Third Party Insurance... links to websites and more

[cumos55]

There has been a lot of discussion with respect to third part insurance.

Here are links to

(1) Shipsurance --- Link to

http://www.shipsurance.com/

(2) U-Pic Insurance --- link to

http://www.u-pic.com/

Are there other third party insurance companies?  and if so links  would help

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Google these names  and find more information on the internet.

Considerations

(1) Cost

(2) Coverage

(3) Acceptable countries.

(4) Countries they will not insure....  and that could include certain locations in the US (a surprise) and perhaps even Canada

(5) Claims process......  documentation required to file a claim....

The important thing here is to read carefully... several times....  study their FAQ.... and then internet information.

and if you still have questions  ask the company...... 

I have no personal experience with third-party insurance....  However, there are many here who have used this form of insurance....

Perhaps the most important thing to do is read, and read more... ask questions..

From personal experience  I spent two months of reading, and understanding,  before I  sold my first item on eBay... and used Paypal.....and that was 10 years ago...  Things  have changed ...   and there is a lot more to read today....

Each insurance company has its pluses and negatives....  study the company information  and look for what they do say... and perhaps more important.... what one company says and the other does not say

[pierrelebel]

"All postal clerk may not be that accommodating"

Lucky for me, I have been dealing with the same people for nearly twenty years in friendly Belleville.

And yes, I bring them a box of chocolate, or cookies, every Christmas (as I do for the girls at the bank). 🙂

[recped]

"All postal clerk may not be that accommodating"

So true! I have two postal outlets close by, at one if I reached across the counter to grab their cancellation stamp he would quickly push it towards me.

At the other if I tried something like that I'm quite sure the police would be called, this is the same outlet where EVERYTHING has to be individually tested to see if they fit the O/S Lettermail slot and I get the 10 second blank stare when I hand over an Expedited package with pre-printed postage.

[i*m-still-here]

I just called U-pic and was told that they do not require the stamp from the PO  that shipsurance does.

That is.......... you can buy paypal shipping on line, purchase U-pic insurance, and drop the item in the mail box for Small and light packet shipments without tracking.

They, do, of course require a signed statement if the item doesn't arrive but I was also told there "there are ways around that."

[cumos55]

There is something called...   I would rather be safe than sorry.

Even though U-pic does not require  some form of Canada Post stamp to verify that the parcel was delivered to the Post office... Getting it should not be a problem.

It is a verification that the parcel was mailed.

and

" There are ways around that"   ---- Trying to beat the system... does not work...There are rules that must be followed to get a claim.... and they should be followed.

Not having the buyer's letter that the parcel was not received   could end up with a seller  not getting the insurance money...

[i*m-still-here]

Ahhh........... and it goes on and on and on................

[cumos55]

U-Pic  and filing a claim....

The requirement for a receipt depends on the carrier used to deliver the parcel to the buyer.

http://delta.u-pic.com/Claims/ClaimInstructions.aspx

[i*m-still-here]

U.-pic  pic pic...............

Yesterday I spoke with a rep and a manager at U-pic (as well as at shipsurance).

U-pic told me that no stamp from the PO or anywhere else is necessary to process a successful claim with them with small or light packet shipments.

So, perhaps for those who do not want to stand in line at the PO for this "stamp" that shipsurance and InsurePost require and still want to buy TPI .............

U-pic may be a viable option.  

If you do want to use TPI and stand in line at the PO for the stamp then by all means do so.  I'm sure U-pic won't mind.

I also told them that I was going to post that information here and they were fine with that.

When my discussion with U-pic turned to non-English speaking countries and "The Letter."  U-pic told told me that there are ways around the letter.

No one is suggesting that anyone should try to beat the system.  (That was quite a leap.)

I simply passed the information on as it was told to me.

That said:

In the past a lot of us bought on line shipping labels in tandem with Third Party Insurance.  Did anyone ever stand in line for the stamp that shipsurance and InsurePost now require???

Anyone?

[cumos55]

The basics for Third-Party Insurance are here

Links to several insurance companies have been included .

The most important thing for each seller  to do is read  about the insurance offered,  and decide if it fits into their shipping options.

Canada Post threw many into a difficult situation when insurance was no longer available with Small Packet, USA or International.  This was particularly significant for parcels weighing 500 grams or less where Tracked Parket was an expensive option..

Third Party insurance has its place.....

As one can see there can be several views of the same program.... Each seller has to decide  if it can be used  and how.

The next few months are a transition period for many sellers... as well as  the insurance companies....   Their rules may change  specifically with respect to Canadian sellers using a third party option to obtain full insurance of a parcel  as opposed to supplementary insurance to what was already offered by Canada Post... specifically Small Packet.

I personally feel that a seller should have a receipt indicating the parcel was delivered to Canada Post.... This requirement for a receipt  may differ among insurance companies.... and there is no guarantee that, in future,  this will not be required by all Third-party insurance companies...

Direct delivery to the post office would be the best option to obtain a receipt.

What I would hate to see is someone not having a receipt and then learning  that the rules have change...

As I have already stated... Better safe than sorry.

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A part of the process in making an insurance claim is to contact the carrier, (Canada Post)  in order to trace a parcel..

What can Canada Post say? 

The only thing Canada Post can say is that you have a receipt when the parcel was delivered to the post office....  Nothing can be traced beyond that delivery.

It is the buyer who confirms whether the parcel was delivered... or... not delivered...

[cumos55]

 It is the buyer who confirms whether the parcel was received ... or... not received.

[pocomocomputing]

But if you use PayPal shipping labels, why should a post office spend the time to give your a receipt for proof of mailing? Nothing says that they have to do this. Since they did not get any money from the PayPal sale of postage, what incentive does a RPO have to spend time on non-paying customers? I can see RPOs and even PO refusing to provide proof of mailing because they did not sell the postage.

[bb_cool_stuff]

I am going to agree with you Poco.

Was mentioned previously by the Manager at one of the two RPOs i deal with. They make no money scanning Paypal labels yet they spend their own Labour Costs doing it.

There is nothing in it for the PO or a RPO.

If this happens often enough somehow i see a service charge being added. I'm sure this is being monitored.

[pjcdn2005]

If you take your package to a postal outlet they do receive a small amount from CP for the parcel even though you didn't buy your postage there so there is a benefit if you take your package there rather than put it in an outside mailbox. I suppose some grouchy counter person might refuse to do it but if all they have to do is stamp the bottom half of the original paypal shipping label, I would hope that most would do it. I wouldn't expect them to fill out any sort of receipt though.

[pjcdn2005]

They make no money scanning Paypal labels yet they spend their own Labour Costs doing it.

They do make money but from what I have heard, it is very small. Scanning the paypal labels if part of their job...they are contracted by CP to look after customers and we have purchased a CP label so we are a customer. It shouldn't matter how we purchased the label.

[i*m-still-here]

These posts strongly suggest that no one  knew about this stamp prior to this thread and/or ever used it ????

Sorry poco……….. but that information was buried in a long post from you and even though I know you didn't like it..... I suspect that had I not asked you to clarify your initial post that it would have remained that way..... 🙂 ;).

Does anyone even know what they are supposed to stamp?

I picture them stamping the portion of shipping label that I keep from the paypal print out and............. even if co-operative............. the clerk would still be very puzzled by my request.

In the States most sellers have the PO pick up the parcels.

For a long time they could not purchase first class shipping on line (the equivalent of our small packets) and so requiring the stamp would have meant that sellers using FC mail would not have bought shipsurance.

Now that they can buy FC shipping on line, they just have to do is get the pick-up person stamp something.

A couple days ago, when I spoke with shipsuracne they thought we have the same arrangement and that the driver can simply stamp the receipt as they do in the States.

They had no idea that in the Canadian system procuring the stamp requires a trip to the PO....................

[pierrelebel]

"They do make money but from what I have heard, it is very small"

That is correct. The system (franchise agreement) was changed about eight to ten years ago where the franchisee now gets a much smaller amount on postage sold but collect on all other services provided. Usually, their largest money maker is now box rental.

"Was mentioned previously by the Manager at one of the two RPOs i deal with. They make no money scanning Paypal labels yet they spend their own Labour Costs doing it."

It is quite possible (probable) the manager you deal with is not familiar with the financial arrangements governing the franchise agreement with Canada Post. I have experienced the same thing here at one postal station where the friendly postal station manager stated "I do not know. The deal was made with the owner."

[cumos55]

Both Shipsurance and U-pic are located in California.

They are well acquainted with the US situation, something most evident on the websites.

Canada, Canadian sellers and Canada Post may become a bigger part of their business..  This in itself may make it necessary for the insurance companies to add a section in their claims process specific for Canada and Canada Post, in a manner similar to USPS.

One might anticipate that any set of rules specific for Canada Post would be similar if not the same as the rules for USPS.

[bb_cool_stuff]

I guess that makes sense Pierre.

Offer one service at an inexpensive rate as per CP agreement  & hopefully increase revenues with other services.

One seems to be a busy RPO but i would say the majority of their postal boxes are still for rent according to tags on them.

The manager is a good person but spends the majority of his time merchandising away from his postal duties. Probably was having a tough day.

Wonder if Nick has to merchandise on the floor along with his postal duties. I guess that would be determined by management.

Management will probably think this adds to the bottom line. Having a staff member do two jobs for the wage of one.

We see that everyday in a lot of businesses especially with utility baseball players.

[pocomocomputing]

These posts strongly suggest that no one  knew about this stamp prior to this thread and/or ever used it ????

Sorry poco……….. but that information was buried in a long post from you and even though I know you didn't like it..... I suspect that had I not asked you to clarify your initial post that it would have remained that way..... 🙂 ;).

Does anyone even know what they are supposed to stamp?

I picture them stamping the portion of shipping label that I keep from the paypal print out and............. even if co-operative............. the clerk would still be very puzzled by my request.

In the States most sellers have the PO pick up the parcels.

For a long time they could not purchase first class shipping on line (the equivalent of our small packets) and so requiring the stamp would have meant that sellers using FC mail would not have bought shipsurance.

Now that they can buy FC shipping on line, they just have to do is get the pick-up person stamp something.

A couple days ago, when I spoke with shipsuracne they thought we have the same arrangement and that the driver can simply stamp the receipt as they do in the States.

They had no idea that in the Canadian system procuring the stamp requires a trip to the PO....................

Buried ??????

Post 10 is where I first stated the need for proof of mailing. While a longer detailed post, it was all about the need for proof of mailing.Why you had to repetitively ask in subsequent posts about it is beyond me.

But it is typical of you to go on and on in a topic not understanding and posting so much while saying so little.

[i*m-still-here]

One thing to consider with third party insurance is how to supply "proof of mailing" the item. A old topic was started before Christmas on the subject and forgotten by most. 

If you read the Insurepost terms here

http://www.insurepost.com/terms.asp

how do you meet the "proof of shipping" part of the agreement. The terms are orientated to USA USPS shipping where there tracking is possible on everything, and acceptance scans are available for proof of mailing.

If you use PayPal shipping for Small Packet, all you get is a "tracking" number that is proof of purcahse of the Small Packet service. There is no way to get proof of mailing even if you bring it to the Post Office?

Here are the terms from insurepost

Please note: In the event of a loss claim, we will require proof of mailing. Acceptable proof includes:
- USPS receipt
- PayPal screen shot of the shipping label or printout
- Endicia Dazzle postage log
- Stamps.com log
- Customs Declaration page with date stamp
- USPS Click N Ship Online Label Record
- Tracking Number (but MUST state Accepted or Arrival).

Additionally, you must provide proof that the shipping carrier received your package for mailing.

Placing a stamp on a package or using a meter machine is NOT ACCEPTABLE proof of mailing.

Now I emailed insurepost on this topic (13 Jan 2013) and the answer was that proof of mailing would be required.

"We have covered Light and Small Packets for years, and will continue to do so. We have also paid many claims on these types of shipments! We have removed the $100 of free coverage for Small Packets.

However, we do require some type of acceptance into the mail flow. Having an acceptance scan (or acceptance stamp) from the post office is what we need to prove an article was placed in the mail flow."

Now shipsurance says they have paid out many claims of Light Packet and Small packet in the past. How? Technically not by PayPal shipping so maybe by sellers who go to the post office and get the CN22 customs form stamped?

This seems to me that a seller has no coverage using Small Packet USA or International unless they bring the package to the post office, pay there and get a receipt for purchase from the PO. Now since it is stamped (still true now that there is no insurance from CP??) on the back of the CN22 form, you have proof of mailing??? Maybe not since you can just take the package with you and not mail it then and there.

So if proof of mailing is required by third party insurers and it is not possible to get proof of mailing (not through PayPal for sure if you drop off in the corner mailbox), then the third party insurers have a huge loophole to avoid paying out on insurance claims.

I will email insurepost to comment here directly in this topic.

PS cumos55, why are you starting a topic in eBay.ca Weekly Board Hour Session. It should be in the Seller Central, no. This forum is reserved for the weekly session.

Poco.......... this is your post #3 and what I was asking you to clarify all along.

You accuse me of long posts................ but man......... really?

I simply asked you to clarify what you posted.

Not sure why you experience that as offensive???