Comments about the Global Shipping Program

[kalvin@ebay.com]

Feel free to share your thoughts about the Global Shipping Program here. 

A few questions to get the ball rolling:

• What has worked well for you with the Global Shipping Program?
• Any ideas to help improve the experience for Canadian buyers?
• What has deterred you from buying items offered using the Global Shipping Program?
• How have you managed to search for items outside the program?

Please try & keep the comments constructive 🙂

If you have any questions about the program, please post them here.

[deanzuk]

I have seen this legal scam from a big UK company when I had items shipped to Canada from the UK .The company concerned had no idea of the scam and were not happy about it at all and gave me a complete refund.

Here's how it works

The contractor says they will take care of all customs /import duties (sounds fair,right?) But what they do is,they deliberately process every single item through customs incurring any fees (if applicable) and then charge a small brokerage fee for doing it,which is passed onto the customer.

Any attempt to question it will be met with "we are not responsible for customs fees charged by Canada customs" which is true,but their brokerage fee is not,in any way, a charge from any government,it's just a bill for their services,which you didn't want in the first place.

Like I said,it's a "legal" but it's an unwanted intrusion to importing anything that is not in any way necessary.Just another contractor doing something that generates their own income.

A brilliant scam....nothing more,nothing less

[afantiques]

It is not a fraud, it is just a different way of importing stuff, mostly it is misused due the ignorance of sellers, but for heavy stuff it can be good value. For everything else just avoid sellers that use it. They will be the more clueless ones anyway.

[pierrelebel]

"with $19.99 I am seeing the import charges."

US$ 19.99 = appx Cdn$ 21.00+

[irishgurl2012]

Hi Pierre,

Do you know how much Pitney Bowes profit has increased since they were contracted to run the GPS.

Kind Regards

Karen

[pierrelebel]

The re-forwarding contract with eBay (Global Shipping) is a very small, minute in fact, portion of Pitney Bowes business.

Last year, their revenues were US$3,898,000,000. eBay GSP would not even account for 1% of that.

The net after tax profit by Pitney Bowes last year was $143,000,000.

Both revenues and net income were lower than the previous year.

For more financial information I recommend you use the official New York Stock Exchange link:

https://www.nyse.com/quote/XNYS:PBI

[sapphire318]

But this is a mule train charging Concord rates.

[deanzuk]

It's a different way of importing things that has produced 175 pages of complaints right here,is it not ?

[pocomocomputing]

---

@deanzuk wrote:

It's a different way of importing things that has produced 175 pages of complaints right here,is it not ?

---

More like 10 pages of complaints with 165 pages of discussions and comment and explanations of the GSP, Canada import duty limits by mail and application of GST, HST and provincial sales taxes.

[soucie]

Explain all you want....if it takes 150+ pages of "explanation" then it's a scam.....but yes not criminal as they have very smart people who figured out how to work within the system to extract more money and boost profit. The statement that it's a tiny percentage of PB revenue is laughable(does that make it OK?). They have business units big and small and each are expected to show profits and increased revenues. I guess the boys at that PB business unit are betting nice bonuses for a job well done. Maybe it's only 1% of their business, but maybe they grew it from 0.01%...on our Canadian dollars.

I'm sure a ponzie scheme is hard to explain if you don't know what it is and the first one could generate 150 pges of discussion.....but it's still a scam. A scam by Ebay? By PB? Both? All I know is I can buy the same item on Amazon and not incur a single import charge, either at time of ordering or at delivery by using USPS on lower cost items if it's manufactured in US. We have a Fair Trade agreement after all. The agreement and it's intentions are completely(Ebay is a big player) ruining this lower level of trade between Canada/US. The FT agreement is being ignored and they've essentially replaced or are actually administering their own duty charges with these Ebay/PB charges on US manufactured items.

It's just like I say for low dollar UPS/Fed Ex shipments on US manufactured items...they basically charge you a $30-$40 brokerage fees to tell you there is no duty. So they keep their brokerage firms in lots of work putting zeros and 0% on the forms and adding in the HST....$40 please and thanks. 

So all those low dollar China products with "free shipping"....lets go shopping! Everything else it's Amazon or elsewhere from now on. I know what I buy and I know what I've paid and Ebay just rewrote the book to make sure I pay wayyyyy more. Not this guy.

[lee508]

I just had one experience with global shipping and as a frequent buyer I will NEVER buy from a seller using this system ever again.  It's a TOTAL rip off. 

So when I do find something I like and the buyer is using global shipping, I just skip the item and go for etsy or amazon or another online seller.

It seems obvious to me that ebay could care less about it's canadian ebay customers.

---

kalvin@ebay.com wrote:

Feel free to share your thoughts about the Global Shipping Program here. 

A few questions to get the ball rolling:

• What has worked well for you with the Global Shipping Program? NO
• Any ideas to help improve the experience for Canadian buyers? REMOVE IT OR LET US OPT OUT
• What has deterred you from buying items offered using the Global Shipping Program? YES
• How have you managed to search for items outside the program? BY BUYING ELSEWHERE

Please try & keep the comments constructive 🙂

If you have any questions about the program, please post them here.

---

[ubid-ikill]

The Global Shipping Program is a scam run by Pitney Bowes and participated in by Ebay. I once purchased an item from a seller using this program and it cost me nearly 4 times the amount in shipping and customs duties as it would have if the seller had sent the item through the postal system. This is nothing more then a scam and Ebay needs to get out of it. We buyers are suckers from purchasing anything from any seller who uses this program.

Here is another point. The GSP does not provide any more security against items being lost, miss-delivered, or damaged by their delivery agents which in most cases are contracted courier companies, then the postal system does. Pitney Bowes makes a point of saying this in their fine print and offers no reimbursement to buyers or sellers should any of the above happen. The fact that the GSP charges import duties and claims that the buyer won't have to pay anything more upon delivery is an out and out lie. Ebay is going to be facing a class action law suit if they don't drop the GSP. I refuse to buy from any seller who uses it and I suggest to all who read this, to do the same and pass the word to anyone else who buys anything on Ebay. The Global Shipping Program is a scam pure and simple and Ebay buying into this program is damaging it's own credibility and integrity. It's long overdue when Ebay should show some backbone, step up to the plate and drop the GSP. Of course that takes some intelligent management, something Ebay has been soaring lacking in recent years.

[marvin-miller]

The global shipping program stinks. 

I've bought several items through this program and deliveries are, at least, twice as long as purchases not using the global shipping program. 

Most recently, I bought two enterprise class hard drives for a server that is dangerously close to losing date. 

The drives were bought on the 15th of July and their scheduled delivery date is August the 2nd, which is a Saturday and we have no Saturday delivery. This means a delivery of August 4 more then HALF A MONTH after purchase. 

HALF A MONTH is the typical time it takes me to get an item from CHINA. Yet, my hard drives were ordered from Florida. 

Like everyone else, I've now learned that any item listed through the Global Shipping Program is going to be skipped over by me. We simply can't afford a useless time sucking 'feature' like this. 

We'll contact the seller and tell them about our experience and that we will NOT buy from them again if they list their items through the Global Shipping Program - which, in case you haven't figured it out yet - STINKS!

[jean-philippe.vert]

---

@marvin-miller wrote:

The drives were bought on the 15th of July and their scheduled delivery date is August the 2nd, which is a Saturday and we have no Saturday delivery. This means a delivery of August 4 more then HALF A MONTH after purchase. 

---

15 days (half a month) is the usual delay for something crossing the border, GSP or not. I always plan 3 weeks delivery when I buy from USA.

[pierrelebel]

"scheduled delivery date is August the 2nd"

That is an approximation, nothing else.

August 2nd is a Saturday, Monday August 4th is a Holiday in many provinces of Canada.  Either way, do not expect Americans to be aware of these things.

Quite possibly, since there will be no delay at Customs, your purchase may be delivered before the end of the month.

Please keep us posted.

[cerebus]

The original survey questions were as follows:

1. What has worked well for you with the Global Shipping Program?
2. Any ideas to help improve the experience for Canadian buyers?
3. What has deterred you from buying items offered using the Global Shipping Program?
4. How have you managed to search for items outside the program?

Here are my responses to those questions:

(1)  As a buyer (never a seller), absolutely NOTHING has "worked well" for me with eBay's Global Shipping Program.  As a Canadian, I cringe when I see that an American buyer has opted 'into' the program, because now I know (or at least suspect) that their USA-to-Canada postage and handling rate will probably be unreasonable OR it will price their item beyond that item's value.

(2)  One idea that I have which would "help improve the experience for Canadian buyers" is -- GET RID of the program!  At the very, VERY least, eliminate or reduce the automatic additional import charge on items with stated values under $30.  Here's another idea:  recommend to sellers that they DO NOT opt into the program for items which are priced under $20 or which will likely end with winning bids under $20.

(3)  As noted above, what has "deterred" me from buying or even bidding on items from sellers that are using the GSP is, well, the GSP itself, and its dire financial consequences for the winning bidder.  Here's a perfect example... I was recently looking at a relatively small, lightweight item that has a very reasonable $6.79 'Buy It Now' price.  Unfortunately, that American seller has opted into GSP's program.  Therefore, their default USA-to-Canada postage fee for that item is an outrageous $16.95 (!!!).  That means my total expense for that item (if I chose to buy it) would be almost $24.... roughly three times the value of the item itself.

Obviously, it would make NO financial sense for me to buy that item from that seller.... and so my search continues!  Meanwhile, that buyer has now lost a potential sale.  Prior to the implementation of the GSP, I am certain they had a much more reasonable international shipping amount, and we probably would have been able to do business.  But not today.

Something else that has "deterred" me is the automatic and seemingly random 'import charge' that the program adds to the shipping fee when an item passes a certain price threshold (seemingly around $20).  I don't believe it is fair that a third party is arbitrarily charging a fee that, under normal circumstances, MIGHT NOT EVEN BE DEMANDED by the recipient's own customs agency!  And don't even get me STARTED on the fact that a 3rd-party delivery service is involved !  Yeah, no likelihood that something just might go wrong when you add even MORE hands and machines to the shipping process!

(4)  Frankly, eBay has made it very difficult to search for items outside of the program.  Using the price filter ("price + shipping, lowest first") is one crude method, as is searching via www.eBay.ca only.  One thing is for sure:  my eBay purchases have gone way, WAY down (roughly by 50%) since the program was put in place for Canadian buyers.  And now I hear that the GSP was expanded yesterday to include six more countries!  Yay!  That's six more countries from which sales will eventually decline for American-based eBay sellers!  (Yup, that was sarcasm.)  

Anyway, thanks for allowing me to chip in my two cents (for all the good it'll likely do....).

[afantiques]

Something else that has "deterred" me is the automatic and seemingly random 'import charge' that the program adds to the shipping fee when an item passes a certain price threshold (seemingly around $20).  I don't believe it is fair that a third party is arbitrarily charging a fee that, under normal circumstances, MIGHT NOT EVEN BE DEMANDED by the recipient's own customs agency!

Unhappily it is entirely 'fair' since it is a legal requirement. GSP items are imported as freight and import sales taxes start at CAN$20.

Postal  stuff is treated in a different manner and taxable items are often not taxed. This does not make then not taxable.

Your other points are entirely reasonable and are the usual objections anyone with any sense has to this scheme.

[cerebus]

---

@afantiques wrote:

Unhappily it is entirely 'fair' since it is a legal requirement. GSP items are imported as freight and import sales taxes start at CAN$20.  Postal  stuff is treated in a different manner and taxable items are often not taxed. 

---

Yes, all valid points.  However, in the 'old days' (before the dreaded GSP), the USA-based seller at least had the OPTION to write $20 (or less) as the stated "value" of their parcel's contents, even if (oops!) the item being sent might have an actual value of $21 or, heck, even more.  Legal?  Likely not.  Common?  Absolutely.  Now the extra import fee is imposed no matter what, even if a bidding war may have bumped the winning bid just beyond $20 for an item that would normally be valued by the seller under $20.

Also, what guarantee (if any) is there that the government of the recipient's country (in my case, Canada) is eventually receiving 100% of the collected import amount, and that a portion isn't going right into eBay and Paypal's respective pockets?  Therefore, there is no value in the GSP for the recipient at all.  None.  Zero.  But then, we all know that already, right?

[dmil8030]

<<in the 'old days' (before the dreaded GSP), the USA-based seller at least had the OPTION to write $20 (or less)

as the stated "value" of their parcel's contents,>>

Hello 'cerebus',

I'm not sure if it is reasonable to say that sellers had the "option" to lower the declared value.  Doing that

is considered a serious offence.  Some would do it, sure, but it's risky and foolish, -- they could get into

legal trouble.  It still happens, usually only because the seller does not know that it is forbidden by law to

knowingly lower the value of a purchased item.  Most sellers will not do it and don't like to be asked.

See for yourself how valuation works:

http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/pub/bsf5000-eng.html

The value of any item is the price paid for it.  This is stated very clearly:

"You have to use the first of the six methods, the transaction value method, whenever possible to

determine the customs value of imported goods."

There are, of course, times when your cousin sends you that antique thing of Gran's so he has to

decide what value to declare, most likely using "transaction value of similar goods".

<<Now the extra import fee is imposed no matter what,>>

Only on GSP listed items, so best to avoid those.  You are right that users cannot know what they will

ultimately have to pay with a GPS auction.  If the start bid is 9.99, anyone foolish enough to bid $20+ (US)

may be in for a nasty surprise.  But it's a mistake not many will make a second time.

<<what guarantee (if any) is there that the government of the recipient's country (in my case, Canada) is

eventually receiving 100% of the collected import amount,>>

Pitney Bowes will have that well arranged.  Ever buy from Amazon US?  If your order totals more than

$20 Cdn, the charges are on automatically.  It's always been that way with some of those larger retailers.

You can be sure the amounts are transferred to Canada.

The law requires a company like Pitney Bowes to add on the charges.  There's no way they'd do otherwise.

In the good ol' days of regular USPS mail, parcels were handed off to Canada Post to collect the import

charges.  It just happened that CP couldn't be bothered with small amounts, - it would cost more to collect

than what the government would receive.

However, any item with a declared value over $20 was always subject to taxes and duties.

<<there is no value in the GSP for the recipient at all.>>

It depends who you mean by 'recipient'.  The Canadian Government gets the taxes (and duties),

Pitney Bowes gets the contracts, the American seller gets the sale and then gets to wash his hands of it

after the item lands in Kentucky, ebay gets their fees, the US gets more of our Canadian dollars, . . .

so that just leaves the Canadian buyer, . . . 

[cerebus]

All valid points!  However ---

Under the previous system (pre-GSP), there was a chance, and usually a pretty good one, that Canada Customs would 'waive' (or not even bother with) the duty and taxes on a package arriving from the States even when the declared value was $20 or more.  Many packages with a written value over $20 would sometimes sail right through, as if they were not worth their bother (I assume). 

However, under eBay's GSP, even the remote chance of that happy accident is gone.  The extra amount is charged "up front," with no subsequent chance of avoidance.  Reason #476 to avoid USA-based sellers who opt into the GSP for inexpensive items. 

(As for Amazon, I tend to stick with Amazon.ca anyway!)

[dmil8030]

Hi again, 'cerebus',

<<Under the previous system (pre-GSP), there was a chance ... that Canada Customs would 'waive' ... the duty and taxes>>

Quite so.  And if you steadfastly refuse to buy from a GSP seller, then for you nothing will have changed.

<<Many packages with a written value over $20 would sometimes sail right through>>

Absolutely.  Compared to many I'm a bit of a 'piddly' shopper, but in over 12 years of buying internationally online

I have rarely had to pay the import charges on Canada Post items.  I am always prepared to pay, cheerfully and

willingly.  So far the most expensive I have had without charge was a work of art sent Priority with a loudly declared

value of $500, and the lowest amount I have had to pay on was a porcelain figurine sent First Class and valued at $46.

It's always a gamble, but the odds are decidedly in the buyer's favour, and I greatly enjoy rolling the dice.

<<However, under eBay's GSP, even the remote chance of that happy accident is gone>>

hahaha, Right!   So do like most buyers with good sense and don't buy from them.  I would rather stick pins

in my eyeballs than buy from a GSP seller.  No fun at all.

Happy shopping!