eBay

dark_phoenix9273 · ‎03-24-2016

EBay seems to be driving away sellers allot lately,

1) Forcing Canadians to list items at Canadian $$ prices.

2) Expanding Buyer protections at the expense of Seller's protections. (basically to sell on here now, you have to be willing to accept that you could be giving your item away for free)

3) Overly tight guidelines such for new sellers, such as having to ship domestically.

What is the advantage of using this site over others that actually care about their sellers?

snow_dogford · ‎03-26-2016

To respond to the problems with Buyer protection.

IF you want a FREE item on Ebay..

Find an item not using tracking..

But the Item, Pay with PayPAL

Wait a few weeks, and then Put in a claim you didn't get the item

EBAY will automatically give you back the money, cause the seller cannot provide a tracking number.

A dated postal receipt or customs forum means absolutely nothing. its like E-Shoplifting...

lady.stark · ‎03-26-2016

@dark_phoenix9273 wrote:
Sites such as Amazon and Etsy and Star City Games and basically most other sites, where a seller is paid BEFORE items are sent out, meaning they have access to the money and they don't seem to be having problems.

As I said in post #19, I completely understand the frustration of having your money held until proof of delivery or 21 days (whichever comes first). I was in the same boat when I began selling under this ID.

If you look in the old threads of the board when this policy was introduced (around 2010 or beginning of 2011 - I think, because I created this ID in Sept. 2011 and the rule was already there), there was a LOT of people expressing their frustrating and demanding to eBay to change the policy. Including myself.

But they did not change it, and I really doubt they ever will. And even though it was really frustrating for me to prove *again* that I was and is an honest seller, I understood the reasoning behind the rule.

dark_phoenix9273 · ‎03-26-2016

And again you guys skirt the issue in favor of a non-answer.

Why shouldn't Sellers get paid before shipping? Why should their security come secondary to Buyers when there is just as many crooked buyers out there?

Stop dancing around it and address it or your no better then the cheerleader.

lady.stark · ‎03-27-2016

@dark_phoenix9273 wrote:
And again you guys skirt the issue in favor of a non-answer.

Why shouldn't Sellers get paid before shipping? Why should their security come secondary to Buyers when there is just as many crooked buyers out there?

Stop dancing around it and address it or your no better then the cheerleader.

The answer is simple: there were too many new sellers listing high price items, never shipping them and disappearing with the money. To avoid that, now new sellers have to establish a good track record before gaining access to the money.

dark_phoenix9273 · ‎03-27-2016

Are there are just as many new buyers who scam sellers out of their money and products. Yet Buyers are given immediate and total trust.

And Buyers are completely protected as opposed to sellers for whom it's a 50/50 **bleep** shoot.

lady.stark · ‎03-27-2016

There may be, but not that many, no. And of course, we live in a world where "the customer is always right, even when he is wrong". You may disagree with the rule, and I share your opinion. But the rule won't change unfortunately.

All the sellers have to live with it or just sell somewhere else. I wish I could convince you it is for the greater good, but I have the feeling anything I say - or others say - won't change your mind. And it is your right too. You just have to decide if you can live with it or not.

dark_phoenix9273 · ‎03-27-2016

And still you don't answer the question,

Why are sellers automatically distrusted while buyers are trusted right away? If a seller were to be paid right away instead of after the buyer receives how exactly does that hurt the buyer, given they are already protected?

And sellers shouldn't just have to "live with it".

*help_no_brakes* · ‎03-28-2016

@dark_phoenix9273 wrote:
And still you don't answer the question,

Why are sellers automatically distrusted while buyers are trusted right away? If a seller were to be paid right away instead of after the buyer receives how exactly does that hurt the buyer, given they are already protected?

And sellers shouldn't just have to "live with it".

Good day to you once again.

I have been guilty of not closely reading the subject title of your thread.

Having now done so I find it offensive that you choose to speak for me......don't know about the millions of other sellers.......Perhaps you should consider changing "us " to "me"..

Anyhoo now that I have dealt with that I,m guessing that 'buyers are trusted right away" because they have paid for items.

Sellers are required to deliver the item as they have been paid........in the business world 21 days is extremely fast payment.

Before I go & nail my eyelids to the carpet (should give me more pleasure than reading about your inability to conform to the rules on a site you have chosen to sell on) I wish you well in your future on line trading.

best rehards.

Best regards.

dark_phoenix9273 · ‎03-28-2016

Thats great you still; didn't answer the question, so as much as you want to feign anger or offense, it really comes across as hollow when you can't even address my central point.

cumos55 · ‎03-28-2016

eBay provides a template for people to sell on the internet.....eBay is a worldwide phenomenon.

Like anything else on the internet.... eBay is an option.... for selling

It is not eBay who decides who should be where.....Is is each of us who choose to sell on eBay..

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It is the us that choose eBay or otherwise.

It is not whether eBay wants to exist without us... whoever us "is"

It is we who come here, set up on eBay's template and sell....

Not everyone has the ability to do "it".... and those who cannot do it on eBay... they go elsewhere or stop using the internet. as a selling venue

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For me... Ten years ago My view was ..... selling books on eBay will not work..

Today, I sell books, and only books on eBay.... I made the right decisions...... and have built a business based on the sale of books.

I made "it" work for me.... and that is what each successful seller does on eBay

How I did it... is for me to know!

cumos55 · ‎03-28-2016

You come here with your question... proposal

There are many sellers ... many successful sellers who have commented ... whether here or elsewhere.

Your question has no meaning to those that have been successful sellers... whether new to eBay, after 5 years, after 10 years and even close to 20 years of selling here.

In total they have been through a lot... each selling their own category of inventory... and each successful....

Why?

Because they each have been able to adjust to the marketplace and make it work for them.... year-after-year

Success is based on the seller... on what they sell and how they choose to sell on eBay...... and happy buyers.... and eBay has a lot of potential buyers....

Never underestimate the ability for people to make it happen

pjcdn2005 · ‎03-28-2016

@dark_phoenix9273 wrote:
And still you don't answer the question,

Why are sellers automatically distrusted while buyers are trusted right away? If a seller were to be paid right away instead of after the buyer receives how exactly does that hurt the buyer, given they are already protected?
--------------

We don't make the rules so you are asking the wrong people why the actual rules are in place but here's how I look at it.
If you sold a bunch of items, took out the money and never sent the items, eBay or Paypal would have to refund the buyers and then try to get the money back from you. They may have to put in some extra time and effort to recover that money and If for some reason they couldn't recover it, they would be out that money. If that happened a few times a week with different 'new' sellers they could be out thousands of dollars each week.

So instead they hold back funds on new sellers. The buyer receives their item and the seller is paid. No one is out any money in the end. Once the new sellers meets the requirements, the restrictions are lifted.

The one way this sort of rule does benefit the buyers is that now that their funds are held, fewer sellers will try to scam buyers in that way. Sure the buyers are protected regardless but once a buyer is scammed and they have to put in a claim to get their money back, they may never shop here again. And, when they tell others how some seller scammed dozens of buyers, those people will probably not shop here either. Keep in mind that when a buyer purchases something they expect to receive that item. Even when the buyer is refunded...if they didn't receive the item they came here for, they may not be back because it was not a positive shopping experience.

You're saying that eBay trusts the buyers. If you use delivery confirmation and it shows the buyer received the item, you will win the case and will receive your money even if the buyer says that they didn't receive the item. In that situation, they trust the evidence. If there is no evidence...no paper trail...then yes, they assume the buyer is being truthful if they say the item was not received. There is no way of proving otherwise. They are not saying that the seller was being untrustworthy...just that if the buyer didn't get an item, the seller has to refund. It is like that in every retail business. As the majority of people are honest the system does work most of the time.
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And sellers shouldn't just have to "live with it".

As far as not receiving the money right away, that is only temporary so you only have to 'live with it' for so long. If you do want to sell here, you don't have to agree with the rules but you do have to follow them. If you find a bunch of people that want to form some sort of protest with you and you want to boycott ebay or stage a rally or complain to ebay management or whatever...go for it but complaining about it on an ebay user's board is not going to accomplish any changes. I think that we all complain about specific things here and give eBay our input but ultimately, it is eBay's site. They decide what the rules are and we decide if we are willing to work within them.

lady.stark · ‎03-28-2016

@dark_phoenix9273 wrote:
And still you don't answer the question,

Why are sellers automatically distrusted while buyers are trusted right away? If a seller were to be paid right away instead of after the buyer receives how exactly does that hurt the buyer, given they are already protected?

And sellers shouldn't just have to "live with it".

I did answer the question (see post #43), but you chose to ignore it. We will just agree to disagree on that one. If the answer does not satisfy you, maybe you should ask it at the Wednesday board hour with Raphael. He will probably be the most qualified to give you the answer you seek. Or maybe not the answer you seek, but at least the right answer behind eBay's decision.

And this is my last message on this topic.

kh-leslie · ‎03-28-2016

Hello, everyone. This thread is getting a little hostile. Please refrain from hostility and interpersonal disputes or we will have to lock the thread. Thanks!

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dark_phoenix9273 · ‎03-28-2016

Because your answer doesn't address my question, it side steps it.

And make no mistake, there are plenty of buyers out there that cheat sellers. But they are trusted automatically and completely protected. Where as sellers are required to prove themselves and given less protection.

Ebay needs both sellers and buyers to work. And I assure you plenty of sellers have rightfully left ebay because they can't sell their items without worrying they'll be cheated. And if you think buyers should never have to worry about that then how is it fair for sellers to?

faircrochet · ‎03-29-2016

Buyers are protected and valued because they are the lifeblood of any retail enterprise. It costs money to get them to a site (even old and established sites have to advertise and/or pay for google exposure) and if you want them to hand their money over they have to trust you. Having buyer protections in place promotes trust.

I obviously can't prove this, but I'm sure there haven't been any retail sites that failed because they couldn't attract sellers - there will always be sellers. But I'm sure there have been many sites that have failed because they couldn't attract buyers.

I started selling last year on 'the river' and their support of their customers exceeds anything I've seen anywhere else. If a buyer opens an AtoZ claim there have to be some pretty good circumstances for a refund not to go through. Even signature required shipping doesn't guarantee a seller will win an INR claim, all the buyer has to do is say that wasn't their signature. But the good sales far exceed the bad. (No returns or claims for me so far, touch wood.)

That is why we sell on any venue - the good sales far exceed the bad. If buyers don't trust your site, they won't buy. And that's not good for any seller.

dark_phoenix9273 · ‎03-29-2016

Seller are just as much of a life blood. Try running a business with only buyers and see how well you do.

Actually there wont always be sellers, if they keep getting cheated over and over they leave and look for sites that offer them better protections. I've seen a fair number of posts on here about sellers who are fed up and done with not being protected.

And buyers aren't going anywhere, many of them shop on here because its the only place they can find the items they want, normally at cheaper prices.

And the most your advocating buyer theft and at the very least your saying sellers should expect and accept being stolen from.

And to address your example, if a seller can prove through tracking and signature required that they delivered their package, that should be an auto win in a claim. Whats the buyer going to claim? A person broke into their home and falsely signed for the package? Seriously?

Now you would say, what if the seller sent the wrong item? Now this is where unfortunately there is no resolution because it's impossible to prove whether the buyer or seller is the one lying. True the seller could've sent the wrong item, but its just as likely the buyer could purposely be making a false claim and returning the wrong item.

Now you also say sellers are going to get scammed at some point, or as you call it, "shrink". The problem here and I've seen it happen on other sites, is that people who get scammed, themselves become the next generation of scammers because they figure if it was okay for someone else to cheat them, then they can go and do it to others. So the seller who gets scammed could very well turn around and become the next scamming buyer.

pjcdn2005 · ‎03-29-2016

You've sold how many items here?

It seems to me that you had one problem and are judging the site based on that. You are also basing your opinions on

posts from sellers on the boards but that is not an accurate representation of what going on here. A seller is hundred times more

likely to post when they have a bad experience than when they have a good experience.

You ignored my last post and will likely ignore this one too but that's fine, you obviously are not here to listen to other opinions, you just want people to agree with yours. I won't be posting about this anymore as it really is pointless.