ebay getting cheap on free listings

wow ebay is sure cheap on the free listigs oh well my sales are down from 30 a month to 12 guess we all suffer

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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

You can please some of the people some of time.....

Message 21 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

Well, the first thing that occurs to me, right off the top, is digitally-delivered items, a particular soapbox of mine I'm afraid. 

 

Had eBay been more creative in finding ways to allow sellers to deal with these sorts of items easily and effectively, they would not have lost thousands of experienced and successful sellers, or at least a good portion of those sellers' sales, to other venues.  I happen to be one of them.  

 

I had hoped to expand my business here into the digital world, but alas.  EBay's solution?  Relegate those types of items to the darkest back corner of the site they could find(Classifieds), which prompted sellers like me to look elsewhere to list our products -- and do well selling them.  On another site on which I sell, delivery of digital items to customers is a thing of beauty: simple, easy, clear and immediate, no shipping or delivery issues, and the site has terrific, well thought out features to help sellers take advantage of that market.  That is what I call forward-thinking. 

 

In this context I found it odd that eBay turned its back almost entirely on digitally-delivered commerce, given their hype over mobile phone sales.  Yes, I do realize there were problems with permitting such products to be sold, but huge potential that surely eBay could have realized had they not simply reacted by essentially banishing them from the site.  That was not a creative solution. 

 

A few other areas off the top of my head where I think eBay dropped the ball (or missed the game entirely): 

 

  • Immediate Payment Required -- how many buyers has this turned off?  How many lost sales?
  • Lack of site management and sloppy/delayed response to cyber attacks and/or serious site issues -- how many buyers leave forever as a result?
  • Cart disconnect being allowed to continue for over a year -- need I elaborate?
  • Downgrading sellers' and buyers' ability to simply and directly communicate with each other?
  • Focus on an adversarial, policy-heavy punishment-based system to evaluate sellers -- how many sellers have left as a result?  
  • Too much time and effort spent on re-configuring the site rather than ensuring features actually work properly most of the time -- how many sellers and buyers both have given up on eBay as a result?  I constantly wonder whether buyers are getting sick of seeing things in different places or unfamiliar-looking things suddenly pop up.  We sellers have to deal with the shape-shifting, but for buyers there are other more consistent and stable sites to visit.  

I could go on and on if I actually gave it some thought, but I have other things I must accomplish today.  I don't think there's any rush, as I don't expect to be invited to eBay HQ's boardroom anytime soon.  

 

Enjoy your game... Woman Happy

 

Message 22 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings


@73rhc wrote:

Actually, it does make sense. Sellers have been adding more listings than they normally would have, sans promos. Now these sellers gave a ton of listings in their unsold area. So what's a seller to do if no new promo is forthcoming?


So are you saying that it was a positive and creative marketing concept for eBay to basically upset, frustrate and even anger a whole lot of non-store buyers in order to somehow entice them into store ownership, i.e. by dangling the carrot in front of them and then snatching it away when they most need it?  

 

If that is eBay's deliberate motive in the way they've organized these promos for the past year or so, then it's certainly a very odd way to encourage seller loyalty and satisfaction with their selling venue, and not the kind of top-flight, professional thinking I'd expect of a company this big.  

 

I suppose what I'm saying is that it's so unbelievably bad a concept that I feel there has to be another motive (whatever that may be) behind these endless bait and switch promo techniques, keeping sellers perpetually on edge.  Or just plain dumb-as-doorknobs corporate thinking. 

 

As an aside, I've noticed that for a few months now eBay hasn't been sending me those seller surveys to find out how I rate selling here.  Gee, don't they care anymore??  Woman LOL

Message 23 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

So I see that you are preoccupied by reading between the lines. Never did I say that it was a "positive or creative marketing concept ". Never did I say that I was for or against this possible strategy!

 

What I am saying is that eBay doesn't revolve around certain sellers preoccupations. But rather they make Business decisions for the greater good of eBay and eBay alone. There is no family concept, there are no contracts pertaining to the running of the site, there is no democracy and frankly they nor I care!

 

I have not received any surveys, either. And I also know that this is not a conspiracy against me! Quite frankly, they don't know who you or I are. We are small potatoes. Plain and simple.

Message 24 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

"Had eBay been more creative in finding ways to allow sellers to deal with these sorts of items easily and effectively, they would not have lost thousands of experienced and successful sellers, or at least a good portion of those sellers' sales, to other venues. I happen to be one of them."

 

 

 

Where re do you get your statistics from?

Message 25 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

"Well, the first thing that occurs to me, right off the top, is digitally-delivered items, a particular soapbox of mine I'm afraid. "

 

Over seven years ago (March 2008) management at eBay decided to lose millions of dollars in fees by banning sale of digital items on their main site.  The folks making that decision were not stupid - they knew what they were doing.  They were prepared to sacrifice millions in revenue to clean up many abuses by sellers using digital delivery including feedback buying (remember those selling recipes for a penny), etc...  There is simply no protection available to buyers and sellers in case of dispute.  It was also way too easy for some to circumvent copyright issues.

 

Many sellers of course did not agree with the decision.  You were one of them.  I understand that.

 

But the folks running eBay had to look at the "big picture" and time has proven they were right.  Their income has kept on increasing year after year and sales by sellers selling tangible goods has also increased year after year on average.

Message 26 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

eBay adheres to the Chicago School of Economics theories of maximizing shareholder value. Any mention of sellers in that? Anywhere?

 

If they could make an extra dollar bottling sewage, we would be gone in a heartbeat.

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Message 27 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

  • Immediate Payment Required -- how many buyers has this turned off?  How many lost sales?"

I agree with, that policy did not make sense to me.  However, it was requested by very large sellers, those with hundreds of thousands of listings who do not care about multiple purchases.  They were wasting time waiting for payment, chasing non-paying bidders, etc...

 

I do not like it but... we all have to live with it.

 

Overall, I do not think it has any significant effect on eBay's bottom line either way.

 

Message 28 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

"Cart disconnect being allowed to continue for over a year -- need I elaborate?"

 

With all due respect, this is a very minor minuscule problem as far as eBay is concerned.  It may affect you to some degree but, overall, it is meaningless to eBay's bottom line.

Message 29 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

"Downgrading sellers' and buyers' ability to simply and directly communicate with each other?"

 

I agree with you again.  However, I can see eBay's point-of-view: protecting their revenue and profit.  Many of those direct communications lead to off-eBay transactions.

 

Message 30 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

 

 

My take on ebay's less free listings, and lowering to 20 from 50 listings a month is to make people get stores.

 

What that tells me is that ebay does not care how much you (we, us) sell per month, because now they get guaranteed

money.

 

I am just a part time seller and my sales come in bunches (mostly winter, i do this as a hobby). Those 1000 free listings

they would offer to me say in January, i would load load up and sell a huge percentage of items. Come March inventory is sold.

 

I keep checking the store calculator and it seems it would not work for me (according to their numbers). Having 20 items per month does not work for me either. (yes, i have 4 items up now.. come November i would kick into high gear)  Less money for me also means less money for ebay.  I am not getting a store untill it makes sense for me, and now they want me to hold to 20 listings. Whatever, it is their loss. I can and do sell on other platforms when needed (when i have stock to be moved).  If they want that percentage it is up to them.

Again, either way it is their decision and now they are telling me to sell elsewhere, so i do.

Message 31 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

"...as I don't expect to be invited to eBay HQ's boardroom anytime soon.  ..."

 

A long time ago, I was invited to San Jose to join the "Voices" program on eBay.com.  My years of communicating directly with eBay's senior management through that program (and others) somehow allowed me to usually disagree with them (mostly from a Canadian perspective as the only Canadian in the program for years) while having an understanding of their perspective.

 

I look at eBay the same way I look at my bank or the cable and internet provider or the telephone company, Canada Post, etc... :  an important provider of service I use regularly. That is all eBay is: a provider of a venue allowing me to sell some products.  They set up their pricing, their rules and policies and I decide if that works for me.  Not everything is to my liking, of course, but it has to be my decision weighing the good and the bad. Every seller here makes the same decision regularly.

 

Overall, despite many frustrating aspects, it still works. I have leaned to adapt to constant changes, many enforced by eBay but required by the marketplace.  For example eBay was quick to identify a trend in e-commerce where the novelty of the auction was wearing thin while most online buyers wanted to shop and buy for immediate shipment.  There is still a huge market for auction buyers but most sellers know that is no longer where the big money is.  eBay has moved towards fixed price where e-commerce is.

 

Back to the subject of this thread, eBay has experimented with many types of promotions over the last several years, promotions offering sellers the ability to list their products for free.  Looking a the "big picture" once again, has it been productive? Not really.  Lately eBay made most promotions conditional to "no relist allowed" so buyers would see new "stuff" offered for sale.  Smart sellers quickly found ways to relist the same old stuff that did not sell using different functions.  What did that prove?  Nothing.

 

There are already more items listed on eBay than most potential buyers can possibly look at.  The amount of money these same buyers have available to spend on eBay has not changed.  Listing and relisting the same old stuff over and over again is a marginal waste of time when viewed from eBay's perspective.

 

There is no "free lunch".  I wish eBay would simply eliminate those invitational promotions and let sellers make decision to list based on the merit of each item: Is it worth spending $0.30 (or whatever) to list this item on eBay for ten (or whatever) days.

 

If the answer is yes, then sellers should proceed, list and hope to sell quickly.

 

If the answer is no, then why should eBay spend their resources and overcrowd their site for products sellers have no confidence in selling?

 

Let's go back to the original eBay principle for level playing field: everybody (small and large) pay to list their items.  No more freebies.  Folks looking only for freebies should look elsewhere.

Message 32 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

Doubt that will happen while they continue to be blown away by amzn who gives everyone 2 MILLION free listings per month

 

The difference being, amzn is exceptional at being able to direct buyers to relevant items, while ebay is still terrible at it. 

Message 33 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

If I can list 300 items thorough a promo it can save me $90 in listing fees, then I'm in.

 

Why would you pay 30 cents each to list 300 items when by opening a Store you could list them at a nickel? With most of them 'free'  so an even lower average. And have less labour cost by using Fixed Price/30 days/ Good Til Cancelled.

 

I do find that the relatively new  Note* that eBay adds to our Active Listings  when an item has had no action in 16 months is useful, though.

 

 

 

 

 

*I mentioned this once before and somebody panicked. No, only you can see that note, not your customers.

 

Message 34 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

The point is, with the promos, I can list 300 listings. I wouldn't list 300 items, otherwise. The promos have saved me from opening a store. And have saved me the $19.99 a month. Not a large amount, but it's my $19.99.  

 

Will I have open one soon, if there are no more promos. Most probably.

Message 35 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings


@toby**bleep**zu wrote:

 

The difference being, amzn is exceptional at being able to direct buyers to relevant items, while ebay is still terrible at it. 


I agree.  Even after many years of buying on eBay, I still can't believe how much trouble I have finding exactly what I'm after even when I know it's there!   I've had sellers from whom I've purchased previously literally "disappear" from searches that should have been relevant enough and specific enough to bring them up.  

 

On Amazon, I can somehow zoom in and narrow down the list in a flash.  

Message 36 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

pierre lebel wrote: 

 

Over seven years ago (March 2008) management at eBay decided to lose millions of dollars in fees by banning sale of digital items on their main site.  The folks making that decision were not stupid - they knew what they were doing.  They were prepared to sacrifice millions in revenue to clean up many abuses by sellers using digital delivery including feedback buying (remember those selling recipes for a penny), etc...  There is simply no protection available to buyers and sellers in case of dispute.  It was also way too easy for some to circumvent copyright issues.

 

I'm afraid I don't see it this way.  The reason eBay banned digital items, in my view, was because they were looking at them only as a problem, rather than applying creative thinking toward turning them into an opportunity.  

 

For one thing, feedback buying was only a problem because of the existence of the badly flawed eBay feedback programme in the first place.  On another site where I sell digital items, a voluntary "review" system, which is not tied to seller reward or punishment by the site itself, makes such behaviour pointless.  

 

Secondly, copyright violation is just as flagrant and as easy to perpetrate with photocopied (tangible) items in my categories as it was for digital items.  EBay could have limited the potential for copyright violation by restricting digital items to visual (PDF/jpeg) material, thus bypassing the very troublesome music piracy issues. 

 

I do agree that buyer protection might have been a new challenge in this area, but not impossible with some creative thinking.  In fact, some complaints will rarely if ever occur with digital items -- e.g. non-receipt or slow delivery.  

 

What eBay really needed was not to throw the baby out with the bathwater, but to take a different approach than with tangible items to avoid customer dissatisfaction.  It seemed to me when eBay banned digital items that they were so stuck in the rut of crime and punishment thinking that the only solution they could come up with was to make the whole concept verboten.  

 

By contrast, that "other" site I mentioned took the brilliant step of taking charge of delivery (customer download) of digital items.  This means that it is not the seller who handles uploading or emailing the digital item to the buyer, but the buyer who -- once they pay -- is given access to the stored file(s) that the seller has previously uploaded to the site.  Simple, easy, flawless.  In cases where the buyer believes the item is not as described, a mechanism exists to launch a claim/complaint.  Since the site itself has access to review the digital material, claims can be dealt with speedily and fairly.  And since the site itself can access the material, they can also make decisions on appropriateness and copyright.  

 

The lost opportunity?  As you say, millions of dollars of fee revenue, and the chance to be a front runner in the field of digital delivery.    

 

"But the folks running eBay had to look at the "big picture" and time has proven they were right.  Their income has kept on increasing year after year and sales by sellers selling tangible goods has also increased year after year on average.

 

I don't think time has proven anything in this regard.  The fact that the income from sales of tangible goods has continued to increase doesn't mean that eBay's income couldn't have been even larger had they not sliced off an entire sector of sales.  All they have done is to hand that income opportunity to other venues, who have taken it up and run with it. 

Message 37 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

pierre lebel wrote: 

  • Immediate Payment Required -- how many buyers has this turned off?  How many lost sales?"

Overall, I do not think it has any significant effect on eBay's bottom line either way.

_______________________________________________________________________________

 

You could very well be correct, but I'm not sure how anyone but an eBay analyst can say that for certain.  

 

Yes, it was clear it was a move to make the biggest sellers happier.  My point was that many of eBay's traditional sellers (and buyers) were used to a more personalized system and I have to wonder how many of those kind of customers just went away and never came back.  Of course, at the time eBay probably didn't care much about their traditional "core" sellers; apparently now they do (if you believe Wenig).  It may be too little too late. 

 

"Downgrading sellers' and buyers' ability to simply and directly communicate with each other?"

 

I agree with you again.  However, I can see eBay's point-of-view: protecting their revenue and profit.  Many of those direct communications lead to off-eBay transactions.

 

Yes, I know the rationale.  However eBay's paranoia about off-eBay transactions has always seemed rather excessive to me.  Removing the easy personal contact with sellers was probably one of the necessary steps to making the "old" eBay look like the "new" eBay -- commercial, impersonal, automated.  So now we're to believe that eBay CEO's want to focus on supporting their "traditional core" again.  Well, one of the first things they could do is reinstate that "Contact Seller" button, no strings attached, up front on every listing.  

 

To return to the original subject of this thread, I can live without promos if eBay could do something to bring my buyers back in the door.  

 

 

Message 38 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings

I would have paid the stockholders dividends from the profits of the company, instead of encouraging gamblers to drop in and out of the stock.

In my opinion (and I will namedrop Warren Buffett  (Berkshire Hathaway) and Roger Martin  (Rotman School of Business, UoT) on this), the stockholders would be interested in a company that makes money, rather than a stock that can be bought and sold regardless of what the business is actually doing.

 

I might have restricted Free Listing promotions to sellers with a limited number of sales (0 to 20 perhaps) making it clear that they would not be paid for 21 days. This would encourage new and occasional sellers, but would discourage the hit and run scammers.

I probably would restrict the number of Free Listings. Perhaps only 20 or 50 maximum --- in a year.

My idea would be to encourage new sellers while protecting both customers from baffled newbies, and eBay's bottom line from the newbie screwups. Because human nature.

 

And while I understand the reasons for the GSP,  I would have a Warning Box show up when a seller uses it telling her that it will be in place and asking her to confirm that she is willing to ship outside the USA.

And I would make Fixed Price items valued under $50 ineligible for the GSP, as a protection for the naive seller.

 

What would you do?

 

 

 

 

Well, maybe I'm not a fancy gentleman like you, with your... very fine hat. But I do business. We're here for business.-- Mal Reynolds

http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/8/82063/2261875-tumblr_ltai1txkde1qkabpmo1_500.jpg

Message 39 of 41
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Re: ebay getting cheap on free listings


@femmefan1946 wrote:

 

What would you do?

 


I know this wasn't directed to me, but I hope you don't mind if I add a postscript to all my babbling above.  

 

You have some very good suggestions, especially with respect to eBay going public.  I had a little fantasy in that regard that had I had an opportunity to be at that boardroom table years ago, I might go even further and suggest something that would blow their narrow-minded corporate sock off -- a co-operative (or to put it less terrifyingly for capitalists, a private shareholder consortium of millions).  Make sellers stakeholders.  Why?  As you say, human nature. 

 

Of course, this fantasy would have to take into account the occasional nasty, scamming sellers who came to the old eBay to rip off and run.  But perhaps it would be possible to charge a sort of "club membership" fee to list here, then reward successful and top quality sellers with stock options.  Now wouldn't that be an incentive! 

 

Many companies do have a version of this scenario that works exceptionally well.  Sadly, when eBay needed capitalization, they turned to the same old recipe -- go public, let the high rollers enjoy themselves, and to heck with the consequences.  

 

I don't know about voting rights in my scenario.  That could get a bit sticky, although not impossible to solve. However, a company whose board was answerable to the people actually using the site, either directly or indirectly (through user representatives), well, there's my fantasy.  

 

Gimme a break everybody.  It's a perfect, sunny, summer day, great for daydreaming.  Woman Happy

Message 40 of 41
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