eBay

vitvol · ‎07-26-2016

On the 4th of June, a guy purchased a computer fan from me. The next day, on the 5th, i sent it to him via Canada Post (my local courier). I only charged $12CAD for shipping so it was sent by Small Packet Ground (which i imagine is by boat), which takes 4-6 weeks to reach the buyers country (France). Post Canada does not offer tracking when shipped by small packet ground and that's was the cheapest option to ship the item. Less than three weeks after the item was sent, the buyer opened a case directly with paypal (never contacted me or anything) to ask for a full refund. His reasoning was that i, the seller, did not ship the item... I have the receipt which i showed him AND payal the pictures off of and even offered paypal to send it to them for proof. All they were asking is a tracking number and there's absolutely no way of proving anything with those folks unless you have a tracking number. The item was fully refunded to the buyer, i lost ~$40CAD for the item and shipping and the guy left a negative feedback on my account as if i've never shipped the item.

How ridiculous is that? I answered every message the buyer sent me. Offered proof that the item was shipped (clear pictures of the receipt showing his address etc) and he simply opens a case prior to 4 weeks (which is the minimal amount of time for the item to reach the buyer), gets a full refund and leaves a false negative feedback *which i'm actually trying hard to keep at 100%*?

I contact Ebay and they're telling me the same thing Paypal did, without tracking we can't do anything for you. What is the receipt for? In what kind of business a receipt isn't proof of purchase or sending an item in my case? Then i ask them how is it that this impatient buyer is able to leave false negative feedback on my account? They told me its fair for the ebay community and they're unable to remove it... I lost my item, money and have a false feedback on my account. Why is this acceptable for a seller who had a perfect account ever since i made it over a year ago? Where is the **bleep** seller protection, Ebay? Absolutely disgusting.

snoopwiz · ‎07-26-2016

so it was sent by Small Packet Ground

I am sorry this happened to you however...... That specific listing would have shown your buyer (on their order details paged) that you were going to be shipping by Canada Post Light Packet International with a delivery time of 5-11 business days.

I have no doubt you shipped the fan. I have no doubt your buyer either has received it or will receive it but, the ebay and PayPal seller protection is pretty straight forward in requiring a visible on line tracking number.

I know you lost money on the transaction, I know how it sucks to not only lose money but get a red donut for your trouble. I strongly suggest you try working with your buyer on revising their feed-back. If unsure how, please return to this board for guidance. If that does not work, you should come up with a non-emotional, factual reply to their feedback. There are many on this board who would happily help you with that. Many/most future buyers can and will judge you by your response to the negative.

I can tell by all your other feedback that you are a great seller and I would buy from you in a heart-beat. Again, sorry this happened to you

ypdc_dennis · ‎07-26-2016

@vitvol wrote:
... a guy purchased a computer fan from me. The next day, i sent it to him via Canada Post. I only charged $12CAD for shipping so it was sent by Small Packet Ground (which i imagine is by boat), which takes 4-6 weeks to reach the buyers country (France). Post Canada does not offer tracking when shipped by small packet ground and that's was the cheapest option to ship the item.

Never use Canada Post Small Packet International Surface to ship stuff on eBay -- it takes far too long (the time standard is 4 to 12 weeks / 1 to 3 months).

See: https://www.canadapost.ca/tools/pg/manual/PGpsus_int-e.asp

Some sales are not worth having.

For your items that have international shipping only give a price for air service. If they really want it they will pay for it.

-..-

Did you check your order details to see what eBay promised the customer for shipping time? That can give the buyer unrealistic expectations.

Small packet does have a bar code with number, not trackable online, but sometimes useful to reassure the buyer.

-..-

ricarmic · ‎07-26-2016

Unfortunately the golden rule is "never ship surface".....for this very reason.

If they help, here are links to earlier board threads where I give some examples of what I do/use in these situations.

Feel free to use anything that works for your situation... you'll have to customize because in your case, they will eventually get the item, they've already provided negative feedback, and it looks like they're frustrated with how it was handled. That will make it more challenging, but it is still quite possible for you to get your $$$ back once they do receive it, if you can turn them around....

Personally I suggest a purely factional 3rd party (ie no "you"s) response to the negative feedback simply stating that Item sent surface to France, refund was provided. (I also suggest in your future communication to them, ask if they will reconsider revising the feedback when the item arrives)

Haven't received thread:

http://community.ebay.ca/t5/Seller-Central/I-haven-t-received-my-item-or-Item-not-received-case-the-...

Neutrals/Negatives thread:

http://community.ebay.ca/t5/Seller-Central/Neutral-Negative-ratings-or-threats-thereof-the-form-lett...

ypdc_dennis · ‎07-26-2016

@snoopwiz wrote:
so it was sent by Small Packet Ground

.... That specific listing would have shown your buyer that you were going to be shipping by Canada Post Light Packet International with a delivery time of 5-11 business days.

Indeed.

Promising one shipping service in the listing and then using a much slower one (of 20 plus business days) was a sure-fire recipe for disaster.

-..-

i.am.vivian · ‎07-26-2016

The reasons for NOT using Surface shipping, aka Small Packet Ground, are something every new seller has to learn, usually the hard way. If you can't prove DELIVERY then eBay will side with the buyer without question.

Did your buyer know before buying how long it would take? Your buyer looks to be just as new as you and so might not know that SP GROUND takes so long and why. Or it could be they just knew how to scam you. That doesn't matter now. You lost the money and won't likely get it back.

Here is what little you can do now:

Ask the buyer to revise the feedback to positive now that they have the money and will soon have the item too. Be nice and if you were not in the past apologize for your bad behavior.

Ask the buyer to let you know when the item arrives. Say this will help you understand how long SPG parcels take. IF the buyer finally tells you it has arrived, send them an invoice through PayPal. They'll just ignore you and never pay it, but it never hurts to ask.

Reply to the negative FB if the buyer won't change it and once you realize you will never see another cent. If it were ME I would say something like "Buyer pd Surface (takes 6 weeks), Opened PP case at 3 weeks. No prior contact". Something like that. You don't need to say "refunded" because everyone knows that you will lose a case without tracking and you don't want to advertize yourself as an easy place to get freebies. That response also tells any future buyer why you will no longer consider using Small Packet Ground.

Add this person to your list of BLOCKED BIDDERS.

pierrelebel · ‎07-26-2016

"Reply to the negative FB...."

DO NOT.

Instead simply ask eBay to remove the feedback since it is in contravention of feedback policy by mentioning "PayPal"

http://pages.ebay.ca/help/policies/feedback-removal.html

i.am.vivian · ‎07-26-2016

@pierrelebel wrote:

Instead simply ask eBay to remove the feedback since it is in contravention of feedback policy by mentioning "PayPal"

http://pages.ebay.ca/help/policies/feedback-removal.html

All that says is they will remove Feedback that includes references to law enforcement investigations or eBay or PayPal investigations.

The buyer just said "THANK YOU PAYPAL" and did not reference a PayPal investigation.

pierrelebel · ‎07-26-2016

Do you want to argue with me?

Let the original poster ask eBay to remove the negative feedback in view of the fact "PayPal" was mentioned.

i.am.vivian · ‎07-26-2016

@pierrelebel wrote:
Do you want to argue with me?

No, never! 🙂

But the OP did tell us that eBay said they could not remove it. Thats no reason not to try again but it is really hard to get FB removed now that it no longer counts against the seller. Of course removal is best but failing that, I say tell the world what that buyer did. It will also alert other sellers if that bidding on their auctions that this is an impatient person who will take a freebie if opportunity presents itself.

ypdc_dennis · ‎07-26-2016

@i.am.vivian wrote:

Reply to the negative FB if the buyer won't change it and once you realize you will never see another cent. If it were ME I would say something like "Buyer pd Surface (takes 6 weeks), Opened PP case at 3 weeks. No prior contact". Something like that.

Not recommended for 2 reasons.

It's quite possible that the shipment hasn't even arrived yet. There is still the faint hope of repayment if the buyer is not totally p*ssed off at the seller.

If you look at the sold listing, the buyer paid for Air shipping not Surface shipping. When the seller decided to send surface, before shipping they should have contacted the buyer to see if a longer delivery time was okay, and if not okay, canceled and refunded the purchase.

-..-

i.am.vivian · ‎07-26-2016

@ypdc_dennis wrote:

It's quite possible that the shipment hasn't even arrived yet. There is still the faint hope of repayment if the buyer is not totally p*ssed off at the seller.

If you look at the sold listing, the buyer paid for Air shipping not Surface shipping. When the seller decided to send surface, before shipping they should have contacted the buyer to see if a longer delivery time was okay, and if not okay, canceled and refunded the purchase.

I never meant the seller should respond NOW, I meant after having exhausted all other options, like trying to get eBay to remove it, buyer to redo it, buyer to say it finally arrived, and invoice ignored.

I KNOW the buyer thought they were paying for air shipping and I am thinking it is the seller who screwed up. But that is no excuse for such rotten FB. The seller did say the parcel was mailed and showed shipping info to the buyer. Even if the buyer doesn't believe it all, at least wait the 6 weeks to see if comes. The buyer got refunded, the seller gets zip except for a neg.

At this point if there is nothing the seller can do to get the FB changed or get money back, then the seller has to look to DAMAGE CONTROL and that means telling the truth in a way that suits the seller best.

My earlier post still stands. 🙂

vitvol · ‎07-27-2016

Thanks. I normally don't send anything by Small Packet Ground because it takes too long to arrive but the Canada Post Light Packet was too pricey. I charged the buyer $12CAD for shipping and Canada post Light Packet was $21CAD. Since the item was only worth $10, i didn't want to charge over twice the amount of the item's worth for shipping. That's why i shipped with Small Packet Ground. When the item was shipped, i sent the buyer a message saying that it will take 4-6 weeks to arrive, which he did not reply to. I could have cancelled the shipment if 4-6 weeks were too long for him but i did not get any responses.

vitvol · ‎07-27-2016

Thanks for the suggestions everyone. Do you guys think i should contact ebay and ask em to remove the buyer's feedback because he mentioned "Paypal"? Because when i asked for the feedback removal, i did even knew about the contravention of feedback policy. I originally asked them to remove it because i warned the buyer that it will take 4-6 weeks, offered proof of sending the item with the receipt and the fact that the buyer didn't even waited 4 weeks for the item to arrive and opened a case directly with Paypal without ever contacting me. If i were to ask for the feedback removal, should i send them a message asking them to remove it because of the contravention of feedback policy or should i do it under the "Report this buyer"->Buyer left inappropriate feedback->Other and explain about the Paypal being mentioned? Sorry, never had to deal with this stuff so i'm not sure how to proceed.

pjcdn2005 · ‎07-27-2016

@vitvol wrote:
Thanks. I normally don't send anything by Small Packet Ground because it takes too long to arrive but the Canada Post Light Packet was too pricey. I charged the buyer $12CAD for shipping and Canada post Light Packet was $21CAD. Since the item was only worth $10, i didn't want to charge over twice the amount of the item's worth for shipping. That's why i shipped with Small Packet Ground. When the item was shipped, i sent the buyer a message saying that it will take 4-6 weeks to arrive, which he did not reply to. I could have cancelled the shipment if 4-6 weeks were too long for him but i did not get any responses.

It would be to your benefit to spend some time reading about he different canadapost shipping options available and about their restrictions, prices etc. All of your listings seem to be using light packet internsional but since LP has a maximum depth of 2cm some of your items could not be shipped using LP.

Also, you have 1 price for Canada and one price for everywhere else but the cost to the US and to other countries is not the same. Light packet USA is $5.70 up to 100 grams. Light packet International is $8.78 up to a 100 grams. In order to have one price for the states and another for overseas you have to set up your listings using the advanced listing tool.

If you are using light packet for your lures and they are less than 100gr your price to the US is high. If you can use light packet you can use letter mail within Canada. A lure might be more appealing to a buyer if you are charging a few dollars for lettermail rather than your current $10 charge.

Light packet international has one overseas price but the cost of other services does vary by country so you may want to use calculated shipping in those cases. Also, some services are not available in all countries. For example tracked packet and xpresspost intl are not available in other countries. There is a lot more info about shipping to learn but I can't type about it all so you should do some research and/or ask some specific questions about shipping on the boards.

vitvol · ‎07-27-2016

Alright, i will update the shipping today. I always wanted to have a different shipping price for the US and everywhere else internationally but didn't figure out how to do so.

i.am.vivian · ‎07-27-2016

@vitvol wrote:
Do you guys think i should contact ebay and ask em to remove the buyer's feedback because he mentioned "Paypal"?

Yes, if you want to have a chance at getting it removed. You will have to PHONE eBay Customer Service to do it. You can't email them your request. They might say NO anyway but its your only chance so call and ask. And BE NICE. They hold the power.

If there is no way the CS Rep will remove it you can ask the buyer to accept a FEEDBACK REVISION and change it to positive. You can remind the buyer that they now have a refund, they will soon have the item, and you would like at least to have good feedback.

If its no, its no. Ask then if the buyer will let you know when the package arrived so you will better understand travel times.

If ever you get told it arrived, send a nice thank you and a PayPal invoice.

If you end up with nothing (the most likely scenario) compose your response to that negative.

Use the automated system to REPORT the buyer because someone who gets a taste for easy freebies might try to make it a habit and these reports will add up. CALL eBay CS on the phone to get it removed. It will never go away if you just use the report button.

And for pete's sake learn all about shipping INTERNATIONALLY before you start SHIPPING internationally.

lady.stark · ‎07-27-2016

@pjcdn2005 wrote:

Light packet USA is $5.70 up to 100 grams. Light packet International is $8.78 up to a 100 grams.

Light packet is in fact $5.70 and $8.78 up to 250 grams.

pocomocomputing · ‎07-27-2016

@lady.stark wrote:
@pjcdn2005 wrote:
Light packet USA is $5.70 up to 100 grams. Light packet International is $8.78 up to a 100 grams.

Light packet is in fact $5.70 and $8.78 up to 250 grams.

Light Packet USA and International first weight break is 0-200 g, not 250.