eBay

stevesrecords · ‎10-27-2013

For some reason,I have been having trouble selling many of my lps on ebay,especially the expensive ones. I have noticed this has been problem from time to time over the years,but it seems to have gotten much worse in the last couple years or so. I have two very expensive lps on ebay now which I had to relist for lower prices because they didnt sell the first time I listed them. If you look at my items you will see them. One of them is the Swinging Blue Jeans -Dont Make Me Over. This is actually my third time trying this one,and as I say in the title of the listing a vg+ copy sold for $963. There is a link in that listing which shows many other copies and the prices they sold for. My copy is mint-,cover in shrink, so should easily get $1000 on the basis of what others sold for,but it has no bids yet at only $500,and not even any watchers. The other lp Conrad Benjamin has many watchers but no bidders,and that one has sold many times for $600 -$800,and it has been lowered down to $400.

Anyhow ,I cant stop thinking about why this keeps happening over and over. Is it because Im Canadian,or maybe my unconnected uder id,or maybe just the way I set up the listing including the description? I have 100% positive fb,so it obviously isnt that to blame. Any help is greatly appreciated.

rose-dee · ‎10-28-2013

Hi 'poco' - I understand what you're saying about computers and fonts, I was actually speaking from a marketing and advertising perspective, having spent many years in that field.

There are two schools of thought on this: either make it plain vanilla sans-serif Arial, so that everybody, no matter how old and cumbersome or how small and poor in resolution his computer is, will be able to read it, or make it beautiful and exciting, knowing you may be cutting out some people (or at least making it more difficult for them to read).

Now I was taking a look at the OP's listing text from my laptop, which is an HP with Windows 7, only a couple of years old, and I could honestly barely read it (not that my vision is great). It looked really small, virtually illegible on my laptop, and, what I thought was worse, completely dull and uninteresting as advertising copy. My apologies to the OP by the way, I don't mean to be insulting, but the actual impact of the description is another piece of the picture to consider.

I wonder, 'poco', in light of what you've said, why the text wouldn't have adjusted itself to a more normal reading size on my laptop. It looked like about 6 or 8pt, which is far too small to comfortably read on a screen. I realize that users can manually adjust the viewing size of their text, but if a buyer is browsing from one seller to another, this could get rather cumbersome. From my viewpoint however, the real problem was the unexciting and unprofessional look of the text for an item for which the OP was asking $499 (I believe that was the price?).

I would say from my own observations on eBay that many - in fact a majority -- of sellers don't appreciate that their listing descriptions are in fact advertising copy. They really, mostly, don't make use of tools that are available to give visual impact and style to their listing text. And it's really not hard to do.

I certainly would never advise using a weird or bizarre or really arcane font type (like Blackadder or some of the "script" fonts). However, Verdana and Tahoma are employed a great deal in web design -- they are sans-serif, but have a classy, stylish look that Arial just can't match. Of course to advertising and marketing people, fonts are a huge subject of interest and importance! People have made their fortunes and careers on designing new ones, and you're right, the Europeans are especially good at this.

I generally prepare my listings on my main PC, and check them on my laptop. Because I sell antique sewing patterns and other vintage items, I use "Georgia", which I admit is a bit of an arcane font, but the serif fonts are more appropriate for "antique" advertising. I prepare the text in Auctiva, using generally 14 or 16pt. I do see the font size adjustment you refer to when viewing on my laptop, but it's not drastic, perhaps a couple of points. I just think that if the OP sticks with the miniscule font he's using, he may be causing a lot of potential buyers some real problems. I certainly found it very difficult to read his description because of the tiny size, and as I said, I'm not using an older device.

From an advertiser's point of view, there is also the issue of word recognition and ambiguity using sans-serif fonts. Especially with narrow fonts like Arial and Helvetica many letters are undifferentiated and can cause confusion or difficulty in comprehension for that reason. These fonts were originally designed to maximize the use of print space (on paper) and minimize production issues (and costs), which is why Arial was such a revolutionary font and became extremely popular. They spilled over into the computer industry as a result, but neither font is known for its high legibility. For that, the book and magazine trade still prefers the serif typefaces.

To give an example, in Arial and other fonts in that family, I's look exactly like l's. (that was "I" and "l"). The font in brackets was Times New Roman, and you can see the difference between the letters. In the narrow sans-serif fonts, you can also get problems of visual run-together in very small sizes, where the word gets hard to read because the font is so plain and closely packed. These are issues marketers, advertisers, designers and print media people really grapple with, believe me! I've sat in meetings where hours were spent looking at and debating the merits of fonts.

This long-winded dissertation is probably more than anyone here ever wanted to know about font design and advertising, but it's the other side of the coin. My personal favourite font? Palatino Linotype - an elegant, flowing, calming and easily-read font that isn't too much "in your face". And yes, fonts are actually described in the trade as having personalities or characters!

So I suppose the OP has to make a choice between a completely universal font or a more stylish and impactful font that may possibly be an issue for some people. The reason I suggested 14pt is that on devices that shrink the font size (to say 12 or 10pt) it will still be comfortably readable , whereas on other devices it will look relatively normal.

I would think that most newer mobile devices and computers can handle font reading from eBay. Or perhaps eBay has managed this issue somehow? You know, I think this is my next Wednesday's question for the "Pinks"!

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bb_cool_stuff · ‎10-27-2013

I have no experience in your category, however Recped is a regular poster & very experienced in your category.

Recped usually chimes in daily & could probably offer you some assistance.

mr.elmwood · ‎10-27-2013

That whole "Woe is me" description has what to do with the widget? I found that to be a complete turn-off. Description is difficult to read as it looks like one long run-on sentence.

I went looking for relevant info and it was hard to pick out.

Why are you explaining shipping? At that price level it should be included, not an add-on. You have something rare and valuable, I get that. The listing does not scream "buy me".

eBay states quite cllearly that buyers do not read. The average buyer likes 1-2 syllable words. Sentences of 7-10 wrords. 2-3 sentences per paragraph.

Actual best practsie is bullet points.

Yeah, I'm blunt. Direct and to the point. You have something worth selling, sell it like it is worth the effort.

I have found that newly listed always does better than that which has been languishing. Pull the listing for a while. Relist with all the bells and whistles and it will be at the top of "best match". Buyers will see it as a new listing. They like that.

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stevesrecords · ‎10-27-2013

thanks alot mr elmwood. I was sondering about whether or not it was a good idea to explain that invention and how it ties into my userid. I just put that in there this time around,but will be taking it out now .

Perhaps you are right about the shipping. The fact that shipping is expensive ,especially internationally ,may be an extra turn off. I certainly dont mind paying for shipping if it sells for the going rate or even close to it. In fact I think I will end the auction for swinging blue jeans lp and put free shipping in the title,for those who seen it listed again,but passed because of that.

You say the listing doesnt scream buy me. Do you think the description is too short,or that the title should be more captivating?

stevesrecords · ‎10-27-2013

I just changed the grading on the swinging blue jeans lp from mint- to vg++ since I cleaned it again and had a very close look at it under bright light. Anyhow I was thinking maybe buyers just thought I was probably overgrading it, now maybe they will see I am trying to be as accurate as possible.

mr.elmwood · ‎10-27-2013

Ask around, I am not known for coddling one's feelings. I would toss the whole description as almost none of it has anything to do with what you are selling. Feedback, shipping, price, comparables, have what to do with a collector filling in an empty spot in their collection?

You need to sell the value of what you have. You should be using all 12 free pictures. I am a collector slamming down a pile of money, "Show me what ya got". I want to see both sides, closeup of the label, both sides of the cover, both sides of the sleeve, pictures of each end, particularly the spine.

Then, after I have done up this piece de resistance, I would double the price.

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stevesrecords · ‎10-27-2013

thanks again mr elmwood,I have added a pic of the label ,since I did state in the description there were some light smudge marks on it. Now I am thinking I will add several more pics too,it sure cant hurt. I did delete almost all of the description ,but I left the link to the other copies that sold,since I do think that this could help should someone care to check them out. Its at the bottom of the page anyhow ,so I dont see how it would turn buyers away.

rose-dee · ‎10-27-2013

I have to agree with Mr. Elmwood (except I usually try to be very mannerly ) - I took a look at the item you mention, and I honestly had difficulty understanding what it was, let alone its importance. I would start your listing description over from square one, including the title (delete any reference to value in the title, it's probably more a turn-off for buyers than an attractant). Consider paying for a subtitle to expand on the description (not to mention value though - let the buyer determine whether your price is good value).

If I were you, if this is a key collectible, I'd use a larger, more readable font as a start. Then I'd explain exactly what this item is (first edition, rare cut, produced/distributed by whom, etc. etc.). Is that one of (some of) the Beatles I see on the cover? Make hay of that! The fact I had trouble making out what was on the cover is a problem - try to get a clearer photo for your main gallery picture.

You should really be able to fill at least 2 or 3 paragraphs (or a 1/3rd page of point-form text) just describing what this record is. You could also quote any liner/cover notes from the sleeve, for more interest.

Then you can go on to carefully describe the condition. Give any provenance you might have (check Wikipedia or other sources for background information on the release, but be careful to paraphrase, not quote); give a bit of the history behind the record -- all the things that would be interesting to buyers and a confirmation to knowledgeable collectors that you know your business inside out.

Make the whole thing as lively and interesting and as full of detail as you can. After all, you're asking someone to pay several hundred dollars sight unseen. And as Mr. E. says, once you've got it properly featured, try a higher price. If you think one recently sold for ca. $900 on eBay, why say it, do it!

Also don't forget that by including more (and more detailed) description, you may be casting a wider net on eBay and getting better visibility. Yes, absolutely, don't forget about lots of good pictures too.

stevesrecords · ‎10-27-2013

thanks Rosee Dee I will certainly heed some of that advice. Thats not the Beatles,its the Swinging Blue Jeans. Dont know how much more descriptive I can get than ,other than adding title,and label which of course Ive done. I know they look like the Beatles by the wya,and they were on the same label and came out at exactly the same time. Anyhow I dont really think thats the problem,that being that buyers dont know what it is. Its liste in the records category and has all the specifics too. I maybe will try the subtitle tough,and maybe the bold type. I did add a brighter photo for the gallery pic,hope that will help. Anyhow there are already 3 watchers after only 4 hrs ,after relisting it with all the changes,so thats much better than before since I had none after a day and a half. Thanks to everyone again for the tips. I can handles the honsesty if I think it will get me the sale,and I think it will.

rose-dee · ‎10-27-2013

You're so welcome! I'm happy my comments might have helped.

Sometimes it's amazing how revamping a listing can make a difference - and I think the more problems with a listing, the more the revamping makes a difference.

Even decent listings can benefit from a bit of "tweaking". I had a rather expensive item (about $375) listed for months, and although the pictures were great, the description thorough and informative, and it was getting excellent search placement, it just wasn't selling. I changed the listing frame to a totally different colour and style, revised a bit of the text, added a subtitle, and it sold within a couple of weeks.

Good luck!

mr.elmwood · ‎10-27-2013

Normally, I get crying, sniffle-sniffle, in response to my "advice". Odd how folks will ask questions, get answers, and then not like the answers. Well, like, if ya don't like the answer, don't ask the question. "There is no crying on eBay."

Go and look at what other records selelrs are doing for description. Take the best of what they are doing and add it to the best of what you are doing.

eBay, search, and sales, have changed dramatically over the last six months. A lot of what used to work no longer does. I remember when 20 million listings was a lot. Now, what is it, 500 million or whatever Pierre quoted?

One can be as unique as one can, but, that is a pretty big ocean we are swimming in.

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2011limey1 · ‎10-27-2013

Although not a seller, I love reading all the boards to get a gist of all that's going on. Yikes, I remember The Swinging Blue Jeans well - shouldn't have said that now you'll really know how old I am - well they ARE or were from Manchester where I'm from. As you know, they had a couple of hits but weren't "up there" in the English Invasion. I'm totally amazed what the price is going for, but you're the seller and have the experience I don't have. Agreed, the first pic, the guy on the left looks amazingly like George Harrison. As you know there's a real resurrgence of vinyl these days, but still can't get over the price. I can't seem to get rid of my vinyls, some really good ones, because of sentimental value, but maybe I should go through them! Also I totally agree with the advice of all the posters.

rose-dee · ‎10-27-2013

@2011limey1 wrote:
I remember The Swinging Blue Jeans well -- they ARE or were from Manchester where I'm from. As you know, they had a couple of hits but weren't "up there" in the English Invasion.

LOL! I think you've just given the OP some more great details to add to his description...

Thanks for the information on this -- I really thought that guy was George Harrison, maybe a pre-Beatles group, although it didn't make a lot of sense compared to what I know of the history of the Beatles. Yes, I've heard vinyl is HOT - who would have guessed? Time to dig through those old boxes in the basement.

femmefan1946 · ‎10-27-2013

Do you have a scanner?

Scanning a flat thing, like a record sleeve not only gives you a square picture , instead of skewed, with no light flare, but allows you to zoom in on tiny points.

We use this in our stamp listings and it is an important selling point.

rose-dee · ‎10-27-2013

Uh-oh -- you need to remove that html from the bottom of your listing description. I won't say more, but trust me, just do it asap.

You now have more photos, but I'd use 'femme-fan's' advice about scanning at least the main section of the cover -- it's still at such a difficult angle in the photos, and there's a lot of reflected glare.

Your listing description is still in such a miniscule font that it's almost unreadable (and very unexciting for such an expensive item). My suggestion for the description: use no smaller than 14pt font, preferably in a clear but interesting font style like Verdana, Trebuchet or Times New Roman.

Put the description in a bulleted listed (see below for example of bulleted list), consisting of several points, rather than all in one long string of text. EBay provides these text editing tools on the listing page, in a line at the top of the description frame.

You haven't added any of the information that might be of interest from the record, such as:

List the songs on the record -- yes, these are in the photo, but list them clearly in the description too
Give some information about the group, the release date, the publisher/producer -- don't assume that only savvy collectors of 60's rock & roll will be interested in this item

mr.elmwood · ‎10-27-2013

Rose-dee, the new Mr E.

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rose-dee · ‎10-27-2013

@mr.elmwood wrote:
Rose-dee, the new Mr E.

Pardon?

Oh, you mean we're in line with our opinions - fancy that! I still think I'm a mite more polite most days.

pocomocomputing · ‎10-27-2013

Regarding fonts and font size.

I use fonts that are the "standard" for most computers and browsers. These are "Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif". Arial is the most common font on windows PCs and Helvetica on Apple computers. These fonts are installed on most computers by default so the potential buyers will have these basic fonts installed on their computers. Both are similar in size and style so your listings will look the same on both computer platforms as well as on smartphones.

Using these fonts minimizes issues with buyers. These fonts are what they see the most often on their computer and are user "neutral". If you use another font that you like, well, others may not like it.

As for font size, what is the correct font size today? There is none. The variety of display sizes and browsers used and user browser setting and customized setting means you should not have a font size in your listings. What looks good to you on your computer and display may be too large or too small for others. If you are using a large computer display to create your listings, then you may think that a large font is right to use. But someone looking at your listing using a smaller display will think your font is huge.

So I recommend no font size. What will happen is that the buyer's browser default font size will be used. So if the buyer has set his browser up with a larger font because they have a large display, it will resize appropriately. If the buyer has a small display, it will resize appropriately to their browser settings.

One could even say that no font style be chosen and let the user browser settings make the decisions for them.

You can still use font options like Bold, Italics and Underline as well as selective use of font Color to add some design to your listings to emphasize section headers or key points you make. The users browser setting will render these correctly for whatever setting they have chosen. (Watch out for overuse of font colors, please no rainbow lisitngs!)

Listings editors used by eBay and third party listing services are from a time when computer display were smaller and few options existed (3-4 sizes). Today there should be an option to remove font size and font style in the editors. One you have chosen them, you are stuck with your choices unless you manually edit the HTML. There should also be a button for relative font size increase and decrease which says to just increase or decrease the existing font size (from user browser default) (HTML has this font option available). This would allow you another tool for adding style to help emphasize key points in a listing.

My opinions. I spent a lot of time on eBay listings templates and designs and styles out of curiosity over the years. Quite an interesting subject.

PS here is some info on sans-serif if you are curious why it is used on computer displays. (from Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sans-serif)

In typography, a sans-serif, sans serif, Gothic, san serif or simply sans typeface is one that does not have the small projecting features called "serifs" at the end of strokes. The term comes from the French word sans, meaning "without". Sans-serif fonts tend to have less line width variation than serif fonts.

In print, sans-serif fonts are used for headlines rather than for body text. The conventional wisdom holds that serifs help guide the eye along the lines in large blocks of text. Sans-serifs, however, have acquired considerable acceptance for body text in Europe.

Sans-serif fonts have become the most prevalent for display of text on computer screens. This is partly because interlaced screens have shown twittering on the fine details of the horizontal serifs. Additionally, on lower-resolution digital displays, fine details like serifs may disappear or appear too large.

brandeentertainment · ‎10-28-2013

Off topic how is your little carrying tool working out for you ..

pocomocomputing · ‎10-28-2013

@mr.elmwood wrote:
Rose-dee, the new Mr E.

Halloween coming up. Is Mr.E. pulling a Mr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde? LOL. Just kidding.

I did notice a new Mr. E. Much more helpful and more informative than before. Worth reading your posts for some ideas and tidbits of info to think about. Much less of the eBay.com Seller Central "attitude". Didn't your mom tell you not to hang around "bad" boys? LOL.

I also prefer that you post under Mr.Elmwood which is you active account and not your inactive account. It eliminates the replies that say you are not an active seller when you posted under the other eBay ID.

Besides the Mister in Mr.Elmwood sounds "cooler". Dating myself. I should say the Mister sounds "AWEsome!". LOL again.