Unfair Return Policy

[pc35photolab]

Here goes eBay again.  A Canadian buyer purchased a tablet from me then checked off the "Not As Described" box one day later.  The buyer then ceased all communication and waited.  Six weeks later, despite all my emails to eBay, eBay issues a full refund to the buyer.  All my pictures and documentation did not matter to eBay.   No opportunity to get the tablet back and inspect it.  The buyer can now enjoy his FREE tablet.  So grossly unfair.  No normal store anywhere gives you a refund without returning the item first.

[pinetreecottage]

You should contact your local police fraud division.  They may give you a suggestion on how to proceed.  Also contact both ebay and Paypal.  You have been a victim of robbery.  Have all your facts ready when calling.  Push for an answer, (but stay calm) as your tablet was not returned, a refund should not have been issued.  Tell both ebay and Paypal, the police is involved.  Don't wait to start the process.  You may get transferred around the office, possible back to the first person you talked to, that happened to me.  Hang up and try again.  Best of luck.

[pjcdn2005]

Were you fighting the return or fighting the not as described claim so that you didn't have to pay return shipping? Did you ever ask to have it returned for a refund? You have a 14 day return policy so if the buyer was within that time frame they could return it for any reason so in a situation like this when you disagree with the nad claim, the best thing would be to phone ebay and tell them you are willing to accept a return but that the item was as described.   That doesn't mean that you will win but it is more likely that ebay will require a return if the buyer is refunded. Notice that I said more likely because here are no guarantees as far as knowing what ebay will do in any situation.

What was the buyer's reason for the nad claim. It looks like you shipped the table via the gsp so if the damage could have happened during shipping then the gsp would have been responsible. If it was something else, it is very difficult to prove that you sent exactly what was pictured to the buyer.  I don't know if the buyer provided any sort of proof but often it is a he said/she said situation and ebay will take the buyer's side.

You can still ask the buyer to return the table although of course he might not be willing to do that now. You would have to pay for return shipping.

[pc35photolab]

I was fighting the blanket "Not As Described" the buyer chose to use.  I emailed the buyer requesting he return the tablet so I could inspect it.  I gave him a return address.  No response.   The buyer has not communicated with me or eBay since May 27th.   This tablet was documented with photos.  I run it through a checklist to make sure everything is working before shipping.  My listing was accurate.  He says the camera does not work.  Maybe he doesn't know how to setup it up or use it.  I don't know.  He said the cover was partially opened.  I believe he tried to open it for whatever reason.  My thoughts.  All any eBay buyer needs to do is use the "Not As Described" option, generate some excuse, stop communicating, then just wait.  Eventually he gets his money back and is free to use the product.  If I was a dishonest buyer I could do this easily on eBay and screw the seller.

Six weeks later eBay sides with the buyer.  My photos and documentation do not matter.  The buyer purchased this tablet just two weeks after becoming an eBay member.  I've been an eBay member for 15 years.  Doesn't matter to eBay.

I have already changed all my active listings to No International Transactions.  I know that eliminates some good people but I seem to have more problems with buyers outside the USA, plus it greatly reduces my return shipping costs.

I have no problem with the 14-day eBay return policy.  I use a generous 30-day guarantee for customers on my own websites.  They can return an item for no reason at all if they want.   I want my customer to be happy and satisfied.   What I do have a problem with is fraud.  And, I suspect fraud was committed here.  I am pursuing other avenues but I do not think I'll ever get my money back.

[2012sincity]

Hi, if you lost both your item and money because you had no avenue to address the situation, contact me.

I can at least get your money back for you.

[canadian.tree]

you can get your money back give eBay a call , did he even mention a reason of how it was not described . He did not even send it back nor did eBay ask him to without steeping in for the refund is very weird. Give them a call explain the situation they will see the buyer did not try to communicate with you at all and fix their mistake. 

He did contact you I guess read your second post but for him to get refund without returning is just not right.

[sewingsue]

I just got dinged because a buyer chose shipping with no tracking; and was in a sketchy country.  Apparently my warnings & no refund policy (clearly stated) to the buyers don't count...ebay refunded their money without consulting me at all. 

20 years on e-bay, 10x more feedback than the buyers, 100% positive.   So much for customer loyalty.  Do they NOT LEARN??

Buh-bye e-bay!!

[recped]

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@sewingsue wrote:

I just got dinged because a buyer chose shipping with no tracking; and was in a sketchy country.  Apparently my warnings & no refund policy (clearly stated) to the buyers don't count...ebay refunded their money without consulting me at all. 

20 years on e-bay, 10x more feedback than the buyers, 100% positive.   So much for customer loyalty.  Do they NOT LEARN??

Buh-bye e-bay!!

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That's not correct....YOU offered shipping with no tracking.

If the country was so "sketchy" in your opinion why did offer to ship there?

Sounds like the buyer claimed they never received the item......how would tracking help you? Unless of course you assume the buyer is a thief and a liar. If you make that assumption what is it based on?

[maggiebvintage2010]

If the country is "sketchy" why do you ship there?  Note that no refunds is completely meaningless - eBay has a Money Back Guarantee.  And the buyer didn't choose shipping with no tracking - you did.  Let's see what your listings say:

I happily ship internationally or the cheapest way possible, with or without a box - why pay expensive shipping when all you want are the shoes???

[maggiebvintage2010]

Sorry - you beat me to it - I was trying to multi-task

[levsac1]

I would never ship anything without tracking number or insurance for the actual FV, and I only ship to the USA and Canada. Shipping international without a tracking number is just asking for trouble.

[sewingsue]

Yes I offer cheapest shipping, and that's what they chose....otherwise tracking shipping would have been $60 for a $10 item?  Low shipping is why they purchased.  I don't pick and choose the country they buy from.  As a Canadian, many sellers only ship in the USA - so I offer as a point of difference international shipping.  BTW, I haven't had a complaint before and often ship internationally.

The buyer accused me of not shipping....as you can see the feedback on my other items & my feedback in total that I do ship.  E-bay did not take my side into account at all.

If e-bay forces their policies onto sellers, they should not allow sellers to have their own policies. 

Not interested in dealing with e-bay anymore.  Lots more options out there.

[maximus7001]

Why did you revive a year old thread?

[xeposter]

This post is a zombie thread...it hasn't been replied to since 07-13-2015.

Alex

[maggiebvintage2010]

Sorry to belabour the point, but on the advanced SYI form, you do indeed pick the countries you ship to, and later you choose exactly those countries you won't ship to.  If you choose to offer "a point of difference" by shipping to a "sketchy country" (your description), then you accept the risks that involves.  It is the seller who defines the shipping services and destinations offered.

I do pick and choose what countries I sell to, based on postal service ratings, political/war situations, things I read on these boards and elsewhere, my life experience and my own biases.  I also mostly offer non-tracked services, but some items I do ship with tracking.  I don't offer buyers the option to "choose" a shipping service.  If they don't like it, they don't buy.  If they want it, they will pay the shipping.  Most sellers who decide to ship without tracking build in some self-insurance, as "femmefan" has so often described on these boards.

Of course eBay sets the policies - they own the site.  Sellers in reality can set their own policies only as long as they don't violate eBay's policies.  For example, as seller cannot set a policy of no refunds, because eBay offers a Money Back Guarantee.  However, a seller can set a policy of no returns.  What this means is they can refuse to accept returns for buyer's remorse.  However, when an Item Not as Described dispute is opened, and a seller does not accept returns, if eBay finds for the buyer, they will force a 100% return of the money from the seller, and the buyer will get to keep the item since the seller apparently doesn't want it back.  In my opinion, this only encourages those few shoppers who are not totally honest to exercise (as opposed to exorcise) their demons.  What is actually buyer's remorse is presented as not as described.

I'm sorry to hear that you are taking this so personally ("the buyer accused me of not shipping") - it's just a transaction.

[sewingsue]

came up first on Google

[xeposter]

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@sewingsue wrote:

came up first on Google

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That's what I guessed.

Please look at the dates before you start adding on to year old threads.

You normally get more replies if you have a question and start a new thread if there is no newer one going.

Alex

[femmefan1946]

I just got dinged because a buyer chose shipping with no tracking; and was in a sketchy country. 

I rarely use tracking, because my costs are low enough that I can write off an occasional loss.

But they are very very occasional.

Never give a buyer a choice of a tracked or an untracked service. You and only you choose.

Sometimes it is worth paying to upgrade to a tracked service. You cannot charge the buyer more than you advertised for this, it's on your dime.

You can Block countries you do not want to ship too. I have most (but not all) of Africa Blocked.

How much did you actually lose? Your purchase cost of the item+fees including Paypal fees+shipping cost. You didn't lose the full payment, unless you sold the item for less than its total cost.

Apparently my warnings & no refund policy (clearly stated) to the buyers don't count...ebay refunded their money without consulting me at all. 

If you take Paypal, you make refunds.

Smart scammers just love sellers with 'no refunds' in their ToS. They know that many honest bidders will pass them by because of  the hostile ToS.

 And it is not enforceable and never has been.

20 years on e-bay, 10x more feedback than the buyers, 100% positive.   So much for customer loyalty.  Do they NOT LEARN??

Do you actually have any repeat buyers?

With 140million +listings on eBay every day, repeat buyers are few and far between.

Buh-bye e-bay!!

After one bad sale? Out of over 1700?

Okay.

[tyler@ebay]

Hey everyone,

Due to the length of time that has passed since this thread began I have locked it from future replies. If this is still an issue that warrants discussion, don't hesitate to begin a new thread!