Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-25-2016 05:27 PM
Hello :
Fairly new to selling on EBay. Right now I am limiting my sales to Canada and the US. Wanted to expand to International but looking for some advice when it comes to shipping. As I understand it without a tracking mechanism I am open to dishonest buyers and a host of other problems, but the tracking shipping options at least from Canada Post are very costly for any International buyer. The difference between Small Packet International Air and Tracked Packet International is almost 5X expensive. Seems a bit ridiculous as to the price difference
If I was selling low value items it would probably be worth the risk of a no tracking shipping option. I guess it all depends on how much one is willing to risk, but curious to others opinions or suggestions.
Cheers
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-25-2016 06:27 PM - edited 12-25-2016 06:27 PM
Low value depends asmuch on how much you pay for your items as it does how much they sell for.
It is a LOT easier to write off a bad transaction if you paid out $10 on your $100 sale than if you paid out $50 or $75 for your $100.
And your costs include eBay and Paypal fees, your labour to write up and photograph your items, bubblewrap, and.... here's the tricky bit... Cookie Jar Insurance.
That last is how many sellers handle the high cost of tracking. We put a few pennies, rarely more than a dime, into our asking price as a sort of self-insurance premium. If (and problems really are rare in most categories) we get a complaint from our customer we can refund from the virtual Cookie Jar of premiums, without involving eBay and raising the possibility of Defects.
Now my customers (I have several IDs) are a very reliable bunch. They tend to read and to like following directions (philatelists and seamstresses, creative and intelligent, but very law-abiding). So my risks are quite low.
Are your computer geeks belligerent sorts? Or are they comfortable with working out sensible solutions to a real problem?
Would they be likely to fake a problem ? Do you get snippy questions about the progress of your shipments after a day or two or polite enquiries after a few weeks?
Because people are people no matter where they live. If you have snippy customers now, your international buyers will be no better.
You can do several things to protect yourself.
You can Block countries when you go international. I block Brazil, Israel and Italy , basically because they have poor postal services. But I have no problems with customers from the former Soviet Union.
But again, my categories are not your categories.
You can upgrade shipping. I generally use Free Shipping, but on very high value lots going to new customers I will use a tracked service. We are not permitted to charge more for upgrading the service and it is very bad form to downgrade (slower but cheaper) without the buyer's permission.
Which brings up buyers who ask for cheaper shipping. The only answer is NO. That is almost inevitably a scam. If the sale seems worth it, of course, you could decrease the shipping charges WITHOUT actually changing the service. Annoys the heck out of scammers when they have to sign for something they planned to claim was never delivered.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-25-2016 10:03 PM
@bpl521_sell wrote:
... The difference between Small Packet International Air and Tracked Packet International is almost 5X expensive. Seems a bit ridiculous as to the price difference
If I was selling low value items it would probably be worth the risk of a no tracking shipping option. I guess it all depends on how much one is willing to risk, but curious to others opinions or suggestions.
At the low weight end tracked has a big price spread over small packet, a lot closer at the higher rates.
2016 UK rates (until January 16th) for comparison:
000-200g .. 8.78 ... Light Packet
000-250g .. 9.78 ... Small packet (air)
000-250g .. 45.48 ... Tracked packet
201-300g .. 13.46 ... Light Packet
251-500g .. 19.55 ... Small packet (air)
301-500g .. 24.57 ... Light Packet
251-500g .. 48.35 ... Tracked packet
500g-1kg .. 38.34 ... Small packet (air)
500g-1kg .. 58.88 ... Tracked packet
1.0-1.5kg .. 47.98 ... Small packet (air)
1.0-1.5kg .. 65.32 ... Tracked packet
1.5-2.0kg .. 57.62 ... Small packet (air)
1.5-2.0kg .. 72.53 ... Tracked packet
Tracked packet does get a discount if bought through paypal, small packet does not.
...
Most of the stuff I ship worldwide goes via Small Packet, from time to time I will use Expedited for the bigger, more $$ items. The only claims for INR that I have paid are for Canada and the USA (but that's for my product mix).
Small packet does have the small advantage that the label looks like it has tracking (so less scam attraction). The barcode can be scanned when you dropped off: I ask for an originate scan with printed receipt when I drop the parcel off.
The disadvantage with Small Packet International is that eBay believes Canada Post's estimate of delivery time. Canada Post has one estimate for ALL the world. While reasonable for the UK and most of Europe -- seriously wrong for other parts of the world. So you can end up with "late" defects (particularly Australia) from eBay because the delivery time estimate is bad.
...
Pet peeve: Small Packet to Australia (in 2016, based on my shipments) is 15 to 18 business days (Canada Post says 6 to 10 business days). I make a point of letting my Australian buyers know when to expect their purchase since the eBay estimate (based on Canada Post) is too short.
-..-
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-26-2016 05:42 AM
Thanks for the comments. I don't have a product line of business that I am selling, just want to get rid of years worth of electronic equipment I have collected over the years. Looks like I need to weigh the risk of offering a lower cost shipping option for buyers vs accepting the risk of someone pulling the wool over my eyes and putting in a not received complaint without me having proof of delivery. I guess in the end you win some lose some.<g>
Has anyone had any luck with arguing with Ebay having proof of a a scanned originate scan on the shipping receipt or is it more or less the buyer always wins?
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-26-2016 08:33 AM
@bpl521_sell wrote:
Has anyone had any luck with arguing with Ebay having proof of a a scanned originate scan on the shipping receipt or is it more or less the buyer always wins?
Proof of shipment is meaningless in an Item Not Received claim so fas as ebay and paypal are concerned. It's Proof of Delivery that counts: scanned proof of delivery available via tracking. Feedback Left as an indicator of receipt of product is also inconsequential.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-26-2016 08:34 AM
In other words, to borrow your phrase, the buyer is always right.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-26-2016 03:06 PM
I don't have a product line of business that I am selling, just want to get rid of years worth of electronic equipment I have collected over the years.
Then frankly your 'procurement cost' becomes only the fees, packaging, and postage, plus the labour associated. The actual product is 'stuff I found in my basement' and has zero cost. *
I used to have a lot of that when I started. I think it was nearly four years before I bought anything for resale.
And that probably halves your potential losses if things go pear-shaped.
*Practically speaking of course. It will obviously have value to your customers.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-26-2016 09:08 PM
@ypdc_dennis wrote:2016 UK rates (until January 16th) for comparison:
1.5-2.0kg .. 57.62 ... Small packet (air)
1.5-2.0kg .. 72.53 ... Tracked packet
-..-
Strange how Canada Post limits the weight of Tracked Packet USA to 1kg, yet International Tracked Packet is 2Kg.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-26-2016 09:29 PM
But to answer your question, yes, for cheaper items ship without tracking. Most buyers aren't out to get you. If the item is very expensive, ship via better options.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-26-2016 09:31 PM
And in reply to your post about the weight limits for Tracked Packet, it's because Canada Post wants to stay within the confines of Small Packet weight restrictions. Small Packet to the US is limited to 1kg while international is limited to 2kg.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-27-2016 05:37 AM
@theafkgamer wrote:
Most buyers aren't out to get you. If the item is very expensive, ship via better options.
Yes, I think you are right, most people are truly honest. If a scammer wants to screw you over they are probably can go at other ways as filing claim the item is not what was described etc.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-27-2016 05:48 AM
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-27-2016 02:17 PM
Small packet does have the small advantage that the label looks like it has tracking (so less scam attraction).
This is an important point.
It's smoke and mirrors, but most of the scammers on eBay are occasional or opportunistic.
The best defense is a good offense. Make cheating look hard.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-28-2016 02:53 PM
@femmefan1946 wrote:
Small packet does have the small advantage that the label looks like it has tracking (so less scam attraction).
Is that a label from printing on the PayPal site or from a Post Office.?
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-30-2016 04:57 PM
PayPal. But it does have "No delivery scan" right by the scan code so I don't know how many scammers it would prevent. I imagine the post office might put a UPC on it too but I've never purchased small packet postage there.
The code is useful if you use a third party to insure your label as when the po scans it they can give you a receipt. If you put in an insurance claim, that receipt would help prove that you did mail it. It would also be useful to have a receipt if the buyer claimed the purchase an unauthorized credit card charge.
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12-30-2016 07:36 PM - edited 12-30-2016 07:40 PM
@bpl521_sell wrote:
Fairly new to selling on EBay. Right now I am limiting my sales to Canada and the US. Wanted to expand to International but looking for some advice when it comes to shipping. As I understand it without a tracking mechanism I am open to dishonest buyers and a host of other problems, but the tracking shipping options at least from Canada Post are very costly for any International buyer. The difference between Small Packet International Air and Tracked Packet International is almost 5X expensive. Seems a bit ridiculous as to the price difference
Here is my opinion, for what it's worth: You can work around losses (cookie jar or other insurance, or low procurement cost), you can deal with INRs (through using tracking strategically, i.e. for possible problem destinations), you can restrict where you actually ship to, and you can probably still deal with Canada Post international shipping prices by using Light/Small Packet if your items are the appropriate size and weight.
But what you will have difficulty managing are eBay's delivery expectations for international destinations. Even long-experienced sellers are having problems with this. And if your monthly sales volume is fairly low, the defects for late delivery will be more critical.
Here is frankly what I'd do. Given that you're selling excess personal items, stick with Canada and the U.S. for another few months. Keep a chart recording the destination of each sale. If you find that the large majority of your sales (say, over 75%) are to the U.S. at the end of that period (which I'd be willing to bet will be the case), chances are that will remain the pattern for you.
In that case, international sales will be unlikely to greatly increase your income, at least not without a lot more time, expense, and trouble on your part. The way I regard it is that the result must justify the input. The higher your percentage of U.S. sales, the less attractive selling internationally is likely to be, at least not until eBay changes some of its policies and procedures and shipping costs decrease, neither of which is probable.
So instead of looking beyond North America, try doing whatever you can to appeal to your primary target customers -- free or subsidized shipping, regular discounts/sales, special promos for U.S. buyers (or Canadian, as the case may be), etc. etc. There are a number of ways you can get creative with marketing to your main customer base, and in my opinion, given eBay's unjustifiable international delivery estimates and related defect policy, you'll have a lot fewer headaches. I find that Small and Light Packet are very reliable to the U.S., and have always arrived within eBay's delivery time frame, so it's far easier to use non-tracked shipping to the U.S. than overseas and still avoid defects.
The alternative might be to pick a handful of specific, less problematic overseas countries to ship to (those with reliable postal systems), and exclude all other destinations for a few months until you see whether shipping outside Canada and the U.S. is really worth it. Check these boards for sellers' opinions on what the reliable and "easier" countries are to ship to. Personally I ship only to Europe, Japan, Australia, NZ, and a few other select places internationally, although Australia has apparently become an issue recently with respect to delivery times.
I think if you were intending to launch a business with expansion plans, it might be a different story, but not to simply sell off personal items for extra cash.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-30-2016 08:09 PM
A comment on your eBay condition in your recent listings. If I look at your Amtel listing, the eBay Condition is Used with your condition note stating "Used item. Some minor scratches. Tested and appears to be functional, but selling as-is."
The eBay condition you selected is Used: which means according to eBay "An item that has been used previously. The item may have some signs of cosmetic wear, but is fully operational and functions as intended. This item may be a floor model or store return that has been used. See the seller’s listing for full details and description of any imperfections."
Please note if the buyer finds something wrong with the item, the buyer can return the item despite the As-Is declaration.
Some of your other recent listings also state As-Is so be careful because stating As-Is in the description does not override the eBay Used definition of operational and working.
I just want to give you a heads up on the eBay definition of condition Used and the use of As-Is in the description.
Your listings have a 14-day return policy as well as the eBay 30 day Money Back Guarantee. So the As-Is disclaimer is very weak.
Some eBay categories have a condition "For parts or not working" which means it may or may not work. However, this may have less buyers interested in the item and stop a sale so listing as you currently do is the best way to sell the item but be prepared for returns if there are issues with the item.
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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12-30-2016 08:24 PM - edited 12-30-2016 08:25 PM
@bpl521_sell wrote:
@femmefan1946 wrote:
Small packet does have the small advantage that the label looks like it has tracking (so less scam attraction).
Is that a label from printing on the PayPal site or from a Post Office.?
Both Paypal and the Canada Post website (using Solutions for Small Business) produce labels with the bar code. I think over-the-counter just sticks on a bar code (but I could be wrong).
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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01-03-2017 02:24 PM
@pocomocomputing wrote:A comment on your eBay condition in your recent listings. If I look at your Amtel listing, the eBay Condition is Used with your condition note stating "Used item. Some minor scratches. Tested and appears to be functional, but selling as-is."
The eBay condition you selected is Used: which means according to eBay "An item that has been used previously. The item may have some signs of cosmetic wear, but is fully operational and functions as intended. This item may be a floor model or store return that has been used. See the seller’s listing for full details and description of any imperfections."
Please note if the buyer finds something wrong with the item, the buyer can return the item despite the As-Is declaration.
Good advice, issue with some electronics is unless you can completely test them with 100% certainty how does one ensure it is 100% functional. Wish Ebay had a different category for this. I want to be completely honest, as far as my testing it works. Maybe it's better to put them down as for used, parts not working and put in the description it works?
Too funny though, but after but after listing it three times, it sold quickly once I advertised free shipping
Re: Selling/Shipping Internationally
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01-03-2017 02:28 PM
@rose-dee wrote:
But what you will have difficulty managing are eBay's delivery expectations for international destinations. Even long-experienced sellers are having problems with this. And if your monthly sales volume is fairly low, the defects for late delivery will be more critical.
Here is frankly what I'd do. Given that you're selling excess personal items, stick with Canada and the U.S. for another few months. Keep a chart recording the destination of each sale. If you find that the large majority of your sales (say, over 75%) are to the U.S. at the end of that period (which I'd be willing to bet will be the case), chances are that will remain the pattern for you.
Very good advice, thank you. Shipping Internationally may not even be worth it for me. Shipping is outrageous and unless there is someone who REALLY wants the item, just can't see a large audience. I am not willing to ship anything untracked unless it is low value under $20.00.

