaints from buyers scammed by overseas sellers because they pursued price over quality ...... ah well, I'm preaching to the choir....

marnotom! · ‎04-24-2016

@billybishop72 wrote:

Why should any Canadian feel good about paying ridiculous import taxes to Canada Post when they hire Americans(Pitney Bowes) to collect them?

Why should a casual import made by post (or similar) go untaxed, while that same item purchased on Canadian soil be subject to GST/HST/PST?

You're not paying "import' taxes per se on an item you purchase by mail from overseas. You're paying the same taxes as you would if you purchased the item from a Canadian retailer registered to collect those taxes.

Perhaps the C$20 limit is a bit too low to be cost effective, but the problem seems to be more that there are now items worth many times that amount that aren't getting assessed and charged applicable taxes when sent through the post.

I'm sure I've said this many times before, but when my wife and I first started "eBaying" in the late 1990s, I'd say that half to two-thirds of the modestly-priced items that we purchased here had to be picked up at our postal outlet for taxes owing. By around 2003, that proportion had dropped considerably and by the late 2000s I think we paid taxes only once in seven years. At that point we figured it was something to do with the fact that we had moved to a remote location, but when we spent a year in a town with paved streets, traffic lights and the occasional sidewalk, we found that our purchases from the US worth over $100 weren't even getting hit with a tax bill. At that point, I began to suspect that something weird was going on.

maggiebvintage2010 · ‎04-24-2016

I understood that, but what is as clear as mud is the following statement that is tucked into the extremely long sentence:

. . . .to charge it selectively based on for example Canada 's obligations on duty free harmonized with USA tariffs under NAFTA

OP - I'd love to have a clear explanation of what you are trying to say here.

00nevermind00 · ‎04-24-2016

@pierrelebel wrote:
"...lack of enforcement has never been a problem..."

It depends on your perspective. As a Canadian taxpayer I have to pay more taxes to make up for the tens of millions of dollars of consumption taxes (GST/HST) not collected at time of Customs clearance.

As a buyer importing an item on which taxes are not collected, one avoids paying a few dollars.

I would much prefer the rules being the same and enforced the same way for all Canadians.

I just wrote a big fat cheque to the Receiver General of Canada to attach to my tax return. It should keep Mike Duffy fully supplied in taxpayer-subsidized breakfasts for a few years to come.

I look at this kind of stuff, and I look at Mossack Fonseca and I look at the rich KPMG clients who, after admitting recently they cheated the taxman, were simply given a slap on the wrist. I look at all of that knowing that it is only the tip of the iceberg, and I ask myself why on earth should I pay tax on a $20.01 purchase from the US or any other country?

Am I angry? You better believe it! I'm angry that the governement is nickel and diming ordinary Canadians to death with that ridiculous (yes, it IS ridiculous) $20 limit, while richer and more powerful people than you and I benefit from loopholes and the complacency of tax folks looking the other way.

I, too, would much prefer the rules be the same for all.

marnotom! · ‎04-24-2016

@00nevermind00 wrote:

. . . and I ask myself why on earth should I pay tax on a $20.01 purchase from the US or any other country?

Am I angry? You better believe it! I'm angry that the governement is nickel and diming ordinary Canadians to death with that ridiculous (yes, it IS ridiculous) $20 limit.

When was the last time you were "nickel and dimed" on a postal import with a declared value of just over $20, though? Do you think most Canadians are?

femmefan1946 · ‎04-25-2016

The $20 maximum is frankly insulting, especially when we compare it to cross-border shoppers who can bring back $200 worth of goods on a single trip for every one in the car.

Including the two month old baby in her nice new carseat.

This is something that we can only hope (and lobby) the new Parliament will change.

00nevermind00 · ‎04-25-2016

@femmefan1946 wrote:
The $20 maximum is frankly insulting, especially when we compare it to cross-border shoppers who can bring back $200 worth of goods on a single trip for every one in the car.
Including the two month old baby in her nice new carseat.

This is something that we can only hope (and lobby) the new Parliament will change.

Yes, exactly. I don't know of many consumer products that haven't gone up in price in the last 30 or so years. Yet this limit seems frozen in time.

Because it is so outdated, it is unenforceable. Enforcing it strictly would simply require too much manpower, or else the backlogs would be horrendous and people would scream (with good reason, I think).

If the limit was raised to, say, $100 or (better yet) $200 but strictly enforced, who's to say that the taxes collected would not amount to more than the current bootie? I've had many packages worth more than that go through untaxed because they were small and they were not mailed with a fancy shmancy service.

marnotom! · ‎04-25-2016

@femmefan1946 wrote:

The $20 maximum is frankly insulting, especially when we compare it to cross-border shoppers who can bring back $200 worth of goods on a single trip for every one in the car.

Including the two month old baby in her nice new carseat.

This is something that we can only hope (and lobby) the new Parliament will change.

But keep in mind that one has to stay 24 hours in the States for that $200 exemption to kick in. A day trip from Delta to Blaine ain't gonna cut it. One has to weigh the cost of gas, how much overnight accommodation will kick in, meals, etc. to see if the tax/duty savings are worth that $200 personal exemption.

One doesn't have to worry about these sort of additional expenses when ordering by mail, and I suspect the exemptions on both imports by mail and imports made whilst travelling take these expenses into consideration.

But I think we're getting away from practice and focussing too much on the theory. The way things stand right now, the odds of getting charged taxes, duty and administration fees on a C$20.01 postal import are incredibly slim. The odds of getting hit with these charges on a C$80 postal import are probably just as slim. This low tax/duty exemption limit is pretty much a non-issue for stuff sent by mail, and I suspect that if given the choice, most Canadians would choose a low, lackadaisically enforced limit over a higher, more strictly-enforced limit.

Unless shipping/forwarding services such as the GSP become the norm for casual imports, I suppose. Even then, I wouldn't be surprised if even now Pitney Bowes is being charged taxes on sub-C$20 items by CBSA as they're considered part of larger importations of commercial freight and not eligible for CBSA's "Postal Import Program".

reallynicestamps · ‎04-25-2016

Why should any Canadian feel good about paying ridiculous import taxes to Canada Post when they hire Americans(Pitney Bowes) to collect them?

You do know that every retailer in Canada who collects retail sales taxes (GST/PDT/HST) is also PAID to collect them, right? And that included multinationals like Home Depot and McDonald's.

Even then, I wouldn't be surprised if even now Pitney Bowes is being charged taxes on sub-C$20 items by CBSA as they're considered part of larger importations of commercial freight and not eligible for CBSA's "Postal Import Program".

We'll never know, but it is an interesting thought.

pierrelebel · ‎04-25-2016

"is also PAID to collect them, right?"

???

That is incorrect.

In the good old days in Ontario, retailers with a PST license got a small commission of the tax collected and remitted.

That does NOT exist with GST/HST. Merchants get NOTHING.

PS - Ask your DH who is a renowned expert on GST. He will confirm.

maggiebvintage2010 · ‎04-25-2016

CBSA has a Courier Imports Remissions Program, similar to postal imports, that applies to couriers, and all commerical carriers including freight forwarders and deconsolidators. Here is an excerpt:

7. In order for courier shipments valued at CAN$20 or less to receive the benefit of the Courier Imports Remission Order, or the benefit of non-taxable status under Section 7 of Schedule VII of the Excise Tax Act, the total shipment must be subject to a single transaction. It is not acceptable to divide an order into several packages so that each individual shipment has a value of under CAN$20.

8. Where the value for duty of the shipment exceeds CAN$20, the entire value of the goods is subject to the regular provisions of the Customs Tariff.

Whether PB pays on the entire shipment depends on how the paperwork is completed. Eg: when something is sent by UPS, Fedex, etc, there is individual paperwork for each item that was completed by the sender. Therefore each item (package) is its own "total shipment" and is cleared individually, thus eligible for the exemption of payment of duties and taxes.