new ebay rates

aa-surplus
Community Member
Hi all ok whats with the large increase in the ebay rates?
wow they are really going for a big one this time

I would like to know how other people feel about this and if anyone from ebay can inform us to why the large increase in fees???

they are all in effect feb 18,2005

Cheers,

aa-surplus
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new ebay rates

ellingtons
Community Member
"I dont mind dealing with idiot customers as they arise but giving them the power to affect all future sales is now in my opinion "Totally Ridiculous".

I am tired of trying to avoid negs because to do so means to not operate my business as a business man should, and give in to each customers demands, regardless of how stupid and costly they are."

I'm getting pretty damn sick of this too. Just got another moron buyer who after being sent an invoice, replied very curteously with "are you high on drugs with that shipping?". Gee, thats always nice to wake up to. It never ceases to amaze how unapologetically rude and stupid people are when hiding behind their computers.
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shoplineca
Community Member
ellingtons
Amazing isnt it?

I am a Business Consultant and almost everything I do to be an eBay Power Seller, to maintain my FB averages, to remain a Silver Power Seller, goes against how I would advise people to run their businesses.

I have bought and sold businesses. I have started my own businesses from the ground up and not one of those businesses would ever have been as successful as they were if I ran them similar to how I am expected to do business on eBay.

Never, in business when dealing with a supplier of product or service would a price increase be able to go through without reason and discussion, at least with its principle customer base (I am not talking about the retail business).

However should we talk retail stores, then acceptance of an increase in what they charge will be reflected in a decline in business.

The big difference with eBay is that Power Sellers are more than ocassional shoppers, we have all invested considerably both financially and time-wise into selling on eBay.

What eBay has done is shoved our investment into our faces and said "Dont like it? Go elsewhere"

This type of attitude is not done in a manufacturing evironment where one speaks to the biggest of their customers and discusses the need for an increase as being something positive for its customers as well.

In this case, eBay has for a second year in a row, increased its fees while not providing any additional benefits to the Sellers for those increases.

This is one of the things that is wrong with this increase.

Once again, it is only for eBay's pockets with no further benefit to us for having to pay fees which we will not recover from our customers nor do we have much more room for trimming costs when hit by increased delivery charges and a strong dollar at the same time.

marcopoloca
I agree with Goldman Sachs that eBay would be a good investment however this increase may end up becoming the straw that breaks the camel's back and that investment had best be left as a short-term investment with a review in 4 months time.

I must state that more than anything else, I think that I am truly dissapointed in eBay. For a second year of increases in the 2 years I have been selling and I have seen a dramatic decline in the services offered, a decrease in the presence of Pinks, more automation most of which has had severe and almost crippling malfunctions, and a change to the My eBay that is less user friendly than the previous recap.

I am, truly dissapointed in eBay at this time.

Malcolm



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I don't agree with Goldman Sachs at all. They're categorically wrong. I don't think that they have a clue, any more than eBay does, as to what percentage of profit the Ebay/Paypal fees currently comprise now or will comprise after the increase takes affect. EBay, whether many sellers know it yet or not, is killing off the majority of its seller base. I believe that the attrition will be protracted and vast beyond eBay's worst nightmare paralleled only by their previous growth.
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rd1000
Community Member
I have invested a lot of time in eBay. I have put a lot of effort into getting my store up and running smoothly. I don't think I want to invest any more time and effort in a company that feels a 60% increase is good for me and my buyers. Who knows what the increase will be next time.

I am moving my store to a new auction site soon to be opened.

Rob
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Hello, I'm going to take chance and wade in here. I've been selling on eBay since 1998 and after reading this thread I've felt an extreme case of deja vu. sorry folks but seems I've heard all this griping somewhere before. anyone remember ePier? well if you don't that site was supposed to replace eBay because unlike eBay it was going to be FREE to list and they would hardly take any commission if your item sold - unlike eBay. a MASS exodus from eBay was planned and gripers in the SOAPBOX and TOWNSQUARE forums vowed to take there business to ePier and NEVER return! hey - guess what? there was NO TRAFFIC at ePier. you could list away free to your heart's content but you wouldn't be making any money since there weren't any customers to buy your stuff. and then ePier this wonderful free service so unlike big 'ol bad eBay decided hey - we'll start charging for our service. they were dead in the water pretty darn quick after that. and Ebay is STILL here! Same goes for YAHOO auctions. everyone was going to start sellin over at YAHOO and again fees were suddenly implenented buyers didn't materialize and that never happended either. so I'm a bit cynical on this boycott drive and new promised mass exodus. secondly, I never opened a store so I'm not particularly worried about the increases. and... why didn't I open a store...hmmmmm....because when stores started a few years back they were pretty much offering listing in them for free. can you see where I'm going with this? ----- here's an idea. how about diversification. (not putting all your eggs in on eBay basket?) Also....there are many sites out there that specialize in certain items. I sell music and I can sell at MUSICSTACK or GEMM if I so choose to SUPPLEMENT my eBay sales. both have high traffic in buyers interested in the type of merchandise I sell. There is a similar site for booksellers (can't remember the name offhand since I don't sell books) anyhow...Why would I through away 1000s of dollars in sales (eBay) just because I don't like the fee increases? I just won't use gallery, limit 10 days auctions to when I'm out of town (considering it a convenience fee) and build additional costs into my opening bid prices.
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Having looked into alternative auction sites available to Canadians Yahoo.ca seems to me to be the strongest and most viable. I've signed up and have started listing there. Wagglepop is compelling because there seems to be a groundswell of eBayers going there simply by virtue of the fact that they're starting up just as eBay is applying these increases. I've signed up for a store with them and will be interested to see how it grows. Odds are that it will go the way of ePier but, as the current anti-eBay... ...who knows? There will evidentally be a last straw, at some time, from eBay and if that time is now then Wagglepop will be the beneficiary.

I recall too that there was an auction site for books but don't recall its name either. Amazon seems to be specializing in auctioning books and other media.

I don't know that building the new fees into a higher opening bid will work because I don't see any reason to believe that eBay buyers will comply with spending any more money than they always have. The only way I can see of passing along the new costs is to increase my previously low shipping rates most of which aren't listed prior to the auction's close. I don't feel good about this, and it may affect my feedback rating, but I could probably stand to be a bit more severe.

I'm no longer going to use the gallery feature either. I'll miss it because my field of study is communications and I know that it's a visual world these days TV having made it so. I've always felt that it should be free anyway in that it increases sell-through and this is the higher integrity methodology that eBay should employ to increase its revenue - via productivity rather than relentlessly increasing its margin.

These increases came along just as I was contemplating calculating the eBay/PayPal fee totals (see the Fee Formula thread). For this reason I'm looking at this with an overview rather than at the nickle-and-dime levels that eBay is famous for obfuscating. The evening prior to the rate increases I determined that eBay/PayPal was taking a total of 20% of gross sales. I still haven't taken the time to calculate this total after the increases. This is diminutive, however, when eBay's take is compared to my own. My accountant, (girlfriend) is scrupulously meticulous so I know that no expense has been overlooked. In 2004 my eBay payments were 98% of my profit (not incl. auto expense). That is, they're making virtually the same amount of money as I am on my merchandise. Hereafter I'll be working for them. Notwithstanding the successes that we feel we have the eBay/PayPal payment totals are very high. Check this out. What are your total annual eBay/Paypal payments relative to your eBay profit? On average my margin turns out to be much lower than I expected. And eBay wants more. As a monopoly, too, it's more-than-likely that they'll continue this until the bleeding-dry of the sellers starts to adversely affect their own bottom line.

Incidentally there seems to be some indication, from a PowerSeller who's been in touch with eBay, that the large volume of recent store closures (I read 2000 somewhere) is causing them to rethink the new store fees. They're now losing at least $75K/m as a result of the closures. It costs a few cents per item, and some time, to cancel your store. If it's effective in reversing the store rate increase, however, then this will certainly be a cost effective undertaking. I will close mine.

In the meantime my listings have remained almost untouched since the announcement. My unlisted Valentine's day listings are staring at me - unrequited. This isn't from any accademic reasoning not to list, because it makes no sense not to list prior to the rate increases. Rather it just makes me sick to go to the eBay site now.

Marty
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rd1000
Community Member
We have decided today to close our store in the next few weeks. We are going to pursue others avenues of selling.

eBay will certainly be around for a long time. The small number of stores that close will not even put a small dent in the extra revenue they will rake in from just the monthly subscription increase. There were 132,000 stores in US before the fee increase. Now there is about 129,000. That is a reduction in subsciptions of $30,000/month, but an increase in February of $774,000/month. And we haven't even touched on International stores or FVF's yet.

eBay will not be feeling any pain. We have just decided that eBay stores are not the place for us to sell anymore. I suspect auctions will see a FVF of 8% soon.

Rob
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muminlaw
Community Member
That book site that no one seems to be able to remember is probably abebooks.com -- they're pretty well-known world-wide.
Glenda

Click here to go to my Store
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I saw an eBay parody called 'oBey' but this one's better:

http://ioffer.com/feepay/
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shoplineca
Community Member
I won, I won, I won a gold shooting star!

Malcolm
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**niko***
Community Member
FYI

eBay announced last week a change in its seller fee structure,
including increased fees on eBay Stores and certain features and
categories to take effect February 18
(http://auctionbytes.com/cab/abn/y05/m01/i12/s00). In the days
following the announcement, sellers have reacted strongly against the
increase and have circulated an online petition and launched protest
auctions. Of most concern to sellers seemed to be the rate of the
increase.

Some sellers say they have closed their eBay Stores, although no exact
numbers are available. eBay reported it had 224,000 Stores worldwide
at the end of the third quarter 2004 (September 30, 2004); and of
those, 143,000 were hosted on the U.S. site. eBay also reported it had
acquired 20.3 million new Stores listings during the third quarter,
versus 4.1 million new Stores listings in the third quarter of 2003.

The announcement of increased fees has angered sellers of all sizes.
The Professional eBay Seller's Alliance (PESA) issued a statement on
Monday to express their dismay. The group says it is composed of 600
of eBay's largest sellers accounting for over $1 billion in annual
eBay sales. The statement read in part:

<<<<Overall, our members are reporting that they will pay up to 22% more
to eBay than before the increase. That's unprecedented, and will have
broad marketplace implications.

The history and spirit of the eBay marketplace is one of partnership
between buyers, sellers and eBay. Historically, eBay has benefited
only when buyers and sellers have benefited.

Sadly, this price increase flies in the face of that partnership,
siphoning more and more value away from sellers and away from buyers
(when prices or shipping charges increase to cover the fees), and
towards eBay itself. This is at time when large sellers that comprise
PESA's membership have only seen a degradation of the quality of the
marketplace, rather than any substantive investments in its
improvement. Sadly, this will inhibit, rather than nourish the growth
of the eBay marketplace. While this may increase eBay revenue for a
quarter or two, it certainly does not bode well for eBay's growth.

Anecdotally, we already see eBay's top sellers beginning to focus
their attention on other channels based on this and other problems. We
hope to have data on this soon.>>>>>

PESA's Spring Summit to be held in March will include sessions on
multi-channel selling, and PESA founder Joe Cortese said there has
been an increase in registrations over the past week.

As sellers try to discuss ways to cope with the impact of fees on
their business, including exploring alternative marketplaces, some
report they have been sent warnings or suspended from eBay's
discussion boards. Accusations of forum censorship by eBay are not
new.

One group of users formed a Yahoo Group, in one member's words, "so
that us disgruntled sellers may voice our opinion without being
censored or banned from ebay discussion boards. A lot of us have been
warned, had our posts deleted and have been suspended." The group
named itself GreedBay, and had fewer than 300 members as of Monday.
Discussions included posts on ways to cope, including having members
send postcards to eBay CEO Meg Whitman, and opinions about other
auction sites. In this group and on other online auction discussion
boards, it seems there is no consensus on which marketplace is a
viable alternative to eBay.

There's also no doubt from reading letters and online posts that
sellers are taking the fee hike personally.

Carol Green of Houston, Missouri wrote, "This situation is a financial
death knell for many cottage industry folks and when America is at
war, we didn't need Ebay potentially destabilizing the economy -
especially when the "little guy", many of whom the husbands are out
fighting in Iraq for us, are hit the worst."

Another seller who wished to remain anonymous wrote, "The fact that
eBay took a price increase is surely not an issue. What is an issue is
the RATE of increase which, to a business person who has spent several
years developing an auction based business predicated on specific cost
parameters, is unconscionable. It is the height of arrogance to
believe they can pull off such a stunt with no competitive
repercussion...which indeed will probably be the case. I for one am
ready for some serious competition...I'll be the first one to post."

Some sellers speculate eBay's next bombshell move may be to institute
surcharge for 7-day listings. It already charges sellers an extra fee
to list a 10-day auction.

An online petition protesting the fees has been circulating since last
week (http://www.petitiononline.com/ebayfee/petition.html). One line
of the petition letter reads, "We protest that ebay should reconsider
the fee increase entirely, but if not possible, please do think about
not increasing the fees as much (some fees have double...or even
tripled!)."

As of Monday evening, the petition showed 16,284 online "signatures."

eBay will release last quarter's earnings on Wednesday. Bloomberg
reported Monday that eBay's fourth quarter net income could be the
company's biggest increase in six quarters. If true, it could further
fan the flames already burning in some eBay sellers.

Janet


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kenplate1211
Community Member
I guess Yahoo! Auction is the only option now, See ya eBay !!
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shoplineca
Community Member
eBay announced its 4th quarter revenues and while its profits are up 44% over last year, its share value did not meet expectations and that did not sit well with Wall Street.

Once again, it is a company with few assets, alot of revenue off our sweat, just another dot com that has been making some very poor business moves over the last year that are starting to catch up with it.

Malcolm
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sunset_sports_cards
Community Member
Just closed my store today! I am looking for greener pastures as we speak.
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Ebay's Price/Earnings ratio suggests that its true value is in the $20/share range.
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esellerauction
Community Member
I will close my store on the 18, I have already removed most of my stock. I have also signed up for wagglepop.
I cant believe that ebay would go so deep all at once why not a graduall increase this id crazy, cya later ebay.
My margins cant cut it and Iam tried of dealing with idiots who cant read. ITs not worth it any more.
Ebarf
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eBay will release last quarter's earnings on Wednesday. Bloomberg
reported Monday that eBay's fourth quarter net income could be the
company's biggest increase in six quarters.


Hmm... Guess not! Share prices down due to poorer than anticipated performance.
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esellerauction
Community Member
Why wait I closed it today.
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shooger
Community Member
What a disaster. I will be closing the store they tricked me into opening a couple months ago with their big push.

I am looking into wagglepop and other sites, which will undoubtably see a HUGE increase in business due to this.

Thanks eBay - been fun. Enjoy the ten grand or so. All you have going for you now is your name.
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rd1000
Community Member
Wagglepop is getting very interesting. There are hundreds and hundreds of very experiences sellers awaiting the launch of that site. It is a small number compared to ebay, but it is exciting to watch. I don't understand all the technical aspects, but apparently they have some very good capabilities built in for appearing in web searches.

I am watching it closely, and will be opening a store there.

Rob
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