eBay

silresiste · ‎02-14-2023

TIL I learned that a bid can be retracted at exactly the same time the auction ends.

I was keeping tabs on a computer, and intended to bid in the dying moments of the auction. Two hours before the end of the auction, someone doubled the bid to $3,500, only to retract it an hour later. An hour (or 59 minutes to be precise) before the auction ended, the same bidder once again increased their bid by more than $1,250, for a total amounting to nearly $3,100 – way out of my budget. The bid was retracted again, but this time the retraction took place at exactly the same time the auction ended.

This really does not strike me as fair, and it is unfortunate such practices would be allowed, particularly when you look deeper into the history of the bidder who retracted the bid. The person made 21 retractions over the past 12 months. One would have hoped that eBay would clamp down on such practices.

reallynicestamps · ‎02-15-2023

You may have found one of the few actual instances of shill bidding I've seen reported.

Most "shill" reports turn out to be a losing bidder who does not know how automatic bidding works.

The two clues are the multiple retractions (are they with the same seller?) and that shill bidders do not want to win, they want the other bidder to win at the highest price they can push.

I take it you did not bid at all, and that you were not the high/winning bidder.

Could you post the number of the listing?

Posters who know more about Auctions than I do will be interested.

silresiste · ‎02-15-2023

I did not bid.

Here's the number of the listing: 404145577053.

msau4301 · ‎02-15-2023

Thanks for posting this, I did not realize a bid could be retracted at the last second either! While there are tons of snipers who jump in at the last second with a bid I didn't even think about someone retracting. There was a posting here earlier in the week with someone wondering why they got an outbid message yet the item sold for less than they were trying to bid. Could have been similar situation, maybe they tried to bid and it wasn't accepted because of a higher bid that ended up being retracted at the last second.

This should definitely not be allowed, especially if as you say you can see they made 21 retractions over past year. Seems suspiciously like they were only trying to drive the price up which could be the seller using a different id or friend, both of which are absolutely not allowed but I don't know how you can even report another bidder. We can report a buyer or seller but not a bidder that I know of especialy with the id being scrambled/protected when you look at history.

Maybe you could reach out to the seller, tell them the situate you had been interested in an item but noticed this unusual bidding/retracting and ask if they know what happened. Not that it will change what happened but see if they seem to be aware or not, If they ignore you it would seem suspicious on their part to me!

rocketscollectibles · ‎02-15-2023

To be honest i hang a lot on eBay and i can spot scams almost everyday. They don't care. I stopped reporting scammers selling counterfeits as authentic because i noticed the listings are never taken down and the sellers always stays free to list

I spotted a seller literally today doing clear shill bidding. Investigating his items sold he has the same (0) feedback bidder on every single item past 90-days (i can match with number of bids / % of bids on seller). Every item won by this bidder was cancelled and relisted. And this bidder still have active bids right now on the seller active auctions

It's really weird to me that they don't have a team investigating and they let everything being dealt by an automatic system. There's stories of legit sellers getting banned, while some scammers don't

lotzofuniquegoodies · ‎02-15-2023

@silresiste wrote:
TIL I learned that a bid can be retracted at exactly the same time the auction ends.

I was keeping tabs on a computer, and intended to bid in the dying moments of the auction. Two hours before the end of the auction, someone doubled the bid to $3,500, only to retract it an hour later. An hour (or 59 minutes to be precise) before the auction ended, the same bidder once again increased their bid by more than $1,250, for a total amounting to nearly $3,100 – way out of my budget. The bid was retracted again, but this time the retraction took place at exactly the same time the auction ended.

This really does not strike me as fair, and it is unfortunate such practices would be allowed, particularly when you look deeper into the history of the bidder who retracted the bid. The person made 21 retractions over the past 12 months. One would have hoped that eBay would clamp down on such practices.

There is a slight possibility the the buyer who placed that last bid and cancelled made an honest error/typo. Very easy to happen when rushing. (I believe many moons ago you had to put in a reason for the cancellation but not sure if this is still the case.) They realized and retracting bumping your bid out of existence. So for you just bad timing. The red flag would be the history of cancelling/retracting. Sounds a bit fishy. And understandably frustrating.

-Lotz

As a side, another way a bid can be messed up is by inserting a comma instead of a period. It deletes the comma and adds 2 zeros to the bid. (<~~~~guilty of this occuring as charged...Why I no longer bid in haste)

reallynicestamps · ‎02-15-2023

I don't know how to do a screenshot.

There were four bidders .

Starting bid $1750 5/2

First bid 7/2 -$1750- but an automatic bid with high bid concealed (FB93)

Secondbid (FB0) on 9/2 -$1775 -stays for three days, so higher than first (FB93). (FB0) is now high bidder

Third bid 12/2 is (FB19) - who bids at 3:05:17 raising high bid to $1800

Fourth bid 12/2 is (FB 142)- at 3:05:32 of $3080 which would show as a high bid of $1775 to (FB0)

Fifth is (FB19) at 3:05:38- raising to $1800.

(FB0) stops bidding.

(FB142) bids $3500 Feb 12 at 3:05:32 and retracts at 4:01:13

(FB142) bids once more at 4:01:27 This time $3080 and retracts at 5:00:00

Leaving(FB19) the winner at $1800- only two increments above starting bid.

The retracted bids were pulled just before the one hour deadline in each case.

silresiste · ‎02-15-2023

I understand that the bids were retracted just before the one-hour deadline.

eBay's policy states a bid may be retracted:

If there are 12 hours or more left before the listing ends, all of your bids can be retracted
If the listing is ending in less than 12 hours, you can retract your most recent bid if it's been less than an hour since you placed it

However I would humbly submit there's more to consider than simply those two factors.

The eBay policy also plainly states that in "some situations you can retract your bid." It stipulates that a bidder may retract a bid if it falls under one of three conditions.

The seller significantly changed the description of the item (which is not the case here)
You accidentally bid the wrong amount. (Once perhaps. But twice, within the last hour of the bid?)
You can't reach the seller.

It should be incumbent on the bidder to demonstrate he has met one of the three conditions before being able to retract the bid, particularly in cases where a suspicious bid was made an hour (or less) before the end of the auction. In other words, the policy should be read in whole, not just in snippets.

But policies hold little value if not enforced.

brettjet38 · ‎02-16-2023

@rocketscollectibles "It's really weird to me that they don't have a team investigating and they let everything being dealt by an automatic system."

Humans cost too mush $$$ too the bottom line, automation baby, automation...

...and of course

https://www.digitalcommerce360.com/2023/02/08/ebay-job-cuts/#:~:text=EBay%20will%20lay%20off%204,aft....

EBay will lay off 4% of its workforce, about 500 employees, as the online marketplace struggles with declining sales.

EBay Inc. is cutting about 500 employees — or 4% of its workforce — as the ecommerce company continues to face slower consumer spending after a brief pandemic boom.

marnotom! · ‎02-16-2023

@rocketscollectibles wrote:

To be honest i hang a lot on eBay and i can spot scams almost everyday. They don't care. I stopped reporting scammers selling counterfeits as authentic because i noticed the listings are never taken down and the sellers always stays free to list

I don't think you'd appreciate it if your listings were taken down based on a single buyer complaint. It takes a village of eBayers to shut down a seller.