eBay

burnaby_sue · ‎12-31-2021

I am very very unhappy with eBay and their global shipping program that many US Sellers use. I live in the Greater Vancouver BC area and bought a small item from a US Seller in Seattle which is a 3 hour drive from my house.

I made the purchase Dec.1st but with the Seller using GSP my package traveled over to Erlanger Kentucky

and the item delivered by Intelcom Express arrived Dec.28th The Seller lives only 3-1/2 hours drive away from my residence in Canada.

Before GSP (none available in Canada) shipping was faster delivery and less money. The CAD Customs Tariff number 9505.10.00.90 shows for the past 5 years there is NO Import Tax applicable on this Xmas item for which I paid $11.00US on top of the cost for Priority Mail to Canada making a total of 34.13US (43.74CAD)

If I were to send this box to Seattle using Canada Post services with a Tracking which is 9 business days it would be $20.96CAD ($16.35US) Quite a difference in cost, right?

The Seattle Seller says eBay automatically sends through their GSP. The Seller has had other complaints and asked if I, the Buyer could opt out of this. I told her it all has to do how they set up their listing as I can't do anything from my end.

Does anyone know how I can contact the right eBay department to tell the about the Canadian Tariff numbers which would exclude certain items from being charged Import Duties? This is Pitney Bowes who has this GSP agreement with eBay.

Any thoughts from anyone out there?

marnotom! · ‎12-31-2021

Your post is a bit hard to follow as you seem to be expressing three different ideas simultaneously, but here are my thoughts.

While "casual imports" such as the purchases we make from the US on eBay are subject to a duty-free limit of C$150, the tax-free limit is only $40. I can't make out the purchase price of the item you're referring to in your post, but for an item shipped to BC, you're generally looking at the equivalent of 5% GST plus a processing charge of around US$4-5 to make up the "import charges." Pitney Bowes pays taxes and duties on the buyer's behalf on a GSP shipment. The "import charges" are what they charge you to pay them back.

I doubt that you're looking at an unnecessary calculation for duty on your item, but it's impossible to make that call without seeing the listing.

I find it useful to think of the GSP as a forwarding service because that's what it basically is. The reason why you're paying what you are in shipping charges is because you're paying for two legs of shipping. You're paying what the seller charges for getting the item from their location to Kentucky plus the GSP's charge for getting the item from Kentucky to you. For some listings where the seller offers free shipping within the US, you may find that the GSP's shipping charge isn't out of line.

One of the GSP's weaknesses is that it requires accurate information on the item from the seller, and sellers don't always provide that. If the GSP is charging wacko shipping costs or the import charges seem extra weird, it's likely due to the seller not providing the "GSP bot" information on the item's packaged size and weight and not categorizing the item as precisely as possible.

And you're right, it's up to the seller to tweak with their GSP settings to either make an exemption for Canada or to eliminate it completely as the shipping option. Remember, it's the Global Shipping Program and not the Canada Shipping Program. It serves about 100 countries and many sellers may not feel it's worth it to create a "special" shipping option for Canada given the small number of sales to Canada most US sellers have.

Have I covered everything?

burnaby_sue · ‎12-31-2021

Thanks for your email reply.

Firstly I have bought a number of Christmas tree ornaments over the past two months. The Tarriff numbers are available to anyone here that wants to check before buying item. The following is the link in regards to my purchase made.

https://www.tariffinder.ca/en/search/import/US/christmas%20tree%20ornament/9505100090

Thinking of GSP as a forwarding service is crazy. Why would an item travel from Seattle Washington all the way over to the east coast to Kentucky only to be "forwarded" all the way back to the west coast to be delivered in Burnaby BC Canada? The normal US post office would send the package up the coast to me thereby being less expensive than the GSP.

Now due to the GSP I would agree with you that the percentage of buyers from Canada has gone down dramactically as many of us would agree the cost is now too expensive especially with the added figure of import charges accumulating on the cost of the item one would purchase. I never get a physical receipt when sellers use the GSP.

It is obvious you agree with the GSP. Many others don't. We prefer the previous method of shipping by US sellers such as taking a package to their local US post office for shipping. One thing is for sure - it is a lot quicker delivery and more reasonable shipping cost than the GSP..

Thanks

fh991586 · ‎12-31-2021

If you checked the numerous other post on this board related to the GSP, you would already know that it has good and bad points. But first, every GSP items in the USA are sent to the processing/forwarding plant in Erlanger, Kentucky, whatever there seller's location may be. THEN, it is bundled with other items going to the same country, for a more efficient and cheap transit.

Your purchase was not the kind that would profit from the GSP (cheap, small and/or geographically close), so there's nothing more to say here. You should have asked the seller to relist without using GSP instead of making the purchase as it was organised. The GSP did its job like it was supposed to do, so there's nothing to hold against it!

GSP wasn't made for you only, and other can profit from its services when they know how to deal with it accordingly. I made purchases with the GSP that would not have been possible otherwise, since the seller was not going to ship themselves internationally. Some went rightly, and others were mismanaged in the process. Like any other shipment... In other cases, I decided not to buy the item, because the GSP made it a bad deal. That's the call you can make as an advised buyer.

fh991586 · ‎12-31-2021

Import charges (or most likely in this case sale taxes) are due when you buy from outside Canada (just like the taxes you pay at the store in the real life), weither you use GSP or not. Not paying them because it slipped out of Canada Post's surveillance doesn't make it right in the first place...
And why would you even need a physical receipt nowadays? You have the purchase on eBay stating how much you pay for that part, and it might even be charged separately on your credit card, so you have your proof there...

msau4301 · ‎12-31-2021

I know that in terms of paying more money (more taxes) what-have-you the Global shipping program is all that (and some). However, I know for myself, I have been buying here for over 10 years and selling for about 8 and I remember clear as day the first time I bought an item when the Global shipping was introduced and saw the instantly added import and duty on items I'd bought numerous times without I called customer service (back in the days when it was easy-peasy to speak to someone) and after being passed around several times and realizing there was no way my "enlightening them" on what was allowed, I accepted defeat and gave up.

I accepted the fact that some US seller listings would cost that extra money...and I would decide if it was worth it. I believe there is a very large number of US sellers that are nervous of selling outside of the US. I once asked someone showing "May not ship to Canada" if maybe they would ship here and was told "sorry I don't ship OVERSEAS!"....I only wish I was joking but I'm not! That told me everything I needed to know about how many of them thought. Also why I stopped looking on .com where I was teased with items I "may not" be able to get and instead looked on .ca where I know I can at least get it shipped to me.

At one point I know eBay automatically had Global shipping kick in for those US sellers not wanting to ship outside of US (some I bought from didn't even know they were shipping to Canada...they just see Kentucky and push it through). This may have changed over the last couple of years I'm not sure. I look at it as if I'm able to buy an item (especially if it's harder to find) from someone who otherwise wouldn't have shipped to me here in Canada I decide if that extra money is worth it. I know I can't change it (I gave up that battle a while back!) That's not to say if you communicate to the buyer directly (before the purchase) they may still do it the regular route.

burnaby_sue · ‎12-31-2021

Thanks for your message. I don't have an issue paying taxes that are due as when I go to the store and I pay our BC provincial sales tax of 7% and federal tax of 5 %. I should point out that when buying books only the 5% is applied and with children's clothing there is a sales tax exemption if they are under the age of 14.

The physical receipt is for the Canada Customs office if you want to dispute the duty\import tax on an item when it is exempt. It is never charged separately on a credit card so no proof there.

burnaby_sue · ‎12-31-2021

Thanks for your message. I now see that the return address on the last couple of items I purchased was Erlanger, Kentucky. You said items are bundled with others going to the same country for a more efficient and cheap transit. One of my packages was delivered by DHL which I don't consider a cheap shipping company. The seller already had bids on the item I won so at that point there she would not have been able to relist without using the GSP. I have already made the decision to try to buy as much as possible from sellers located in Canada. However should there be an item on eBay.com that interests me I will think twice about it if the seller is using the GSP. Whatever happened to the time when sellers actually took your package to a US postal station and sent it to Canada First Class International which has a tracking number and insurance on the item?

Thanks for your thoughts

femmefan1946 · ‎12-31-2021

To begin with, yes, it offers very little for buyers.

The Global Shipping Program is a Seller Protection, designed to encourage paranoid US sellers to sell internationally.

The seller is not required to ship any further than ErlangerKY after which the GSP takes all responsibility for delivery.

And when the GSP (or any other freight forwarder ) is in play most of the Money Back Guarantee is not available to the buyer.

BUT

If the GSP was not available, there is a very good chance that (paranoid, xenophobic) seller would not ship to you.

Shipping with GSP (and btw with USPS and CanadaPost and UPS and FedEx) is not a single item. The spoke and hub delivery system is close to universal. If you ever went to Cuba from Vancouver, for example, you would be routed through Toronto by way of Calgary. If you were in Kelowa, that's three stops before you got on Air Cuba. (okay- air canads but...)

I can't follow your numbers (dysnumeric), but the cost of importing from the USA dropped in 2020 when import charges went from $20 duty and tax free to $150 duty-free and $40 tax-free.

GSP charges a ~$5.00 service fee. Canada Post $9.95.

Until that change (which is more complex than that) CBSA took it upon themselves to ignore 93% of low value imports (their numbers!) on the basis that it was too expensive to collect the fees. However, couriers like UPS and Pitney Bowes/GSP did have to charge those import fees.

In any case $11USD ($13.20Cdn) was always too low to attract any import fees and still is.

the cost for Priority Mail to Canada making a total of 34.13US (43.74CAD)

If I were to send this box to Seattle using Canada Post services with a Tracking

Lost again. The cost of shipping via USPS is not related to the cost of shipping via Canada Post. Or for that matter by DeutschPost or Zambia Post or the Hong Kong Post Office.

They all deliver internationally for each other under the auspices of the Universal Postal Union Treaty of 1874. After that is gets complex.

Does anyone know how I can contact the right eBay department to tell the about the Canadian Tariff numbers which would exclude certain items from being charged Import Duties?

There is no reason for there to be any import fees on an $11 item.

There may be a ~$5 service fee, but I'd like to see how that was presented to you.

The seller chose to use GSP , because it is a Seller Protection. She may have been opted in without her knowledge, but GSP dropped the "negative option" about five years ago. Which mostly indicates how often she sells internationally if she doesn't know she is signed up.

femmefan1946 · ‎12-31-2021

The physical receipt is for the Canada Customs office if you want to dispute the duty\import tax on an item when it is exempt. It is never charged separately on a credit card so no proof there.

Sit down.

You are gonna love this.

You didn't pay duty or sales tax.

GSP paid CBSA those.

You paid GSP to pay them. The difference between what you paid GSP and what GSP paid CBSA may be greater or smaller, but it is not your payment. GSP is your agent and dealt with that for you.

So if there is a problem and the purchase needs to be refunded (which is not the situation here) the buyer goes through GSP for the refund and GSP refunds everything... then GSP goes to CBSA and gets their refund of overpaid import fees.

Not you.

And sometimes GSP charges the buyer too much. And sometimes the GSP charges the buyer too little.

Over a year, with thousands, possibly millions of transactions, GSP breaks even (or does a little better or loses a bit. Rounding errors.)

GSP is not to be used by businesses. It is a consumer program.

In theory.... and it takes a bit of a mind slip to get this...

What does the buyer get out of all this?

Well the opportunity to buy from a seller who would not accept non-US buyers.

Did you know US sellers are allowed to Block buyers from Alaska, Hawaii, and the military? Because Hawaii is obviously a small town in Kenya, eh?

Prepaid import fees, so you don't have to pay up on the doorstep, or in these pandemic times, get to the PO to pick up and pay.

And that's about it.

It's a Seller Protection program that offers little to buyers.

fh991586 · ‎01-01-2022

Yes, bundling packages together for exportation is more efficient and cheap for the company that does it. If you can't understand that, then there's no point to try to explain anything else about the GSP, or any logistics related to border crossing. Sending one item oversea will cost you something. Sending a thousand items oversea to the same hub will cost you more overall, but less per item than only one. Just like you get a better price buying an oversize package at Costco than a smaller one at your local convenient store.
After that, GSP decides what other company will do the final delivery based upon the one available for that region and the pricing they get, hence the difference between any purchase you make (Canada Post, DHL, Intelcom, etc.).
I hope you get it now...
P.S. My credit card statement always shows the eBay transaction to the seller and the GSP payment separately.

marnotom! · ‎01-01-2022

@burnaby_sue wrote:

Firstly I have bought a number of Christmas tree ornaments over the past two months. The Tarriff numbers are available to anyone here that wants to check before buying item. The following is the link in regards to my purchase made.
https://www.tariffinder.ca/en/search/import/US/christmas%20tree%20ornament/9505100090

I've only purchased a small handful of items that were forwarded by the GSP and none of them appeared to have a duty calculation in the import charges and I doubt yours did, either. However, without knowing how much you paid for the ornaments and how much you were charged in import charges at the time of the sale, we can't really comment much further on this.

@burnaby_sue wrote:

Thinking of GSP as a forwarding service is crazy. Why would an item travel from Seattle Washington all the way over to the east coast to Kentucky only to be "forwarded" all the way back to the west coast to be delivered in Burnaby BC Canada?

You've just described how a forwarding service works. The sender addresses the items to a central location and from there they're shipped out again after being readdressed.

@burnaby_sue wrote:

Now due to the GSP I would agree with you that the percentage of buyers from Canada has gone down dramactically as many of us would agree the cost is now too expensive especially with the added figure of import charges accumulating on the cost of the item one would purchase. I never get a physical receipt when sellers use the GSP.

Actually, even before the GSP, sales to Canada generally made up a small percentage of sales for US sellers shipping out of the country. I did an informal survey on the US discussion boards about this back in the day. One seller said that Canadian sales had started dropping for them even before the GSP was introduced and attributed that to a significant increase in USPS rates.

@burnaby_sue wrote:

It is obvious you agree with the GSP. Many others don't. We prefer the previous method of shipping by US sellers such as taking a package to their local US post office for shipping. One thing is for sure - it is a lot quicker delivery and more reasonable shipping cost than the GSP..

Like any shipping method, the GSP has it's place. It generally doesn't work so well for most sales to Canada because of our geographical proximity to the United States and the fact that most impediments to trade with the US have been gradually whittled away since the Second World War. But some buyers in other countries actually don't mind it because it bypasses their problematic mail and/or customs systems.

If all of a sudden US sellers started using FedEx Next Day International Delivery for their shipments to Canada, we probably wouldn't say that FedEx Next Day sucked. We'd say that the service was being used inappropriately. Same deal with the GSP. I've only bought a small handful of items where it's being used because I see it used inappropriately for most of the items that I'm interested in. But I've educated myself on the program and I don't get bent out of shape about it.

marnotom! · ‎01-01-2022

@burnaby_sue wrote:

Thanks for your message. I now see that the return address on the last couple of items I purchased was Erlanger, Kentucky. You said items are bundled with others going to the same country for a more efficient and cheap transit. One of my packages was delivered by DHL which I don't consider a cheap shipping company.

It's been a while since I last purchased something forwarded by the GSP, but I've never received anything that way that had a return address in Erlanger; they've all had the Canada Post Gateway facility in Mississauga as the return address. This coupled with the use of DHL is making me wonder if these items were actually sent through eBay's International Standard Delivery system rather than the Global Shipping Program.

International Standard Delivery uses DHL's "Global Mail" service, which doesn't charge import charges up front; they're collected at the time of delivery (or at a post office/outlet) by Canada Post.

Since you're concerned about being charged "duties" when the Global Shipping Program doesn't break down its "import charges" like that, I'm thinking that you may not have had your items forwarded through the GSP. Again, without being able to see the listing(s), we can't give you very good answers here.

patphotog · ‎01-01-2022

How about buying from Canadian seller if you could find the same item home...I always do. American seller could offer international shipment if they choose to...but most of them use GSP...it is more simple for them not so profitable for the buyer...at the end it is your call.

frangitofrangito · ‎04-10-2022

I second that. I had a parcel that was "delivered" on April 5 2022 and apparently Intelcom just left the item outside the building I live in. And of course it was stolen. Trying to get a refund now...

owl3489 · ‎04-10-2022

My GPS experience was an awefully expensive lesson. I bought a few postage stamps at a low price - around $5 CND --- I didn't think the GPS fees would be so exorbitant. I thought it would be more like the 'usual' shipping charges I pay for similar items that I buy from USA, Europe, Asia, and in Canada. Which with combined shipping amounts to about a few dollars. My buys are usually delivered by the Sellers' Postal Service and fully disclosed at completion of sale.

GPS & Silly me. Didn't read the "Fine Print" - GPS charges ended up being +$20 USD for a very low value purchase.

How I refuse to look at items that even sniff of GPS or similar outfits.

lotzofuniquegoodies · ‎04-11-2022

@owl3489 wrote:
My GPS experience was an awefully expensive lesson. I bought a few postage stamps at a low price - around $5 CND --- I didn't think the GPS fees would be so exorbitant. I thought it would be more like the 'usual' shipping charges I pay for similar items that I buy from USA, Europe, Asia, and in Canada. Which with combined shipping amounts to about a few dollars. My buys are usually delivered by the Sellers' Postal Service and fully disclosed at completion of sale.
GPS & Silly me. Didn't read the "Fine Print" - GPS charges ended up being +$20 USD for a very low value purchase.
How I refuse to look at items that even sniff of GPS or similar outfits.

An interesting read below on the perks and perils of the GSP program. Covers all the nuts and bolts. The River uses something called Flex in Australia. It has a variety of horror stories for both customers and drivers. Hope that makes all the Canadian's who've had a nightmare experience feel a smidge better?

https://synder.com/blog/ebay-global-shipping-program/

📌 Note: You can choose one of four options for implementing the eBay Global Shipping Program to your items.

Offer the Global Shipping Program on all new eligible listings.
Offer the Global Shipping Program on any new single listing.
Edit a single existing listing to offer the Global Shipping Program.
Edit multiple existing listings to offer the Global Shipping Program.

The eBay Global Shipping Program Tips

GSP tip #1. You can choose the countries you want to use the eBay Global Shipping Program for. This way you can create a perfect eco-system for you and your customers. (Now if only US sellers would skip Canada. Like what did we ever do to them? 😉 )

GSP tip #2. Keep in mind that all your shipping exclusions apply to eligible listings under the eBay Global Shipping Program.

GSP tip #3. Gain automatic 5-star detailed seller rating for Shipping Cost providing free domestic shipping.

GSP tip #4. Gain automatic 5-star detailed seller rating for Shipping Time uploading tracking information within 1 business day.

GSP tip #5. Specify the package’s weight and dimensions in the listing in advance.

GSP tip #6. Ship the item only after the purchase was made.

-Lotz

coolbluevintage · ‎06-21-2022

its not only bad for buyers because it costs so much and takes so long (literally you wont get anything from global shipping from US to Canada in less then 3-4 weeks) its also bad for the sellers that use it, I have stoped buying anything from sellers that are using global shipping period.... for a 150$ USD item you pay global shipping $45 USD thats just not reasonable and then you have to wait 4 weeks to get it (I get things from over seas faster then this). its another ebay money grab.