eBay

katlover1952 · ‎09-08-2016

I sold an item on the weekend - a 12 strand tiny beaded necklace. Went to get it ready to ship Monday nite & not really sure how it happened but one of the strands broke on one end. Curses! I immediately sent an apologetic email to the purchaser explaining what had happened offering a refund right away. I then offered to either see if it could be reattached (doubtful) or removing the broken strand completely. Still would look great - with that many strands not really noticeable. Then if she wanted it like that we could sort it out. Problem is I have not yet heard from her even after sending a second email the next night. Not sure whether to go ahead remove the strand & mail hoping it is OK or what go do. Going to be late on mailing now anyway but not sure what to do. Any suggestions fellow sellers? My sales have not been too great since I closed during the postal uncertainty & really want to avoid any defects if at all possible.

pjcdn2005 · ‎09-09-2016

Off topic but that reminded me of something....I sold a wallet to a buyer in the US and there was a small cosmetic problem with it that I hadn't noticed . She sent me a pictures.i apologized and told her that if she wanted to return it, I would pay return shipping or,,,,if she had another suggestion to please let me know. They replied saying they were going to return it. I had hoped they would ask for a partial refund but they didn't.

I wrote back to explain how return shipping would work and mentioned that if they preferred, I could give them a partial refund or $x. I thought about letting them set the amount but was antsy about doing that so the amount I offered them was slightly less than what I would be out in the end after paying for original and return shipping. I didn't tell them how I arrived at the amount. To my surprise she told me that was too generous and that she would be happy with a lower refund. I refunded her the lower amount right away! Lol

Moral of the story....I should have just asked if she would like a partial refund rather than beating around the bush as she seemed quite happy about getting it.

sylviebee · ‎09-09-2016

I have situations like this, but they usually involve beaded purses.

The fibres on many of these old bags have deteriorated over the years and some just decide to snap while getting packed for shipping.

Repairs can be difficult and time consuming but before doing anything else I assess the work involved in a repair.

If a repair isn't feasible I email the buyer and let the buyer choose between a cancellation or a partial refund.

My buyers just wouldn't be forgiving if I treated the situation any other way. Moreover, I'd be very annoyed with a seller who just shipped a piece like that without my pre-approval.

An $11 necklace isn't the same thing, but I'd treat it with the same respect as I would a $1,000 sale. Shipping without the buyer's pre-approval just isn't an option.

A defect here and there won't break me.

momcqueen · ‎09-09-2016

She's tried to reach the buyer though. If she waits any longer without shipping she will Get a defect as opposed to might.

sylviebee · ‎09-09-2016

@pjcdn2005 wrote:

Moral of the story....I should have just asked if she would like a partial refund rather than beating around the bush as she seemed quite happy about getting it.

So true. I always allow the buyer to suggest the amount of the refund and 9 out of 10 times they suggest less than I'm willing to give.

sylviebee · ‎09-09-2016

@mjwl2006 wrote:
She's tried to reach the buyer though. If she waits any longer without shipping she will Get a defect as opposed to might.

If the transaction is cancelled after the allotted shipping time has passed, does that still count as a defect for late shipping?

Even if it is, most of us can sustain a defect now and then and it's not the most important thing.

momcqueen · ‎09-09-2016

No, it counts as a defect for cancelled order due to out of stock. The seller is in trouble no matter unless she ships as is ASAP and hopes for the best, I think.

momcqueen · ‎09-09-2016

I agree that this is not ideal but unless the buyer responds (try a phone call!) I think it's the only defect-free course of action.

ricarmic · ‎09-09-2016

@rose-dee wrote:
@ricarmic wrote:
What I have always done in partial refund situations is put the control of determining the amount of the refund in the buyers hands.

Your advice is sound, as always, but the problem is that some buyers (especially the younger ones, using mobile devices to shop) just don't respond, as in the OP's situation. They click to buy the item, process the Paypal payment, and they're gone.

There's nothing wrong with that method of purchasing until a problem arises and you can't get in touch with the buyer. I think that's where the OP's real dilemma lies, because now she's running against eBay's on-time delivery clock. If the buyer had immediately replied, they could have worked out a discount/partial refund.

I don't envy the OP's position, but in an unfortunate situation like this, given the lack of buyer communication, I'd do what was necessary to avoid a defect and make the buyer as satisfied as possible.

What I would do in the ops situation is after unsuccessfully attempting to contact the buyer via ebay messaging and email messaging:

Print a copy of the email message I sent, advising what happened, what I did and include it in the package with the repaired item. Presumably the buyer then would read the message when they looked at the item and contact me to figure out some resolution.

For an $11 item, even if they say it isn't worth anything, and they get a full refund, defects are avoided and the likelihood is high that there won't be any neutral/negative (if there is, a response that the item was accidentally damaged and a full refund was provided "nullifies" the "badness" of it anyway). A small price to pay in the grander scheme of things.....

ricarmic · ‎09-09-2016

Hmm actually I forgot something. Before I did what I posted above, I would probably call the buyer assuming they are in North America before doing the "include the printed email" option....

I have solved some very very bizarre situations quickly and most easily with a simple phone call.....

momcqueen · ‎09-10-2016

Please share with us what you do or did in the end, katlover, and how it was received by the buyer. It will be a collective lesson for us all.

rose-dee · ‎09-10-2016

@mjwl2006 wrote:
No, it counts as a defect for cancelled order due to out of stock. The seller is in trouble no matter unless she ships as is ASAP and hopes for the best, I think.

Yes, she will get an automatic defect if she doesn't ship for any reason, not just because the item is out of stock: "Any transaction cancelled through eBay or refunded through PayPal because the seller no longer has the item or chooses not to ship the item will count in the defect rate as a seller-cancelled transaction."

Using the "buyer changed mind" option won't work anymore either. EBay will look at the messages sent by the seller and she'll get a defect if she cancels and refunds unless there is a clear cancellation request message from the buyer.

I have to disagree with 'sylviebee' about absorbing defects. The allowable defect rate is currently lower and more stringent than it was under the old defect system. More importantly, the factors that cause defects now also include on-time delivery, which is almost entirely out of our control (unless we can always afford tracking).

That means, in my view, that we now have to be so much more careful about the defects that are still within our power to avoid. We can't do much about weather delays or postal mishaps, but I would do everything possible to avoid a defect in a situation such as the OP's.

rose-dee · ‎09-10-2016

I wanted to add that it's a sad commentary about eBay that if a seller notices damage or a problem after a sale, it's better to just ship the item and deal with a SNAD claim (and refund at that point = no defect) than to cancel and refund the buyer's money immediately.

Still, I am the honest sort. I would have done what the OP did, and advised the buyer of the damage, then offered the option of a partial refund or asked -- via eBay Messages mind you -- whether the buyer would prefer to cancel (if she says yes the seller is off the hook for a defect).

As I said earlier, failing a response from the buyer, I'd ship promptly and make a partial refund immediately in an amount generous enough to both compensate the buyer as well as dissuade a return request.

momcqueen · ‎09-10-2016

While I agree that everyone is sharing a point of view with merit, if this were me, I would go with the defect-avoidance method. As a seller, she has acknowledged a mistake has been made and reached out to the buyer without success. It's not as if she tried to pull a fast one here. Call the buyer but if there is still no clear direction, ship it as is with a note of apology and free gift ASAP. Hope for the best but accept with grace any SNAD return request that may arise. Good luck.

rose-dee · ‎09-10-2016

@mjwl2006 wrote:
[...] Call the buyer but if there is still no clear direction, ship it as is with a note of apology and free gift ASAP. Hope for the best but accept with grace any SNAD return request that may arise. Good luck.

I would have to disagree about telephoning the buyer at this point (especially over an $11 item). This is likely to create further complications. If the buyer isn't local it would also involve long distance charges that might eat up any profit the OP has on this transaction.

I also can't see what free gift would be appropriate for an $11 item. If she really wants to avoid any issue with this buyer, the OP might as well send a second necklace along with the damaged one (which is one possible option no one has mentioned). Personally I'd keep it simple with a generous partial refund and would ship the item with an apologetic note. I might also offer the buyer a discount off her next purchase with me.

sylviebee · ‎09-10-2016

@rose-dee wrote:
I wanted to add that it's a sad commentary about eBay that if a seller notices damage or a problem after a sale, it's better to just ship the item and deal with a SNAD claim (and refund at that point = no defect) than to cancel and refund the buyer's money immediately.

The only reason the seller started to get nervous was because the buyer didn't respond right away when asked if she still wanted the item. It's not uncommon for buyers to take a few days to respond to questions like that. They don't realize that sellers are racing the clock.

Sellers don't get an automatic defect just because they forget to mark an item as shipped. (Am I right?)

In other words, if a seller doesn't ship it's not an automatic defect. It only becomes a defect if the buyer decides to leave FB AND picks the option that it arrived after the due date. I'm not attuned to all of the little nuances involved in defects. I rarely check mine out, but I'm pretty sure I've got right. Do I?

If so, then that's a long shot, and especially so if the seller lets the buyer know why this is an important question for her. As long as lines of communication are open and friendly the odds of that happening are extremely low.

Even so, if everything goes wrong and the buyer dings the seller it's unlikely that this ding will even matter.

That's why it's an interesting commentary.

pjcdn2005 · ‎09-10-2016

Sellers don't get an automatic defect just because they forget to mark an item as shipped. (Am I right?)

Right although in this case it looks like the seller would be using tracking so if tracking showed the item arrived after the eta and it was shipped after the handling time then it would be marked as a late shipment. But imo I don't think that getting or not getting a late shipment mark should be a factor in how a problem should be handled. That metric has been around for a year now and I doubt that any of the sellers posting on this thread have been affected adversely by it.

As far as getting a cancelation defect....most of us don't want one but unless a seller does a lot of seller caused cancellations, one cancellation is not going to affect them. Sure, I would probably try to avoid getting one when possible but hopefully I would worry more about the customer than the defect.

I would also like to know what the op ended up doing and how things worked out. Other than the first post, I don't think she has made any other comments about the situation.

sylviebee · ‎09-10-2016

@pjcdn2005 wrote:
Sellers don't get an automatic defect just because they forget to mark an item as shipped. (Am I right?)

Right although in this case it looks like the seller would be using tracking so if tracking showed the item arrived after the eta and it was shipped after the handling time then it would be marked as a late shipment.

I'm pretty sure the OP was talking about the C$11 necklace. Shipping with tracking would cost more than the necklace sold for.

I'm guessing that the OP disappeared because the buyer responded and the matter was settled long ago.

pjcdn2005 · ‎09-10-2016

@sylviebee wrote:
@pjcdn2005 wrote:
Sellers don't get an automatic defect just because they forget to mark an item as shipped. (Am I right?)

Right although in this case it looks like the seller would be using tracking so if tracking showed the item arrived after the eta and it was shipped after the handling time then it would be marked as a late shipment.
I'm pretty sure the OP was talking about the C$11 necklace. Shipping with tracking would cost more than the necklace sold for.

I'm guessing that the OP disappeared because the buyer responded and the matter was settled long ago.

I wouldn't use tracking but if you look at the listing it states shipping expedited parcel in Canada and tracked packet to the US. Based on the US shipping cost given, the seller may have meant to put small packet but that isn't what is stated.

katlover1952 · ‎09-10-2016

Thanks everyone for your advice. I went ahead & shipped the item Fri with a little "apology gift" & sent another email. I heard from her today - she had been busy with back to school & unlike most of us does not check her emails frequently. She was apologetic about that & said she would wait till the package comes & hopes it will work for her. She just wanted it to wear with a new outfit. I replied back saying if she was not happy with it to contact me & we would work it out. It was an inexpensive item & I actually think she'll be find with but if not will offer some type of refund. My main concern, aside from a satisfied buyer, was getting a late shipment defect so did not want to leave unresolved any later. Even though I state 3 days handling time I pretty much always ship the next day. This type of situation while not something that happens frequently is a real problem for us small sellers as most of us can't afford too many defects.

i could still easily get a defect depending on what eBay used for a date & how long it takes to arrive & whether or not she leaves feedback. Hopefully works out OK.

momcqueen · ‎09-11-2016

Thank you for coming back to the thread and filling us in on what happened with your case while we debated what best to do. Please let us know how it all turns out in the end. Best of luck to you!